Argyle at Wembley

The all important factor in hooking the potential fanbase are clear statements of ambition. The Stapleton regime was the last in a long line to fail miserably to inspire.For a club with no top flight history there simply has to be a reason to believe. The hardcore 5k can't seem to understand that all clubs are /were the same. The wider fanbase need a sign and Argyle have always failed to provide a reason to believe.

Plymouth remains the largest city club never to experience top flight football with the resultant increase in hooked fanbase. The likes of Norwich and Southampton achieved this 40 years ago when previously we were on a par with them, support wise.
Now we have the likes of Reading, Swansea, Cardiff joining the party. It could just as easily be us.

Hull were the previous biggest city club never to have got the T shirt. They got a decent stadium which demonstrated ambition. The attendances increased with the feelgood/ feel proud factor and the rest, as they say, is history.

Us oldies can remember our grandparents muttering, 'Same old Argo', referring to the lack of ambition and investment at crucial times. 'They don't want to go up', was another.

If Brent really 'gets it', he would take on board these facts and build for a brighter future for the football club. He won't.

Clearly, he and others have other agendas and they will never be forgiven, no matter how many lower league matches they attend.

Very sad.

Apologies to those who have heard it all before, hundreds of times.

Tringreen wrote:

The all important factor in hooking the potential fanbase are clear statements of ambition. The Stapleton regime was the last in a long line to fail miserably to inspire.For a club with no top flight history there simply has to be a reason to believe. The hardcore 5k can't seem to understand that all clubs are /were the same. The wider fanbase need a sign and Argyle have always failed to provide a reason to believe.

Plymouth remains the largest city club never to experience top flight football with the resultant increase in hooked fanbase. The likes of Norwich and Southampton achieved this 40 years ago when previously we were on a par with them, support wise.
Now we have the likes of Reading, Swansea, Cardiff joining the party. It could just as easily be us.

Hull were the previous biggest city club never to have got the T shirt. They got a decent stadium which demonstrated ambition. The attendances increased with the feelgood/ feel proud factor and the rest, as they say, is history.

Us oldies can remember our grandparents muttering, 'Same old Argo', referring to the lack of ambition and investment at crucial times. 'They don't want to go up', was another.

If Brent really 'gets it', he would take on board these facts and build for a brighter future for the football club. He won't.

Clearly, he and others have other agendas and they will never be forgiven, no matter how many lower league matches they attend.

Very sad.

Apologies to those who have heard it all before, hundreds of times.

Some good points there Tring - I've been going since the late 60's and those old Janner sayings you mention stick in the throat!! No one during that period at least, ever really backed the club although during those times we had the glimpses of 'maybes' with the odd 20+ to 40k crowds but that was only when we got lucky with the likes of Mariner & Rafferty!! The crazy spectacle of a World Cup was almost the catalyst but then the Russkis spoilt the party and the club went meltdown!! This latest phoenix period in peddling backwards is culminating in lunatic developing that looks like a couple of 10 year olds have been let loose with the crayons - in a nutshell you are totally correct!!

This farm thread started by the fat controller, clearly emphasises the village mindset.

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Lil ole Exeter took 30000 to a conference final at the Real Wembley stadium in 2007...

The Red Star wrote:

Lil ole Exeter took 30000 to a conference final at the Real Wembley stadium in 2007...

That is quite bizarre, is it not Red ?

The Red Star wrote:

Lil ole Exeter took 30000 to a conference final at the Real Wembley stadium in 2007...

Hey, that must mean we need a 20 thousand seat stadium as well cos that is "counted and quantifiable" support, fortunately we Reds don't waste time on Billy Big Bollox bullshiite, Gargoyle do have impressive support for a pile of shiite but 20k on a regular basis? Newell will get a blow job from Jock first.

I see the mighty Yeovil achieved what you mugs see as the promise for a generation with crowds of a hundred or so more than we get in a ground the size of Sid James, yet you girls still bleat on and on about how you will never achieve the same because your freebee ground is only twice the size, pathetic.

Hello Tis nice to see you are your normal charming self.

Lord Tisdale wrote:

The Red Star wrote:

Lil ole Exeter took 30000 to a conference final at the Real Wembley stadium in 2007...

Hey, that must mean we need a 20 thousand seat stadium as well cos that is "counted and quantifiable" support, fortunately we Reds don't waste time on Billy Big Bollox bullshiite, Gargoyle do have impressive support for a pile of shiite but 20k on a regular basis? Newell will get a blow job from Jock first.

