Just Back

Very edgy start,took 20 minutes for Argyle to get anything going but Rovers [who were the worst representatives of their club ever seen in my time as an Argyle supporter] were totally bereft of belief and confidence and couldn't take advantage-it would have been interesting to see what a good side would have done to Argyle.Madjo,who was quite impressive throughout,then smacked one against the bar and set up Lecointe for a good effort well saved.Absolute crackerjack of a strike from Hourihane and Argyle dominated until HT.The failure to really put the boot in on Rovers was the most disappointing aspect of the game and you could gradually see them coming back into the game,helped by some substitutions which Argyle didn't come to terms with.The equaliser inevitably came and Rovers could have sneaked a win which would have seemed impossible at one stage,Argyle didn't really threaten,crossing and set pieces were atrocious.Madjo and Bhasera had good games but nothing overall to change my opinion that there is insufficient firepower in the team to look forward to nothing more than a mediocre season at best.

Purse hasn't been his commanding self this season. I reckon he's been given the nod and the wink by Brent already and is shitting himself.

At least Wotton would have some fuckin pride in the club. Fletchers just a tw@ who has been involved in our downfall from the start and is happy picking up his pay cheque, win, lose or draw.

Oh and surprise, surprise no tweet for ATD from Sparksy who is too busy taking the piss out of Rovers for only bringing 361. All of which went home pissing themselves at how a pile of shite that they are came to Argyle and got an away draw #notsofuckingfunnysparksy

Andy_Symons wrote:

I'm not sure which game the two pasoti Mods were at - I didn't hear any booing until the very end. Pedlar also says that Hourihane's goal was a shot from inside the area, when in fact he hit it from roughly the same place that ATD's Robbie Williams hit his 30-yard screamer on saturday.

Still, it's all about opinions. Unless you post on pasoti when Pedlar and Greenthing are around, then you can only express agreement with the tow of them, seemingly.

I was booing at the end and i justify that,i felt my £24.00 was not money well spent.

So we replace one 30-something midfielder with no management experience with another?

I can see it happening, but for pity's sake isn't there anyone in a position of power at Home Park who can see what a cluster-feck this club is becoming, on and off the field? A proper, experienced team manager with a decent coaching and scouting set-up. Professional management in place for the off-field departments. Basics which any football club should aspire to.

It can't be that difficult to see, surely?

I cant believe their are fans still thinking fletcher is the answer when its plainly obviously he isnt. I dont want to see my club relegated but it seems a few do if they think carl is the man for the job still.

Andy_Symons wrote:

So we replace one 30-something midfielder with no management experience with another?

I can see it happening, but for pity's sake isn't there anyone in a position of power at Home Park who can see what a cluster-feck this club is becoming, on and off the field? A proper, experienced team manager with a decent coaching and scouting set-up. Professional management in place for the off-field departments. Basics which any football club should aspire to.

It can't be that difficult to see, surely?

you know appoint fletcher wouldnt have bothered me if the club actually appointed a experience assistant manager.director of football to work with him for at 2-3 seasons. Might have made a difference imowe can all see what the temp appointment of deehan did for him.

The positives:

1 a cracking goal from Hourihane
2 a biggish striker who played some very good balls into space, worked hard and looked as if, with support, he could be a good one for us.
3 ATD's Robbie Williams showed a new side to his character - generosity in allowing someone else to get on the scoresheet.

Look on the bright side - at least Exeter & Torquay won tonight.

If Fletcher goes, I can't see it being a permenant in house appointment at all. I'd be very surprised if it was.

I think the time may have to come soon. I buy into what he's trying to do in the long-term of changing our style of play etc but the short-term is so tragically mismanaged that I think it might be time to look for someone else. Part of me still wants to give him more time after keeping us up last season in the way he did and the fact that he's clearly(in my view of course) got some bright ideas but he's just making an absolute meal of it at the moment. He's actually managing to make a sows ear out of a silk purse. The part of me that wants to give him time is slowly diminishing sadly. If we lose at Morecambe, I'd sack him.

Thank god i wasnt there tonight

GreenSam wrote:

If Fletcher goes, I can't see it being a permenant in house appointment at all. I'd be very surprised if it was.

I think the time may have to come soon. I buy into what he's trying to do in the long-term of changing our style of play etc but the short-term is so tragically mismanaged that I think it might be time to look for someone else. Part of me still wants to give him more time after keeping us up last season in the way he did and the fact that he's clearly(in my view of course) got some bright ideas but he's just making an absolute meal of it at the moment. He's actually managing to make a sows ear out of a silk purse. The part of me that wants to give him time is slowly diminishing sadly. If we lose at Morecambe, I'd sack him.

That's quite an about turn in a few weeks Sam. Time you had a word with Braingreen and Ollieargyle, they still haven't got the message.

