An interesting discussion

I went to Lewes on Saturday for non-league day. A pint of local ale on the terraces in a nice atmosphere. I could get used to that. ALthough a bizarre quirk of the ongoing criminalisation of people purely because they watch football is that should Lewes get promoted this season if I stood on the terraces with a pint in August next year it would be illegal.

You can't be too careful: Lewes were playing the Metropolitan Police.

I'd rather watch a decent game of local club rugby these days. Beer in hand compulsory. 

greensleeves wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Three course meals are a thing of the past. Now it's a buffet with a choice of Thai chicken curry or lasagne. I went for the lasagne because I didn't fancy the foreign muck.

Do you remember all the fuss when Shepherd's Pie got served? This doesn't seem much different but not a peep anywhere.

If was doing a spot of corporate schmoozing I'd expect rather more than that.

As a corporate regular I now feel like Oliver Twist going up with my plate to be served my meal.Its not ideal at all and several others on our table were pretty pissed off as well.I can assure you SFD that a few complaints,not peeps,were made.

Lasagne and Thai curry really isn't up to snuff even when accompanied by a couple of boiled spuds and a bit of greenery, is it? I suppose the self-service means that a host of waiting staff are no longer needed meaning a cut in the wage bill. Profits maximised. Job done. Nice one.

And there, literally on a plate, you have a metaphor for what Brent has only just begun to do to the club. Over-priced food, not quite fit for purpose at any price actually, and self-service to boot leaving a, metaphorical this time, nasty taste in the mouth.

Incredible, again quite literally, value at only £1000 per season.

(And I don't give a toss if £1000 is a bit out so don't bother quibbling with me about it.)

"Ever get the feeling that you've been had?"

Spuds with lasagne is an awful lot of carbs (or something) ...

I seem to remember Lincoln City having really nice supporters' bar / social club thingy attached to their ground.

Tringreen wrote:

I'd rather watch a decent game of local club rugby these days. Beer in hand compulsory. 

Albion on sky this Sunday live from Exeter at 13.15

This is what Graham Clarke has just posted on pasoti. I hope he doesn't object to me re-posting it in full.

"I make no apologies for returning to this subject. With planning permission for the HHP development about to be formally granted there will no doubt be an understandable fanfare about the beginning of a new era for the football club and how the completion of the Home Park stadium will play a major part in putting the finances of the football club on a more sustainable footing with its subsequent contribution to improved revenue streams.

Since I raised the issue, and in particular the possibility of a supporter's bar, it has been picked up by the PASB and AFT but I have heard nothing positive that reassures me that an unrestricted access supporters bar will be incorporated in the grandstand (or any other part of the Home Park stadium for that matter). By unrestricted I mean access without entry into the ground through a turnstile.

Yesterday I was at a conference at Sandy Park. I was able, after the event, to tour the facilities on offer and ask some pertinent questions to those who play a major part in running the Sandy Park facilities. In answer to the question of how much the venue contributed in profit to the Exeter Chiefs Rugby Club I was told it was in excess of £500,000 a year (they did not want to be more precise). I was told that they had in excess of 220 diners per game on a match day package costing £120. The also have a large number of Gold Members who pay £3,000 per year for their package. The also have a separate a Members Bar. holding around 250. On site they have 11 bars, the biggest of which is based in the piazza area outside the main entrance to the ground. The average spend per person from these bars is £8 in addition to whatever match day package they have. This is a key figure for me as it illustrates what additional revenue could be obtained outside of the corporate facilities on offer within the new grandstand by the inclusion of a supporter's bar to replace the on site facilities offered by the former Far Post Club and the soon to be defunct Pyramid Suite.

