In the "News" today.

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

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its bad out there but it wont be any better under labour/lid dems or even ukip. Its going to be worse under another tory government aswell.


#stripesareback

Lord Freud... Oh dear. What a cnut he is.

Iggy wrote:

Some more meat on the bones of the "nearly full employment joke".


But the number of people choosing not to seek work increased.

Those classed as economically inactive, such as students, long-term sick and those retiring early, increased by 113,000 in the quarter to more than nine million.

Wage growth also remained stubbornly below the current 1.2% rate of inflation.

Average weekly earnings in the June-to-August period, excluding bonuses, rose by 0.9% from a year earlier. Including bonuses, earnings rose by 0.7%.

"Real pay continues to drop, carrying on the trend that began six years ago. Weak pay is bad news for household budgets, but also for the levels of income tax receipts and the UK's fiscal position," said Martin Beck, senior economic advisor to the EY ITEM Club.

Shadow work and pensions secretary Rachel Reeves criticised the weak growth in wages. "Wages still well behind inflation. The pay squeeze on working people continues," she tweeted.

Is it any wonder that businesses are flocking to start up with the lowest wages we have seen in decades? This is only OK if you believe that everybody living on a poor wage supported by wonga loans are LUCKY to have the jobs that keep them below the bread line? The bosses that earn huge money topped up by bonuses even if they fail aren't lucky to have a job, we should feel grateful that they don't leave and go and fleece another economy appaza.
We have GP's on over £100k a year but the receptionist who books all the appointments is on £6.35/hr. I'm not for one minute suggesting that receptionists should earn the same as a GP it's just another pointer to in equality that seems to be accepted by people who on the whole aren't earning the minimum wage. It may also have a bearing on why a lot of GP's only tend to work three days a week now.
So far I have yet to meet one person accepting of the minimum wage who actually works for it, what about you Les? You don't need to tell us what you earn but a yes or no to the minimum would be interesting.

In all honesty when I saw the headlines on the news this morning about the unemployment figures and a few MP's and political commentators remarking how impressive they were along with the continued economic growth I just couldn't resist a bit of a wind up. The socialist peoples republic of ATD are so predictably anti anything even fractionally to the right or pro Tory(I dare not even mention UKIP for fear of being nobbled) that I knew I wouldn't even need to bait the hook to get a bite and hey ho it took less than an hour to land comrade Iggy. Sir Francis Trotsky took a little longer to nibble, about 3 hours but that wasn't altogether unexpected as he tends to be more methodical and loves a bit of research before wading in as opposed to Iggy's shoot from the hip approach. I did expect a couple more but maybe I made it a bit too obvious for the likes of Peggy and GreenSam to bite and I should probably be thankful that Hairy, Knecht and Gob are no longer posting, all left loving loony liberals They'd've kicked the shit out of me with their steel toe capped sandals.

Having said all of the above you may find it hard to believe that I have no particular interest in politics, consider myself neither left or right and never vote. I do however find the socialist/class warrior movement on this forum a bit overbearing at times and have held back from expressing opinions on a couple of issues in the certain knowledge that a politically based argument was bound to erupt and today proves that point although this particular spat was manufactured by me. I find that all a bit sad but I suppose the tone of any forum is determined by the majority of its members, or those who shout the loudest.

Regarding Iggy's question about the minimum wage. I'm self employed so my income fluctuates quite a bit, one week may be great and the next two not so great, however overall I can't complain about my annual income and things genuinely do seem to have improved, work and confidence wise over the last 12-18 months to me. I agree for many on the minimun wage it must be a struggle but they're far from being in genuine poverty IMO, to fall into that category I'd say you'd need to be unable to house, clothe and feed yourself and your family, I don't see that unless self inflicted, i.e, fags and beer come before feeding the kids and paying the rent(and before you ask I do live and work in the centre of a large city and I don't walk around with blinkers on).

My philosophy is pretty simple, those in genuine need like the disabled should be given more, those swinging the lead should be given less, those in work should strive to better themselves to the best of their ability and and will hopefully be justly rewarded although I except that's not always the way things pan out, life can be cruel and at times it can seem that those who least deserve it get dealt a shit hand.