Thai green wrote:

Listened on Argyle Player this evening. The 2nd half when we should have gone for the jugular we had our first direct shot on goal in the 89th minute, this sums up Argyle under Carl Fletcher to me, negative tactics, poor choice of players brought in, unable to communicate ( Note, Paul Tisdale AND Martin Ling made themselves available for interviews after their games ( win or lose ). Fletcher does NOT communicate, he cannot, its his inability to compile a coherent sentence is painful to hear or see.

I hope he decides to call it a day soon and let a proper Manager take the reins. I am sure the 'nice' Mr Brent has a hard business side to him , can you imagine the weekly or monthly Directors meeting with their Manager, they will not be able to understand Fletcher let alone his negative tactics at home.....a loss tonight would have seen him gone I feel. The Owner will note the falling attendance,it will not be allowed to continue for too long.

I have 6 tickets, White Membership, but I cannot bring myself to go and be depressed, I will wait for a change in Manager.

Amen to that. Brent thinks he's talented though Wonder who told him that ? Ridsdale, Jones, the Jamboys ?????

Carl [the lights are on but there's nobody home] Fletcher. Some of us have realised that fact from the very start.............. just saying like

Greenjock wrote:

Thai green wrote:

Listened on Argyle Player this evening. The 2nd half when we should have gone for the jugular we had our first direct shot on goal in the 89th minute, this sums up Argyle under Carl Fletcher to me, negative tactics, poor choice of players brought in, unable to communicate ( Note, Paul Tisdale AND Martin Ling made themselves available for interviews after their games ( win or lose ). Fletcher does NOT communicate, he cannot, its his ability to compile a coherent sentence is painful to hear or see.

I hope he decides to call it a day soon and let a proper Manager take the reins. I am sure the 'nice' Mr Brent has a hard business side to him , can you imagine the weekly or monthly Directors meeting with their Manager, they will not be able to understand Fletcher let alone his negative tactics at home.....a loss tonight would have seen him gone I feel. The Owner will note the falling attendance,it will not be allowed to continue for too long.

I have 6 tickets, White Membership, but I cannot bring myself to go and be depressed, I will wait for a change in Manager.

Spot on Phil. We go into the break one-up against a side with even less confidence than us and take our foot off the gas! It's asking for trouble yet after Saturday and plenty of other occasions you would think that Fletcher would learn.

If he is not asking the players to drop back and protect the lead then he needs to drop the ones who are doing it. feck our crap squad. If someone isn't playing to his instructions, which I actually doubt, then get them dropped.

Despite starting with Madjo and Lecointe, it still sounded more like 4-5-1 with Lecointe playing not as a striker but another midfielder. Fanny around and call it 4-4-1-1 or whatever, but Lecointe wasn't playing as a striker.

Fletcher can't or won't face the press which is outrageous. It's almost as if he has to watch the highlights or ask other people what they thought before commenting.

I highly doubt Brent will sack Fletcher, who won't resign, so it's onto Morecambe in dire straits. I do actually think we will beat Morecambe, simply because their home form is awful and if our players are feeling the pressure from totally justified impatient fans, then Saturday is the chance to play without fear.

If the crowd truly was 6300 odd, then that's pretty damned good considering our position and what's happened this last few years, but these fans will not turn up regardless and I hate to think what the crowd will be for Southend if we don't beat Morecambe.

Just a small point of correction, Jock.

We didn't take our foot off the gas in the second half, as that implies some degree of acceleration in the first.

I was typing 'live' from the game on the Pasoti match thread & believe me, the opening 15 minutes were as bad as I've ever seen (& I went to Brentford two seasons ago - possibly our all-time nadir?).

I noted that we were being booed by the 14th minute & that it took around 22 minutes to come alive in any way at all.

As ever (cliche alert), goals change games & we then had a pretty good 10 or 15 minutes but make no mistake, in the first half Rovers were twice as good as us for at least twice as long.

I actually thought we were brighter for longer periods in the second half, but the wider narrative to that is that I'm measuring that in small percentages.

I haven't checked, but I suspect that possession was pretty even, however in terms of completed passes Rovers must have 'beaten' us 3 to 1.

And as for our set-up, formation & tactics....... Even having slept on it I still find them incomprehensible.

And we went 4 4 2 in the 86th minute.

Still, I'm at Taunton now & saw a most beautiful sun rise over the Teign estuary this morning.

JonB wrote:

Greenjock wrote:

Thai green wrote:

Listened on Argyle Player this evening. The 2nd half when we should have gone for the jugular we had our first direct shot on goal in the 89th minute, this sums up Argyle under Carl Fletcher to me, negative tactics, poor choice of players brought in, unable to communicate ( Note, Paul Tisdale AND Martin Ling made themselves available for interviews after their games ( win or lose ). Fletcher does NOT communicate, he cannot, its his ability to compile a coherent sentence is painful to hear or see.