Their aim was to provide facilities for use 3 hours before the game and 3 hours after it (as well as during as they are allowed to drink in certain areas whilst watching the game). It was a very impressive example of how to drive up revenues and keep them within the club to keep the club going forward on a sustainable basis. The premium pricing to reflect the club's position as one of the nation's top rugby clubs (and now a Rugby World Cup venue) is clearly way outside of anything Argyle can reasonably expect to achieve. All the more important, therefore, the club try and secure the spend of the supporter's attending the game rather than allow that revenue to be generated elsewhere. I sincerely hope this remains the focus of attention of the PASB and AFT."

Very interesting information again from Graham. It again calls into question the figures of £1M - £2M that have been bandied about by Akkeron.

What I find just as disappointing is the lack of debate or comment both on here and on Pasoti. ATD seems to be disappearing under ancient bumped threads. Interesting they may be but for me this is much more important. While Graham's comments on Pasoti are hiding in a sub forum I don't suppose they'll get much response there either.

I agree with a lot that you are saying Richard but this subject does and is getting discussed, it's getting a little like banging your head against a brick wall with information from Akkeron rarer than a home win. Akkeron are going to say as little as possible about the match day revenue streams because they know they have been sold down the river with the enabling development. In a minute the build will start and it will be too late, what are the answers? You tell me.

I know what you mean Richard but what Graham has posted has already been discussed on here and to a man I believe that everyone on here doesn't believe for one minute that there will be an adequate supporters bar incorporated in the plans, or that the increased income from the development will make anything like the figures bandied around by Brent.

So what can be done about it? The planning permission has now been officially granted I've just been e-mailed so it's pretty much down to the AFT or, don't snigger,the PASB to fight for it.

There is a reason why it's in a little sub forum under a heading of the new grandstand which is to deter people from looking there who don't want to keep reading about the capacity, the income figures etc.etc.

The powers that be have declared that it's a brilliant thing for the club and for the city. The major players who might have been able to kick up enough stink about it aren't bothered one bit if the only bar incorporated in the plans is an elitist members only bar only accessible from the new grandstand. In fact they will probably be hoping that this is the case rather than risk bumping into some fans who are mere unwashed mortals.

Maybe the fans groups will have good news shortly? I wouldn't hold my breath though.

So now the fan fest dwellers who backed JB to the hilt are being betrayed by the reluctant bidder who refuses them a venue for their "fests".
The irony is astounding

punchdrunk wrote:

So now the fan fest dwellers who backed JB to the hilt are being betrayed by the reluctant bidder who refuses them a venue for their "fests".
The irony is astounding

Maybe brent thinks like most of us those fests are embarrassing to all fans, portraying the stereotypical image of janners, as abit backwards,
Brent doesn't want his hotel and what ever hes building customers to be put off going there by the backwardest of janner

Davidfriio4 wrote:

punchdrunk wrote:

So now the fan fest dwellers who backed JB to the hilt are being betrayed by the reluctant bidder who refuses them a venue for their "fests".
The irony is astounding

Maybe brent thinks like most of us those fests are embarrassing to all fans, portraying the stereotypical image of janners, as abit backwards,
Brent doesn't want his hotel and what ever hes building customers to be put off going there by the backwardest of janner

Dont get me wrong,those fan-fests are not my cup tea to put it mildly  .

It has however turned round to bite the Aviva festers firmly on their buttocks, all that hero worshipping of JB, Nickkkkkkkkkkkk Nool and Webb, the antics of Brenton Abbey, Jameson etc,everything that used to go on in the Pyramid suite.
Where are the Aviva fest,s going to go now that Jimmy boy is refusing point blank to put in a supporters bar ? not that it will worry the fat controller and his chums as they will be tucked away up in the corporate bar, behind the corporate shelf that can only be accessed by corporate fans.
I suppose the Green Taverners could pay top dollar to hire the restaurant suite in the seven storey hotel, but im not sure the hotel users would enjoy the Janner song as they sit down for their Saturday lunch, likewise with the Icerink, maybe they could Squeeze into Nandos or McDonalds ?!! 
James Brent is such a nice guy isn't he!!!

