Argyle valued at £2million ???

Tim Chown wrote:

Personally, I take that 'leak' with a huge pinch of salt. It's just not credible.

The figures for the staff repayment and the ground rent have been disclosed previously and are very different. You can look back to the Pasoti Q&A before the summer for example.

What also sticks out for me is £750,000 p.a. for energy/electricity. That's a huge figure.

A strange post indeed.

Tim

Doesn't smell right to me either, Tim, but it does *look*, how shall we say... Ridsdalian.

On energy bills, it does look a huge figure. I found this on NUFC saving £200K per year on electricity bills, which indicates that it is a pretty large figure to begin with.

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Well, you can get a beermat out and do the numbers... a 1kW kettle at about 12p per kWh would cost about £1 for 8 hours, or about £3 a day, or about £1,000 a year if it were possible to have it always on and drawing that amount.

So if those numbers are to be believed, what are Argyle doing with the equivalent of 750 kettles? Has a Bond villan set up a secret bunker under HP and tapped into Argyle's mains supply?

Or is the 'leak' is pure bunkum?

Take your pick!

Tim

PS. Your link says NUFC saved £200,000 over 3 years, rather than per year.

Floodlights left on all the time? Maybe Brent is using Argyle as front to grow loads of weed under the floodlights, he did look a little stoned the last time I saw him. He cadged half a Mars bar off his boy, definitely the munchies.

The figures are obviously stupid, but it does help the overall spin quotient in favour of our inglorious banker. As someone else rightly noted, one can tell who and why a strange "insight" post is made by how the pasoti moderators react to it.

Two points have crossed my mind, though, re the valuation:-

1.....We hear a lot about the car park being sold to Brent, but what of the land at goals and the old cricket club that Stapleton etc bought. Where is that these days and in whose hands ? Their holding company was closed down and included in the admin of the club

2...... I think I remember the Council are obliged to offer back the stadium to Argyle within a certain time frame at an advantageous price. ( 10 x the annual rent ? ) That could conceivably have a balance sheet value under today's mad accounting conventions... could almost come under some sort of goodwill.

Argyle Report wrote:

Possible Shortfall estimation @ £ 2-3million per year

I don't supppose they thought any prospective buyer would bother reading until the end.

And from all of this I can only conclude : I DON'T TRUST BRENT!

The OP confirms that most football supporters don't have a clue when it comes to business matters.

The value of any business can only be worked out taking two things into consideration:

1. The net value of any assets-that is the + value of any assets less the - value of any assets. As PAFC have no physical assets such as a stadium, land etc. that just leaves the players. Now, while a development player like Le Cointe could be termed an asset because he has a sales value, most other contracts would actually be a liability ( a -value asset) Just think of Walton's Contract and you'll see what I mean. The Football Creditor debt is also a liability to count against any assets.

2 The trading profit over a period of time. Well, the Club came out odf Administration just over a year ago and have been trading at a loss ever since, .according to the owner, so the less said the better


Figures re; possible future gate receipts etc are pure guesswork and no one would even look at them in terms of a valuation.

PAFC is currently worth sweet FA as, in the words of the owner, the club comes with "several million pounds in liabilities"

Unless JB sells/gives away the club in the next couple of years or there's a complete reversal of fortune on the pitch and the club gets promoted, my prediction is another period in Administration as the club does not have the means to settle the FC debt in full and JB will not fund it out of his own pocket

Nikkk might step in though

Utterly clueless and totally village. We are f*cked whichever way speccy w@nker plays it.

3k avivas at best................ but they'll be happy singing 'janner' in the tent.

GOB wrote:

That's a good point Iggy, where did the information come from? Why is it being released now, just prior to the Trust decision making? Could it be yet another double plot for those that hide in darkened corners of the directors box? Could it be that someone would like to put Trust members off buying into the club?

Who knows but if there's a bad smell it would be foolish to invest.