I hope he decides to call it a day soon and let a proper Manager take the reins. I am sure the 'nice' Mr Brent has a hard business side to him , can you imagine the weekly or monthly Directors meeting with their Manager, they will not be able to understand Fletcher let alone his negative tactics at home.....a loss tonight would have seen him gone I feel. The Owner will note the falling attendance,it will not be allowed to continue for too long.

I have 6 tickets, White Membership, but I cannot bring myself to go and be depressed, I will wait for a change in Manager.

Spot on Phil. We go into the break one-up against a side with even less confidence than us and take our foot off the gas! It's asking for trouble yet after Saturday and plenty of other occasions you would think that Fletcher would learn.

If he is not asking the players to drop back and protect the lead then he needs to drop the ones who are doing it. feck our crap squad. If someone isn't playing to his instructions, which I actually doubt, then get them dropped.

Despite starting with Madjo and Lecointe, it still sounded more like 4-5-1 with Lecointe playing not as a striker but another midfielder. Fanny around and call it 4-4-1-1 or whatever, but Lecointe wasn't playing as a striker.

Fletcher can't or won't face the press which is outrageous. It's almost as if he has to watch the highlights or ask other people what they thought before commenting.

I highly doubt Brent will sack Fletcher, who won't resign, so it's onto Morecambe in dire straits. I do actually think we will beat Morecambe, simply because their home form is awful and if our players are feeling the pressure from totally justified impatient fans, then Saturday is the chance to play without fear.

If the crowd truly was 6300 odd, then that's pretty damned good considering our position and what's happened this last few years, but these fans will not turn up regardless and I hate to think what the crowd will be for Southend if we don't beat Morecambe.

Just a small point of correction, Jock.

We didn't take our foot off the gas in the second half, as that implies some degree of acceleration in the first.

I was typing 'live' from the game on the Pasoti match thread & believe me, the opening 15 minutes were as bad as I've ever seen (& I went to Brentford two seasons ago - possibly our all-time nadir?).

I noted that we were being booed by the 14th minute & that it took around 22 minutes to come alive in any way at all.

As ever (cliche alert), goals change games & we then had a pretty good 10 or 15 minutes but make no mistake, in the first half Rovers were twice as good as us for at least twice as long.

I actually thought we were brighter for longer periods in the second half, but the wider narrative to that is that I'm measuring that in small percentages.

I haven't checked, but I suspect that possession was pretty even, however in terms of completed passes Rovers must have 'beaten' us 3 to 1.

And as for our set-up, formation & tactics....... Even having slept on it I still find them incomprehensible.

And we went 4 4 2 in the 86th minute.

Still, I'm at Taunton now & saw a most beautiful sun rise over the Teign estuary this morning.

Thanks Jon.

Again I only had the commentary to go by, and a least it was more honest last night, and Steve Davey was critical of us all through the game but particularly that we never kicked on against a poor team when we had gone one-up.

First shot on target in the second half came in the 89th minute!

Steve Davey was imploring Bhasera to take on Adam Virgo the Rovers full-back, who was awful and there for the taking, but alas the instruction seemed to be safety first, so the inevitable happened and the switch to 4-4-2 still took far too long after their equaliser..

I've read lots of match reports now and to blame the crowd for being impatient, which seems to be the Pasoti mods stance, is utterly ridiculous and the act of clutching at any straw going.

Greensam makes some good points as usual, but unless James Brent is going to be honest with the fans about the long-term aim, budget, aspirations etc. then the crowd are bound to be restless and lacking patience after witnessing the same old crap for years now. Try telling the fans Fletcher has been charged with revolutionising the club which might take 4 or 5 years, and expecting gates anything like they have been so far under Fletcher.

I don't believe for one minute that 6000+ hardy souls would be turning up week in week out in the knowledge that we're experimenting and not expecting to win many games while Fletchers tinkers with things that should be taking place on the training ground!

We've actually had a fairly easy set of games this season so far, and there are far more difficult games to come, and yet we are sat in a familiar 19th place bereft of confidence or ideas, and a squad that is lacking in some areas but bulging with mediocrity in others. It's your squad Fletcher. You re-signed these players or brought them in this season so there is no longer a get out of jail free card in it being Reid's team.

One year to the day since Fletcher was appointed and I don't think there has been any progress at all, and if anything this squad seems to lack the heart of last seasons.

Andy_Symons wrote:

Rovers were shite, and I'll be having a crafty fiver on them for relegation.

We were worse.

Make of that what you will.

But I thought we were in no danger of relegation being thrown out the league under carl the clueless?