I see the mighty Yeovil achieved what you mugs see as the promise for a generation with crowds of a hundred or so more than we get in a ground the size of Sid James, yet you girls still bleat on and on about how you will never achieve the same because your freebee ground is only twice the size, pathetic.

Sorry I would've responded earlier but I had my mouthful.

Are you sure it was full Jock?

Are you saying Jock's got a big mouth GOB?

Sensiblegreeny wrote:

If you look at the crowds for that season it was less than we get now until the playoffs were there. Most of the people who went to Wembley were there jumping on the bandwagon the same as happens when Argyle play a big club in the cup. Not that we get that far these days. Bloke next to me at the Everton game asked me who the No.11 was, then the No.7 and then the Keeper. At the third question I told him to buy a fecking programme or turn up more often. If we ever manage another day out at Wembley then no doubt, like Yeovil tomorrow, thousands will turn up chanting as if they've all been going for years. I would suspect the Argyle contingent would be much the same as it was the last time new stand or not.

sounds like one of the super fans to me

Greenjock wrote:

I guess Argyle have 34000 fans or so as that's how many turned up at Wembley when there would still have been room for plenty more.

If we reached the league 1 play-offs I don't think it would be many more, but come the championship play-offs the other side would also sell a similar amount so maybe 40,000 would go then?

As it is now there are probably only around 15,000 who are attending fans. Some go to the odd home game, some to only away games due to location, and there are the 5,000 or so who go no matter what to home games.

Obviously the die-hard 5,000 are the most loyal and deserved to be looked after, but the trick is persuading the ones who go to a few games and maybe buy a white membership to go more regularly throughout the season, and somehow persuade the one's who have become disinterested and won't pay good money to watch bottom of division 4 football after years of relegation and turmoil.

The obvious answer is the team needs to win more. It's not rocket science working out that more will come if the team is winning and that's where investment comes in. James Brent has seen biggish crowds for the local derbies even though we're struggling and fighting relegation again.

Pay for better players and it will pay for itself through bigger crowds, or at least in theory it should.

That's the case everywhere though. If it were as easy as just putting an extra £500k or so to guarantee much higher crowds then everyone would be at it.

I've been one of the loyal fans who go to every game, and a white member through not having the time off work to go every fortnight, and someone who picked and choosed games when frankly I couldn't justify paying out to watch rubbish week in week out.

Now I go to a few away games because of location but if I still lived in Cornwall I would go occasionally when my mates were going due to the cost and because watching awful football and losing most weeks wears you down.

Chris Webb calling fans plastics again today is stupid really, because when he's asked to drum up support he wants everyone to come along and cheer the side to safety. Hypocrisy at its worst.

Argyle need every possible fan/supporter/customer through the turnstiles as possible right now and not some club official slagging them off like he's done to EJH and calling people plastics.

Chris Webb's mantra seems to be that he's loyal and anyone not as loyal as him isn't important. He often says things like "In years to come these days will be all the sweeter because you can turn round and say I was at Accrington" or wherever.

Yes Chris Webb and Ian Newell are brilliant for going to every game blah, blah, blah, but their support is guaranteed now. It's the missing thousands, the casual fan or the family man who has enough for one luxury a week maybe who needs persuading that going to home park is a better day out than going to the cinema or having a meal out, yet I get the distinct impression that these people are happier with 6,000 at the game than 12,000 so they can boast about how loyal they are.

Instead of calling people plastics and insulting them for disagreeing with the HHP plans, just as Peter Jones also did, they should be telling James Brent that he needs to attract these fans and that will be by investing in the team and giving them some hope of promotional rather than revelling in a 21st placed finish.

How he is club president is beyond me, and with his partner abusing anyone who disagrees with him on a daily basis it's a wonder crowds are even as good as they have been.

Still what do I know? I'm just a plastic.

no one I know had ever heard of him or knew his face before he led the trust !

anyhow does webb go to EVERY game ? I very much doubt it.

The realist:

Greenblooded1
Post subject: Re: Mr Brent's definive statement re HP GrandstandPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 10:13 am


Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2005 11:02 am
Location: N Hampshire
Here we go, blaming the fans again. The club has been run appallingly for years, it's never won a trophy or even been in a cup final, it simply hasn't credibility or "belief" in the wider fanbase to generate larger numbers, although two promotions on way back to Championship should help.