Punchie,

have you seen something I haven't? Your stating that JB is refusing point blank to put in a supporters bar. I haven't read that anywhere. As for the fansfests, I wouldn't have expected them to be in a supporters club in the first place. Music and comedy isn't going to mix very well with fans watching the lunch time match, while having something to eat and a chat to friends. As someone has said before, 2 venues are required. I wouldn't bet against somewhere being found for the fansfests either.

punchdrunk wrote:

Davidfriio4 wrote:

punchdrunk wrote:

So now the fan fest dwellers who backed JB to the hilt are being betrayed by the reluctant bidder who refuses them a venue for their "fests".
The irony is astounding

Maybe brent thinks like most of us those fests are embarrassing to all fans, portraying the stereotypical image of janners, as abit backwards,
Brent doesn't want his hotel and what ever hes building customers to be put off going there by the backwardest of janner

Dont get me wrong,those fan-fests are not my cup tea to put it mildly  .

It has however turned round to bite the Aviva festers firmly on their buttocks, all that hero worshipping of JB, Nickkkkkkkkkkkk Nool and Webb, the antics of Brenton Abbey, Jameson etc,everything that used to go on in the Pyramid suite.
Where are the Aviva fest,s going to go now that Jimmy boy is refusing point blank to put in a supporters bar ? not that it will worry the fat controller and his chums as they will be tucked away up in the corporate bar, behind the corporate shelf that can only be accessed by corporate fans.
I suppose the Green Taverners could pay top dollar to hire the restaurant suite in the seven storey hotel, but im not sure the hotel users would enjoy the Janner song as they sit down for their Saturday lunch, likewise with the Icerink, maybe they could Squeeze into Nandos or McDonalds ?!! 
James Brent is such a nice guy isn't he!!!

I hope they are not allowed to run these shite fests anywhere on home park,
that Forza thing they got on in Devonport is shite
I hope that these activities die a slow and painfull death.

I don't like heavy rock, dudes, but I wouldn't want to stop anyone listening. There are lots of performances I wouldn't want to attend - Jim Davidson for example - but if that's what people want, that's up to them. The fans fests are popular - why not provide a space for them? Who knows, they may over time develop into a venue for evening entertainment. A jazz club, for example, and that would be nice.

knecht wrote:

I don't like heavy rock, dudes, but I wouldn't want to stop anyone listening. There are lots of performances I wouldn't want to attend - Jim Davidson for example - but if that's what people want, that's up to them. The fans fests are popular - why not provide a space for them? Who knows, they may over time develop into a venue for evening entertainment. A jazz club, for example, and that would be nice.

I can't see how, looks and sounds like same crap every week,
the idea is very tired, maybe its the humaine thing to do to kill them off

Czarcasm wrote:

Piles Husain ..... one of the giants that even non-jazz aficionados have heard of. A bit like Louis Armstrong, Ella Fitzgerald and Nils Benutti. If any of those - particularly Husain - were booked for a fans fest, I would certainly go! He's really nice.

Davidfriio4 wrote:

knecht wrote:

I don't like heavy rock, dudes, but I wouldn't want to stop anyone listening. There are lots of performances I wouldn't want to attend - Jim Davidson for example - but if that's what people want, that's up to them. The fans fests are popular - why not provide a space for them? Who knows, they may over time develop into a venue for evening entertainment. A jazz club, for example, and that would be nice.

I can't see how, looks and sounds like same crap every week,
the idea is very tired, maybe its the humaine thing to do to kill them off

How often have you been?

I have it on good authority that Rick & Dave are stepping down not because they've had enough but because they've been booked to appear on a run at The Sands.

Richard Blight wrote:

Punchie,

have you seen something I haven't? Your stating that JB is refusing point blank to put in a supporters bar. I haven't read that anywhere. As for the fansfests, I wouldn't have expected them to be in a supporters club in the first place. Music and comedy isn't going to mix very well with fans watching the lunch time match, while having something to eat and a chat to friends. As someone has said before, 2 venues are required. I wouldn't bet against somewhere being found for the fansfests either.