Freathy wrote:

Andy_Symons wrote:

Rovers were shite, and I'll be having a crafty fiver on them for relegation.

We were worse.

Make of that what you will.

But I thought we were in no danger of relegation being thrown out the league under carl the clueless?

Should've listened to Sad Act n Ginger Pubes.

Why can't we sign 'Vales scoring players for 50p each? I mean they are in admin. and that's what happens, takes some working out don't it?
Stat's 50 50 poss.
7 9 shots
3 6 on target
6 9 corners
8 6 fouls
So the only thing we beat 'Rovers on was fouls? Fletcher out now.

Freathy wrote:

Andy_Symons wrote:

Rovers were shite, and I'll be having a crafty fiver on them for relegation.

We were worse.

Make of that what you will.

But I thought we were in no danger of relegation being thrown out the league under carl the clueless?

I'll type this slowly, since you appear to struggle to keep up.

Fletcher's record over his first 46 games in charge would have seen us comfortably mid table.

With the resources that are allegedly at his disposal, this season has seen us going backwards. Last night saw us up against a team who are, to be frank, abysmal. The fact that we went 1-0 up yet capitulated again in the second half (1st shot on target in the second half, 89th minute) tells me that Fletcher hasn't learnt from last season, or indeed from this. Rovers were there for the taking last night after we scored. The fact that we let them back into the game, and didn't press on to finish them off when we had the chance tells me that Fletch is too scared of losing to try and win.

The only thing that may save us this season is the obvious point that there may be two teams even shitter than we are.

Shitter is Sam's word, go find your own adjectives!

He can have Shitier though.

The problem with using the analogy that Fletch's record of 26% wins and equating that to this season, is that we are clearly worse than last season, and Fletcher's win ratio is dropping- 26% win ratio means 1 win in 4 games, currently its 1 win in 7 and I don't think we'll beat Morecambe on Saturday. If we compare this season with last we have the following-
------------------2012-----------2011/12--------Difference (points)
Aldershot (h)----0-2---------------1-0--------------- -3
Dag & Red (a)---3-2---------------0-0--------------- -2
Oxford (a)-------1-2---------------1-5-----------------0
Northampton(h) 3-2---------------4-1-----------------0
Torquay (a)-----0-0---------------1-3--------------- +1
Port Vale (h)----1-3---------------0-2------------------0
Bristol Rov (h)---1-1--------------1-1------------------0

So we're already 4 points down compared to the same fixtures we played last season. The teams that have come down from league 1 aren't too bad and York and Fleetwood are much better than Hereford and Macclesfield so we will struggle and look set to get around 38 points which is likely to be a relegation place.

Surely the board can see we are going backwards- 4-5-1 at home is suicidal. The point was made on pasoti - what's the point of having 8 strikers if only 1 plays? Why release Soukouna when Wotton is the only defensive midfielder in the squad? A point I would also make is why didn't we loan a midfielder (until Christmas) when Lowry got his injury- Brent has apparently said there is money still left in the budget?

The defence is struggling for form- especially Purse and Blanchard and Young doesn't look good enough for a Sunday league side. We're told Fletch is this super manager who the players all like- why can't he motivate them?

To be fair, Mark Pedlar's analysis only really criticises the crowd's continued negativity towards Hourihane, which I have to admit I get wound up by as well. I think that he is actually one of our more talented players and one of the few who works hard to keep us in possession of the football, even if that does mean passing the ball backwards on occasion. I've lost count of the amount of times I've been watching Argyle only to hear a cry of "Get the bleddy thing up there" or words to that effect only to read loads of complaints about 'hoofball' (shittest football term ever coined) on PASOTI when I get back. Hourihane reminds me a lot of Summerfield, a slightly languid, obviously talented player who the portions of the crowd seem to enjoy undermining. I very rarely boo the team, I'm more of a wry-chuckle-and-a-small-shake-of-the-head type of guy but I'd never chastise a fellow fan for reacting that way at a bad performance. However, I find the continued negativity towards one of our more talented, younger players exasperating.

If Brent has said that there is money still in the kitty....why doesn't he spend it on paying off Fletcher...or is that too negative even for Argyle.

To be fair Droly, there were others complaining about the crowd, Green Thing for one, and almost using the fact that some fans have had as much as they can take as an excuse for the poor performance.

Fans booing does no good, except maybe let James Brent know what they think, but it is understandable sometimes and almost always occurs as a result of the shite being served up on the pitch.

Yep, some of the later posts were incredibly patronising but Mark Pedlar seemed to be getting the lions share of the flak here and I just didn't think that was really representative of what he was trying to put across. I only really picked up on it because I basically agree with him; Hourihane for whatever reason appears to have taken on the mantle of official booboy which I find strange as I think there are several more deserving candidates in the team!