The socialist people's republic of ATD, Me, Franny, Peggy and Greensam? Wow,no wonder you are in fear of posting a lot of the time. Lol. Hope you found what you were looking for. xxx

Iggy wrote:

The socialist people's republic of ATD, Me, Franny, Peggy and Greensam? Wow,no wonder you are in fear of posting a lot of the time. Lol. Hope you found what you were looking for. xxx

commies the lot of ya

fwiw its refreshing to have both sides of a story on political matters aslong as it doesnt develop into a personal slagging match

I made Miserable Les happy.

My day is now complete.

Les Miserable wrote:

Iggy wrote:

Some more meat on the bones of the "nearly full employment joke".


But the number of people choosing not to seek work increased.

Those classed as economically inactive, such as students, long-term sick and those retiring early, increased by 113,000 in the quarter to more than nine million.

Wage growth also remained stubbornly below the current 1.2% rate of inflation.

Average weekly earnings in the June-to-August period, excluding bonuses, rose by 0.9% from a year earlier. Including bonuses, earnings rose by 0.7%.

"Real pay continues to drop, carrying on the trend that began six years ago. Weak pay is bad news for household budgets, but also for the levels of income tax receipts and the UK's fiscal position," said Martin Beck, senior economic advisor to the EY ITEM Club.

Shadow work and pensions secretary Rachel Reeves criticised the weak growth in wages. "Wages still well behind inflation. The pay squeeze on working people continues," she tweeted.

Is it any wonder that businesses are flocking to start up with the lowest wages we have seen in decades? This is only OK if you believe that everybody living on a poor wage supported by wonga loans are LUCKY to have the jobs that keep them below the bread line? The bosses that earn huge money topped up by bonuses even if they fail aren't lucky to have a job, we should feel grateful that they don't leave and go and fleece another economy appaza.
We have GP's on over £100k a year but the receptionist who books all the appointments is on £6.35/hr. I'm not for one minute suggesting that receptionists should earn the same as a GP it's just another pointer to in equality that seems to be accepted by people who on the whole aren't earning the minimum wage. It may also have a bearing on why a lot of GP's only tend to work three days a week now.
So far I have yet to meet one person accepting of the minimum wage who actually works for it, what about you Les? You don't need to tell us what you earn but a yes or no to the minimum would be interesting.

In all honesty when I saw the headlines on the news this morning about the unemployment figures and a few MP's and political commentators remarking how impressive they were along with the continued economic growth I just couldn't resist a bit of a wind up. The socialist peoples republic of ATD are so predictably anti anything even fractionally to the right or pro Tory(I dare not even mention UKIP for fear of being nobbled) that I knew I wouldn't even need to bait the hook to get a bite and hey ho it took less than an hour to land comrade Iggy. Sir Francis Trotsky took a little longer to nibble, about 3 hours but that wasn't altogether unexpected as he tends to be more methodical and loves a bit of research before wading in as opposed to Iggy's shoot from the hip approach. I did expect a couple more but maybe I made it a bit too obvious for the likes of Peggy and GreenSam to bite and I should probably be thankful that Hairy, Knecht and Gob are no longer posting, all left loving loony liberals  They'd've kicked the shit out of me with their steel toe capped sandals.

Having said all of the above you may find it hard to believe that I have no particular interest in politics, consider myself neither left or right and never vote. I do however find the socialist/class warrior movement on this forum a bit overbearing at times and have held back from expressing opinions on a couple of issues in the certain knowledge that a politically based argument was bound to erupt and today proves that point although this particular spat was manufactured by me. I find that all a bit sad but I suppose the tone of any forum is determined by the majority of its members, or those who shout the loudest.

Regarding Iggy's question about the minimum wage. I'm self employed so my income fluctuates quite a bit, one week may be great and the next two not so great, however overall I can't complain about my annual income and things genuinely do seem to have improved, work and confidence wise over the last 12-18 months to me. I agree for many on the minimun wage it must be a struggle but they're far from being in genuine poverty IMO, to fall into that category I'd say you'd need to be unable to house, clothe and feed yourself and your family, I don't see that unless self inflicted, i.e, fags and beer come before feeding the kids and paying the rent(and before you ask I do live and work in the centre of a large city and I don't walk around with blinkers on).

