Argyle at Wembley

Well over 30k when we beat Darlington 1 - 0 under Warnock in '96.

If we make the play offs in a couple of years, I think the development of the ground will be pivotal in the attendance figure.

Brent's boxed in mini stand or no development at all 20 -25k.

A proper grandstand with resultant feelgood factor 30k plus again.

Here's what they think on the farm.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Gawd ! This club does seem to have a monopoly on dimwits.

Tringreen wrote:

Well over 30k when we beat Darlington 1 - 0 under Warnock in '96.

If we make the play offs in a couple of years, I think the development of the ground will be pivotal in the attendance figure.

Brent's boxed in mini stand or no development at all 20 -25k.

A proper grandstand with resultant feelgood factor 30k plus again.

Here's what they think on the farm.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I had to laugh when Webb refers to anyone other then the core 6,000 as "plastics", top stuff once again from our esteemed President trying to entice the stayaways back to HP anytime in the future.
The guy is a grade A muppet.

A Gerald Ratner sales pitch if ever there was. One mans plastic is anothers future customer. Parochial, small minded prat.

Steve

It's all about 'being someone' for the likes of the windsor boys

I mean, with a boxed in, futureless mini stand, a non investing owner who wants the fans to pay for everything, who in their right mind would travel around the country to watch going nowhere, crap football at crap grounds, other than easily amused dimwits ?

Well call me plastic then cos due to work and, y'know, having a wife and 2 kids to support I haven't been able to afford to go to HP for a year or so now. Sorry Mr Webb I shall go off and support Spurs now

There was about 39000 fans at Wembley that day made up of roughly 30000 from Argyle and 9000 from Darlington.

That's why Darlington were ruined by having a 25000 capacity stadium they could never hope to fill.

That's why I think we are in the process of being ruined by limiting the stadium capacity to 17000.

We're busting a gut trying to get Brent to see the folly of his plans and for the hope of one day being able to increase capacity to 20000 and even that is 5000, minimum, too small!

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

There was about 39000 fans at Wembley that day made up of roughly 30000 from Argyle and 9000 from Darlington.

That's why Darlington were ruined by having a 25000 capacity stadium they could never hope to fill.

That's why I think we are in the process of being ruined by limiting the stadium capacity to 17000.

We're busting a gut trying to get Brent to see the folly of his plans and for the hope of one day being able to increase capacity to 20000 and even that is 5000, minimum, too small!

And what makes it worse is that the likes of Newell, Webb, Jones, De Lar are helping him.

If they were to think of a bigger future instead of feathering their own nests, Brent's plans would have little or no support from anywhere.

They will never be forgiven if this goes ahead.

Sorry there was 43431 that day at Wembley.

Make that 34000 Argyle fans not 30000.

It's funny how the 9000 for Darlington has stuck in my memory but it may be wrong.

The general point I was making remains.

Brent doesn't "want" to change his mind, it doesn't fit in with his development and profit plans.

There is only way to prevent this and that is to be very vocal indeed, lobby Councillors and write to MP's and let them know that it's very large majority that would be very angry if any of it gets the go ahead. I do think that the message is being delivered but the pressure must not stop.

i have said it before and i'll keep saying it till someone at the club sees it and hammers it home to Brent (as if) if James builds the stand as it is BUT allows the construction to be accomodate future developments to add more seats if required then fantastic if not this stand must be stopped at all costs until it is. Adding a few seats in the existing stand to take it up to 20,500 is a cop out! the overall final capacity home park could hold once all develoments are completed new stand included should be no less than 25,000.

Do you think brenty was at wembley that day, i know eeh bleeds green

He was at home watching the cricket but I have it on very good authority that his lip was quivering.

GOB wrote:

He was at home watching the cricket but I have it on very good authority that his lip was quivering.

The official attendance of 43,431 was a record for a play-off final at that level, beating the previous record set in 1994,[11] until it was bettered a year later by 3,373 spectators.[12] There was also a significant disparity in the number of tickets sold to the supporters of the two clubs, with fewer than 10,000 Darlington fans in attendance compared to 35,000 fans representing Plymouth Argyle.[13][14]

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Sorry there was 43431 that day at Wembley.

Make that 34000 Argyle fans not 30000.

It's funny how the 9000 for Darlington has stuck in my memory but it may be wrong.

The general point I was making remains.

On Pasoti it's now claimed that a large number of people with Argyle tickets that day weren't even Argyle fans but just people there for the day out? They spent a feckin lot on green wigs and replica shirts for their day out then.

GOB wrote:

He was at home watching the cricket but I have it on very good authority that his lip was quivering.

No fecking surprise the way England batted in the first innings.

GOB wrote:

Brent doesn't "want" to change his mind, it doesn't fit in with his development and profit plans.

There is only way to prevent this and that is to be very vocal indeed, lobby Councillors and write to MP's and let them know that it's very large majority that would be very angry if any of it gets the go ahead. I do think that the message is being delivered but the pressure must not stop.

The only problem with that is there is blatantly a councillor giving out private correspondence to Newell or a friend of his.

This point should be looked into because surely a Plymouth resident with concerns who writes to his local councillor should be afforded confidentially and not having his or her correspondence discussed by third parties and ridiculed.

Someone should be grilling Soper and Newell on where they got the info. Not that it would last more than thirty seconds on the farm.

Tringreen wrote:

It's all about 'being someone' for the likes of the windsor boys

I mean, with a boxed in, futureless mini stand, a non investing owner who wants the fans to pay for everything, who in their right mind would travel around the country to watch going nowhere, crap football at crap grounds, other than easily amused dimwits ?