"small" clubs like Ipswich Norwich etc with smaller catchment areas have had success, fans know they can do it & hence a larger base of support from that smaaler catchement area.

Getting 30,000 to Wembley shows potential, it's up to the club to make them (attract them) come back.


The dimwitted janner :

Andy_S
Post subject: Re: Mr Brent's definive statement re HP GrandstandPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 10:17 am



Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2003 11:42 am
Same old, same old!

Always up to the club.

Never the "supporters" fault...oh no!

Never the fault of those that change the reasons for not turning up at HP like they change their socks.

Not going until this happens, not going until that happens, not paying this, not paying that.

How about just supporting.

_________________
Proud to be a Lion!

Says Andy S the ex pat? What a wanker, he should know that location is only one of the factors that mean you can't go to Argyle, I only went to a couple of games last year, partly because I have been travelling for ten weeks in the last year and I have booked to go for the month of August to sunnier climes in my van. I am not minted and I cant do it all, Brent and his asset stripping fan club do little to Make me want me to go either, it is one way to save money and also a way to show Brent my displeasure at what he is doing. Any superfan is willing to discuss who is the biggest fan can have a go if they like, I have been all through the bad years for the last forty years or more, this is just one developer too many.

andy s - proud to be a lion. is he a millwall fan?

Mapperley, darling wrote:

andy s - proud to be a lion. is he a millwall fan?

No he's got a shaggy mane and big paws.

Andy_S wrote:
No I'm not.

Where's the 30,000 LOYAL supporters that went to Wembley?All the "I've been going Argo all my life" crap!

To coin a favourite phrase, oft used in these forums, wake up and smell the coffee.

A city with the only football club and a population in excess of 250,000 plus a catchment area of over a million, should NOT be getting crowds of 7,000.

We should NOT have been getting crowds of 11,000 - 13000 when we were in CCC in 4th position "challenging" for the Premier League.

Loyal? My arse!

Greenskin:
You seem to be very knowledgeable in these matter,so can you please tell me;

a.How many supporters the following clubs had at Wembley for their recent appearances there;

b.What was the follow up gate for their next home game

Chesterfield
Southend
Carlisle
Millwall
Crewe
Swindon
Brentford

The implication of your post[s] seems to be that the phenomena of taking many thousands of supporters to Wembley,then losing a fairly hefty percentage of them afterwards,is a purely Plymouth one.Just wondering if you had any concrete evidence to back that up.

Andy_S wrote:
Not in the slightest bit interested in what other clubs may or may not do. Only one football club interests me.

Actually, there was nearer to 35,000 than 30,000 in the "green" section at Wembley and the first game of the following season was at home to York.

Attendance? 9,035.

Bang! 26,000 "supporters" disappeared in 10 weeks!

Just imagine how much more there would have been in Shilt's coffers had even a quarter of that 26,000 turned up regularly,


Greenskin:
Thanks.That's a very revealing reply.

How has he been SO ANGRY for SO LONG. A proper dimwit who isn't seemingly aware of how much of a prick he makes himself look time and time again.

Charlie Wood wrote:

How has he been SO ANGRY for SO LONG. A proper dimwit who isn't seemingly aware of how much of a prick he makes himself look time and time again.

Guys like Soper and Newell just cannot grasp the bigger picture.

Their insular mindset appears all consuming.

Just read the farm thread about reducing prices for the season run in and noted  the  again lamenting argyle plastics, half argyle plastics and plastic plastics. He even used the acronym DNA. Which is impressive for what amounts to a shaved chimp-pig combo...anyway my point is I was at Wembley too and recall in our block about 6 people, stood up the whole time, near the back of the stand who sang 'part-time supporters' for pretty much the duration of the entire match. I recall how utterly sad they were and why they couldn't just enjoy the fact that the club was playing (and winning) there at all.

Recent comments on the farm shows these heroes are crawling out of the woodwork again, just can't help it can they. I mean what do they want, a feckin medal or something?

Lord Tisdale wrote:

The Red Star wrote:

Lil ole Exeter took 30000 to a conference final at the Real Wembley stadium in 2007...

Hey, that must mean we need a 20 thousand seat stadium as well cos that is "counted and quantifiable" support, fortunately we Reds don't waste time on Billy Big Bollox bullshiite, Gargoyle do have impressive support for a pile of shiite but 20k on a regular basis? Newell will get a blow job from Jock first.