My philosophy is pretty simple, those in genuine need like the disabled should be given more, those swinging the lead should be given less, those in work should strive to better themselves to the best of their ability and and will hopefully be justly rewarded although I except that's not always the way things pan out, life can be cruel and at times it can seem that those who least deserve it get dealt a shit hand.

It's wierd. On occasion, the measure of a really good post is when it doesn't really provoke a meaningful retort.

This one falls into that category.

I used to do a minimum wage job, and there was nothing left at the end of the month after rent, bills and food. I wasn't a smoker or a drinker, as much as I'd love to have been. I had no dependents whatsoever - how people support families when they're on MW is beyond me. I guess you'd have to live in a mansion rent-free, á la Mr Duncan Smith.

Czarcasm wrote:

Les Miserable wrote:

Iggy wrote:

Some more meat on the bones of the "nearly full employment joke".


But the number of people choosing not to seek work increased.

Those classed as economically inactive, such as students, long-term sick and those retiring early, increased by 113,000 in the quarter to more than nine million.

Wage growth also remained stubbornly below the current 1.2% rate of inflation.

Average weekly earnings in the June-to-August period, excluding bonuses, rose by 0.9% from a year earlier. Including bonuses, earnings rose by 0.7%.

"Real pay continues to drop, carrying on the trend that began six years ago. Weak pay is bad news for household budgets, but also for the levels of income tax receipts and the UK's fiscal position," said Martin Beck, senior economic advisor to the EY ITEM Club.

Shadow work and pensions secretary Rachel Reeves criticised the weak growth in wages. "Wages still well behind inflation. The pay squeeze on working people continues," she tweeted.

Is it any wonder that businesses are flocking to start up with the lowest wages we have seen in decades? This is only OK if you believe that everybody living on a poor wage supported by wonga loans are LUCKY to have the jobs that keep them below the bread line? The bosses that earn huge money topped up by bonuses even if they fail aren't lucky to have a job, we should feel grateful that they don't leave and go and fleece another economy appaza.
We have GP's on over £100k a year but the receptionist who books all the appointments is on £6.35/hr. I'm not for one minute suggesting that receptionists should earn the same as a GP it's just another pointer to in equality that seems to be accepted by people who on the whole aren't earning the minimum wage. It may also have a bearing on why a lot of GP's only tend to work three days a week now.
So far I have yet to meet one person accepting of the minimum wage who actually works for it, what about you Les? You don't need to tell us what you earn but a yes or no to the minimum would be interesting.

In all honesty when I saw the headlines on the news this morning about the unemployment figures and a few MP's and political commentators remarking how impressive they were along with the continued economic growth I just couldn't resist a bit of a wind up. The socialist peoples republic of ATD are so predictably anti anything even fractionally to the right or pro Tory(I dare not even mention UKIP for fear of being nobbled) that I knew I wouldn't even need to bait the hook to get a bite and hey ho it took less than an hour to land comrade Iggy. Sir Francis Trotsky took a little longer to nibble, about 3 hours but that wasn't altogether unexpected as he tends to be more methodical and loves a bit of research before wading in as opposed to Iggy's shoot from the hip approach. I did expect a couple more but maybe I made it a bit too obvious for the likes of Peggy and GreenSam to bite and I should probably be thankful that Hairy, Knecht and Gob are no longer posting, all left loving loony liberals  They'd've kicked the shit out of me with their steel toe capped sandals.

Having said all of the above you may find it hard to believe that I have no particular interest in politics, consider myself neither left or right and never vote. I do however find the socialist/class warrior movement on this forum a bit overbearing at times and have held back from expressing opinions on a couple of issues in the certain knowledge that a politically based argument was bound to erupt and today proves that point although this particular spat was manufactured by me. I find that all a bit sad but I suppose the tone of any forum is determined by the majority of its members, or those who shout the loudest.

Regarding Iggy's question about the minimum wage. I'm self employed so my income fluctuates quite a bit, one week may be great and the next two not so great, however overall I can't complain about my annual income and things genuinely do seem to have improved, work and confidence wise over the last 12-18 months to me. I agree for many on the minimun wage it must be a struggle but they're far from being in genuine poverty IMO, to fall into that category I'd say you'd need to be unable to house, clothe and feed yourself and your family, I don't see that unless self inflicted, i.e, fags and beer come before feeding the kids and paying the rent(and before you ask I do live and work in the centre of a large city and I don't walk around with blinkers on).