Unfortunately, the game attracts a certain percentage of people who are nobodies in their own walk of life and want to become somebodies through football. So said Brian Clough, although he was talking about directors not associate directors and presidents.

If you look at the crowds for that season it was less than we get now until the playoffs were there. Most of the people who went to Wembley were there jumping on the bandwagon the same as happens when Argyle play a big club in the cup. Not that we get that far these days. Bloke next to me at the Everton game asked me who the No.11 was, then the No.7 and then the Keeper. At the third question I told him to buy a fecking programme or turn up more often. If we ever manage another day out at Wembley then no doubt, like Yeovil tomorrow, thousands will turn up chanting as if they've all been going for years. I would suspect the Argyle contingent would be much the same as it was the last time new stand or not.

So what?

The word "potential" is often bandied about and that is a genuine, counted, verifiable measure of our potential. The problem we have is realising that potential. What you, and the club, seem to be suggesting is that we may as well not even try to realise it.

Obviously crowds of that magnitude will only be there for the big occasion but the onus is on the club to supply those big occasions to us that will attract those 34000 fans back regularly instead of just for a one-off.

What is fair to suggest is that we'll only match that 34000 at Wembley. Some of them, maybe even many of them, will never be enticed to attend Home Park but surely we should be able to get half of them, at least, to attend? Add to that an allowance for away support. Add to that seats lost due to segregation. No matter how you look at it 17000 seats are too few seats if Argyle is to enjoy any level of success at all. 25000 is more like it.

So the obvious conclusion is that the club is not planning to be successful by not even allowing the option to expand if that unlikely success materialises in the future. Argyle will continue to fail because it is not planning for, or even allowing for, a plan that leads to success.

To use Richard Blight's words from the other day that saddens and angers me. Why shouldn't we raise merry hell in objection to it?

I'm not saying they shouldn't turn up for a one off match SFD. As far as I'm concerned anyone can go watch at anytime. What I'm suggesting is that if Argyle got to Wembley again the size of the new stand if it is only 17000 in the end would not make a difference to the number of one off visitors at all. Whether the new stand should be bigger or better is a completely different argument to a Wembley attendance.

Did you read the bit about "genuine, counted, verifiable measure of our potential"?

Of course it has relevance.

How can it not be relevant?

That season I attended the odd away game, and every home game including the Colchester play off where we were all singing que sera sera and the Wembley thing.
I must be the ONLY fan who went to every home game that season and did not go to Wembley. I listened to a certain G Sparks on the radio.... it was quite a new thing those days.
My reason ? I had always disagreed with minor games being played at Wembley, and had vowed I would never go to see an Argyle game there that was not the FA Cup final. I tend to stick to my vows, although I might have relented if we had beaten Man City in the League Cup semi 20 years previously when the Wembley thing had not been devalued so much. Funny old game.

I know a few people who actually went to the Odd Wheel that afternoon.

"Que sera sera
whatever will be will be
we're going to Wembury..."

I guess Argyle have 34000 fans or so as that's how many turned up at Wembley when there would still have been room for plenty more.

If we reached the league 1 play-offs I don't think it would be many more, but come the championship play-offs the other side would also sell a similar amount so maybe 40,000 would go then?

As it is now there are probably only around 15,000 who are attending fans. Some go to the odd home game, some to only away games due to location, and there are the 5,000 or so who go no matter what to home games.

Obviously the die-hard 5,000 are the most loyal and deserved to be looked after, but the trick is persuading the ones who go to a few games and maybe buy a white membership to go more regularly throughout the season, and somehow persuade the one's who have become disinterested and won't pay good money to watch bottom of division 4 football after years of relegation and turmoil.

The obvious answer is the team needs to win more. It's not rocket science working out that more will come if the team is winning and that's where investment comes in. James Brent has seen biggish crowds for the local derbies even though we're struggling and fighting relegation again.

Pay for better players and it will pay for itself through bigger crowds, or at least in theory it should.

That's the case everywhere though. If it were as easy as just putting an extra £500k or so to guarantee much higher crowds then everyone would be at it.

I've been one of the loyal fans who go to every game, and a white member through not having the time off work to go every fortnight, and someone who picked and choosed games when frankly I couldn't justify paying out to watch rubbish week in week out.

Now I go to a few away games because of location but if I still lived in Cornwall I would go occasionally when my mates were going due to the cost and because watching awful football and losing most weeks wears you down.

Chris Webb calling fans plastics again today is stupid really, because when he's asked to drum up support he wants everyone to come along and cheer the side to safety. Hypocrisy at its worst.

Argyle need every possible fan/supporter/customer through the turnstiles as possible right now and not some club official slagging them off like he's done to EJH and calling people plastics.

Chris Webb's mantra seems to be that he's loyal and anyone not as loyal as him isn't important. He often says things like "In years to come these days will be all the sweeter because you can turn round and say I was at Accrington" or wherever.

Yes Chris Webb and Ian Newell are brilliant for going to every game blah, blah, blah, but their support is guaranteed now. It's the missing thousands, the casual fan or the family man who has enough for one luxury a week maybe who needs persuading that going to home park is a better day out than going to the cinema or having a meal out, yet I get the distinct impression that these people are happier with 6,000 at the game than 12,000 so they can boast about how loyal they are.

Instead of calling people plastics and insulting them for disagreeing with the HHP plans, just as Peter Jones also did, they should be telling James Brent that he needs to attract these fans and that will be by investing in the team and giving them some hope of promotional rather than revelling in a 21st placed finish.

How he is club president is beyond me, and with his partner abusing anyone who disagrees with him on a daily basis it's a wonder crowds are even as good as they have been.

Still what do I know? I'm just a plastic.