I see the mighty Yeovil achieved what you mugs see as the promise for a generation with crowds of a hundred or so more than we get in a ground the size of Sid James, yet you girls still bleat on and on about how you will never achieve the same because your freebee ground is only twice the size, pathetic.

Argyle would sell 20,000 season tickets in the Premier League, let alone whole attendances.

PAFC's average attendance in the first season back in the Championship (2004-05) was around 16,500. You are right one one thing though - Exeter do not need a stadium of anything like 20,000. Your crowds are like 3,000 and you are playing at your natural level now - just happy to take part in the football league.

So as someone who doesn't go to home matches as I live in Derby now I can't go to Wembley as I'm a plastic....

I don't remember there being a lot of Superfans at Scarborough on a Tuesday night in 99 (we lost), or even home to Darlington when we lost 1-0 in 96!

And this is the reason I feel more and more detached from the club I started supporting in 1981, but hey I guess the money and time I put in regularly until a couple of years ago or the money I put into buckets when I came down for matches isn't good enough.

Quite Daz.

It does puzzle me why nool and Webb peddle this superfan horseshit as much as they do. Plymouth Argyle has always been and probably will always be, the sort of football club that needs to welcome fans, any fans, fans from the moon even, with a glass of scotch, its knickers round its ankles and a dusky smile.

Daz Evans wrote:

So as someone who doesn't go to home matches as I live in Derby now I can't go to Wembley as I'm a plastic....

I don't remember there being a lot of Superfans at Scarborough on a Tuesday night in 99 (we lost), or even home to Darlington when we lost 1-0 in 96!

And this is the reason I feel more and more detached from the club I started supporting in 1981, but hey I guess the money and time I put in regularly until a couple of years ago or the money I put into buckets when I came down for matches isn't good enough.

Absolutely.

We can all do the superfan thing if we really wanted; like the time when me and about 200 others were at dean court on a cold Tuesday night, where it rained so hard it stung your eyes, and blew so hard the wads of used fivers were literally being blown out of grobellars underpants.

Tringreen wrote:

The all important factor in hooking the potential fanbase are clear statements of ambition. The Stapleton regime was the last in a long line to fail miserably to inspire.For a club with no top flight history there simply has to be a reason to believe. The hardcore 5k can't seem to understand that all clubs are /were the same. The wider fanbase need a sign and Argyle have always failed to provide a reason to believe.

Plymouth remains the largest city club never to experience top flight football with the resultant increase in hooked fanbase. The likes of Norwich and Southampton achieved this 40 years ago when previously we were on a par with them, support wise.
Now we have the likes of Reading, Swansea, Cardiff joining the party. It could just as easily be us.

Hull were the previous biggest city club never to have got the T shirt. They got a decent stadium which demonstrated ambition. The attendances increased with the feelgood/ feel proud factor and the rest, as they say, is history.

Us oldies can remember our grandparents muttering, 'Same old Argo', referring to the lack of ambition and investment at crucial times. 'They don't want to go up', was another.

If Brent really 'gets it', he would take on board these facts and build for a brighter future for the football club. He won't.

Clearly, he and others have other agendas and they will never be forgiven, no matter how many lower league matches they attend.

Very sad.
Apologies to those who have heard it all before, hundreds of times.

The City of Brighton & Hove has a population of 273,000 (2011). It is now the largest city not to experience top flight football. They have a Chairman who has massively invested massively in the stadium and the team, including the players wages, making an unsustainable financial loss in the process. The adoption of the Financial Fair Play rules by Championship clubs will make this impossible to replicate. The recent SCMP in Leagues 1 and 2 also provide a brake on the reliance of high net worth individuals funding club's speedy progress through the football pyramid.

Like it not a structured and sustainable approach to a club's progress and 'living within your means' is the only realistic way forward. With an improving team and the prospect of a play off inspired financial boost means the club club are best placed to make progress than in the last five years or so. Whether this Chairman supported by his largely non- executive board can provide the necessary requirements to build upon our recent on pitch improvement remains to be seen. The fundamental of success is unity on and off the pitch. We have seen much of the former and little of the latter. Time to stand up and be counted in my view and that includes the supporters. Let's see where we end up at the end of the season and then a proper and informed debate on the way forward for the football club can begin.