My philosophy is pretty simple, those in genuine need like the disabled should be given more, those swinging the lead should be given less, those in work should strive to better themselves to the best of their ability and and will hopefully be justly rewarded although I except that's not always the way things pan out, life can be cruel and at times it can seem that those who least deserve it get dealt a shit hand.

It's wierd. On occasion, the measure of a really good post is when it doesn't really provoke a meaningful retort.  

This one falls into that category.

Agreed.

As it broadly agrees with my pov I am happy to leave the field victorious.

Horrendous crimes on an industrial scale  that continue to be covered up by council officials, social services & the Police.

How many more Oxfords, Rochdales or Rotherhams do we need to uncover before this outrage is tackled in a way we should all expect of a developed country ?


Edited :- Guardian have pulled the story from their website for some reason, hence the link to a different site

Iggy wrote:

Ah shit, I bleddy agree with my pal Les and I've agreed to leave the field covered in horseshit*

*Slightly edited in the interest of fair play

FY 310 wrote:

Horrendous crimes on an industrial scale  that continue to be covered up by council officials, social services & the Police.

How many more Oxfords, Rochdales or Rotherhams do we need to uncover before this outrage is tackled in a way we should all expect of a developed country ?


Edited :- Guardian have pulled the story from their website for some reason, hence the link to a different site

We always used to give thanks for our free press, now it seems they have a lot of different angles other than unbiased reporting. The massive over reactment post Saville is the embarrassment of the press and the establishment at being found out covering up for celebs.

Phone tapping ended all that.

Damage to plants or fun police in action?
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Iggy wrote:

Damage to plants or fun police in action?
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I somewhat hazily recall being at a rave in a huge barn somewhere in the South Hams in the summer of 1990. At about 5-6am we had to shut everything down and kill the music for about 5 minutes as a herd of cows were being walked past. Farmer didn't want them spooked just prior to milking.

My childhood hero is a thug.

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Unbelievable ! When will this nightmare end.

"Eurostat arrived at the €2.1bn figure on the basis of new methods of calculating member states’ GNI since 1995, taking account of previously unreported or under-reported black economy elements, such as drug dealing and consumption or the sex industry." WTF !!!

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You couldn't make it up could you? Income from drug dealing? Are they suggesting that MPs or our economy somehow benefit from the black market in drugs? Surely that is the whole problem with prohibition (as the yanks found out in the thirties) that the people involved don't pay tax, there is no real benefit other than to the criminals who indulge in the business.

Britain Out!!!

Britain in. From where I am, London and Brussels are two large cities hundreds of miles to the north-east, and only one of them takes Cornwall seriously. It seems like every other piece of major infrastructure is funded by the EU's Objective One scheme. Thank Christ Brussels stands up for us.

Is Cornwall part of Britain ?

Iggy wrote:

You couldn't make it up could you? Income from drug dealing? Are they suggesting that MPs or our economy somehow benefit from the black market in drugs? Surely that is the whole problem with prohibition (as the yanks found out in the thirties) that the people involved don't pay tax, there is no real benefit other than to the criminals who indulge in the business.

It's not as daft as it sounds. GDP is a measure of the total money spent in an economy. Plenty is spent on sex and drugs (and not just here) so why shouldn't it be included? God knows how they estimate the sums involved though. Apparently sewage gets tested for the concentration of the metabolites of certain drugs. I suppose once a concentration is known then the amount consumed can be estimated and a street price then factored in.

And it isn't just the criminals that benefit because they will spend at least some of their ill-gotten gains on legit stuff so those trading in whatever they buy benefit from their spending and then they spend that money somewhere else and so on.

Just watching Breakfast news now.

Apparently this extra charge is due because the GDP, as measured by our very own Office Of National Statistics, is larger than was predicted.

The ONS flagged that there would be extra to pay months ago so if Cameron genuinely didn't know then either he was told and forgot, not told at all (but Osborne would have known all about it) or ignored what he was told. None of those options are great, are they?

And if our GDP was lower than expected would anybody complain about us being given €2m?

The red-faced, lecturn-thumping faux outrage is a sham and embarrasses us as a country.

It is just a side show to distract us from the dire state of our finances.