Richard do you not think that if there were to be a supporters bar incorporated that messrs Newell and Webb would be shouting from the rooftops about it? PL2 Faced would be creaming his piss-stained y-fronts and starting thread after thread on Pasoti, some of them even from his real account, about how James Brent had listened and was the best football club owner ever.

I reckon that Graham Clark knows this too and every time he posts about the lack of a bar it is shaming Brent and his henchmen. There is nothing that they can come back with to dispute Graham's posts so even fatty is not stupid enough to challenge the concerns.

Forgive me for being a bit thick on these matters but if planning permission has now been granted then would the plans be allowed to be changed to incorporate a large supporters bar? I can't see Lord Tightwad laying out further money if the plans have already gone through.

Jock,

the planning application mainly covers what the building is going to be used for, how big it is, the position, landscaping etc. etc. What the inside of the building looks like or how it is used is not quite so important, as long as it meets building regs. health and safety regs. etc. etc. You can't for example build something with planning permission for a restaurant and then build living accommodation instead.

Argyle have planning permission that includes space for hospitality. Now whether that hospitality is totally corporate or part corporate and part hospitality for ordinary fans isn't really that important. If the conference / hospitality area is built with movable sliding walls the various areas could be one big conference hall. Or two smaller conference halls. One smaller conference hall and the other split into smaller again meeting rooms. Or other various options. Just because the original plans showed the vast majority of that space as corporate hospitality doesn't mean that it has to stay like that. The corporate area on matchdays could be say 300 people and the other 300 spaces a supporters bar. There is no difference in planning between people paying £50 for a 3 course meal in the corporate area and people paying £6.50 for burger and chips in the ordinary fans area.

If fans want a supporters bar they have to say so and loudly! The "what's the point, they've already made their minds up" attitude; although totally understandable, will get us absolutely nowhere. You may well be right but until I hear differently I'll keep asking the same questions along with Graham. I'm also asking on behalf of ex Far Post members who don't have computers. I've told them to write to the club, the more people who write, whether on internet websites or in writing the better. If fans don't ask / tell the club what THEY want, they won't get it.

We probably won't anyway but if we don't ask we definitely won't.

The access to the corporate area on the first floor is via shelf turnstiles or corporate reception.

Once the dust has settled, they'll pitch the best seats as "uberfan" membership with corporate nosebag and Green++ membership for wing seats on the shelf with exclusive members bar access.

The fans fest marquee will get pitched on Love Field or in front of the Life Centre to appease the masses.

Agreed GG, also Brent has recently said to the pasb that the retail units will provide for the enabler, no news there then, the other thing they talk about is TOR, meanwhile the build will go ahead and nothing will change, Brent doesn't do change, his way or the highway.

Thanks Richard I wasn't sure how it worked.

The AFT won't rock the boat in my opinion, because if they do they'll be ignored by the club and blasted by fuckwits like X-isle and Postey who spunk their trousers just thinking about the ministand and worship the ground Brent walks on. The PASB will be divided about it and will schedule a meeting about it for dreckly.

I agree people should make as much noise as possible. Harass Webb, he's the club president after all, phone the club, write to the club and if Brent keeps ignoring the issue then boycott a game or plan a protest for when the tv cameras are there for the pompey game.

Don't shave until it's resolved, that could make the world of difference!

Anything that hurts Brent in the pocket would be my suggestion, amazing how quickly people see your point of view when it's costing you money.

Maybe the GT'S could ask for their loan back?

The trouble is how do you hurt Teflon Jim though Jock? You can't hurt him by withdrawing support from the club, he may have to lend the club more money but he personally will see that money back. JB is a real clever cnut, you have to hand him that, he asset stripped the club quickly and cleanly and if PAFC went bust tomorrow he could still walk away being quids in.