If the Trust buy into this then it have to be purely an emotional investment because nobody in their right mind would touch what appears to be a buy in to a very dodgy deal indeed with a few dodgy characters involved.

I think some people have overthunk themselves, though. Gob. At one point, the attacks on the Trust were being orchestrated under a banner of 'hurry up and decide to raise a lot of money to hand over'. Now, as you suggest, it seems the same people don't want the Trust anywhere near the shares.

Nothing to do with who's leading the Trust at any given time, of course.

[Anyone would think democracy and representation were difficult to understand, for crying out loud.]

James Brent was a speaker at the Plymouth Supporters Branch on 4th October and he mentioned that the total cost of running PAFC is £4,600,000 per annum.

If you take the projected three years' income figure of fifteen & a half million and deduct 3 lots of four point six million you come to something just under two million which ties in with the club's valuation figure.

However, if you substitute a more realistic income figure of say ten million you get a projected shortfall of best part of four million which makes the club worthless from an investment point of view.

In the absence of any information from Brent or PAFC it seems that the price tag of the 20% should be zero or considerably less!!

One of the earliest high profile inter planetary sales forecasts of our brave new capitalist free-for-all was that for the Milenium dome. Oh how they laughed.... bankrupt after a year.

It looks to me as if this Brent character has used the same valuation process for Argyle as he and his Citygroup chums did when racking up $50 billion dollars of debt. He, of course doesn't understand views like the one I hold, he obviously thinks it's a valuation system that works. He's done very well out of it.... so it must be true.
That's the problem with these banking and capital trading dreamers, they only deal with themselves, they all buy and sell amongst themselves, making it up as they go along, rarely having to step out into the REAL world of a parrochial football club without a REAL competitive football team. The REAL world only hits them when they parachute out one by one with their well padded wedge.

As the last few years have shown, when no REAL wealth is being created, these pirates have to invent imaginary wealth through financial instruments dreampt up on Mars, so that they can get paid their vast sums. Saint Nick Leeson showed them the easy way, just hide the losses, put them in Aladdin's cave for a hundred years. Of course, down here on earth, and where a REAL football club exists and where all us REAL people work, eat, sleep or live in enforced state created poverty, most of us (Brent's puppets excepted) can see the game for what it is ... people filling their boots and expecting the population to keep on falling for the shmooze. I seem to remember our club squad was valued at £17m four years ago.... that obviously must have been a Landan price, not a REAL Plymouth price.

As much as I appreciate the Grovey symposium on 19th century accounting principles the truth is that the only accurate valuation you can get for anything is exactly how much money you can get for it. ABN was worth £50 Billion cos that's what they got RBS to pay for it, give or take a billion or three, there were plenty of dyspeptic Suiters like ol' Grovey checking out the assets and profit history, but no fecker looking at the fundamentals i.e. What business they were actually in and what the first team starters were likely to be doing in twelve months.

Even with the parlous state of current squad a turn over of £10 million a year is only two good seasons away and a 10/1 price to earnings ratio would seem unadventurous for the market. Real people buy potential and then make that potential happen, the days of historical performance being the shibboleth are long gone.

Brent has absolutely scooped the pool, he picked up one of football's last sleeping giants for no outlay with his return locked in through the land issues, he also probably knows that he is pretty much as likely to fall lucky and pull a couple of promotions by running a tight ship as by flashing his cash about, win win for little Jimmy imho and he certainly isn't going to give part of it away for cheap money, PAFC is a tin of potentially magic beans, Jeez you are still getting 6,000 mugs turning up for a regular stiffing despite most of the posters on here being pukkha candidates for the Swilly home for the terminally had enough.

I 4-1 shall be sitting back and waiting for worst to happen as the thought of Porky and Webb giving it up large is pretty repugnant, it's as likely to go that way as the Nirvana of relegation, the 4th div is full of utter dross at the mo and the 3rd isn't much better, you boys need to quit with the griping and eiher get with the programme or do something about making your Trust into a viable alternative, just one small recommendation, leave the self serving leeches out this time.