League One For Argyle (*awaiting the press release)

looks like we may find out tomorrow, the club are right to be cautious, fingers crossed as suffers said as long as we get out of this shit league.

The EFL are unlikely to agree to scrap relegation this season - because it would give the Premier League the precedent to do likewise.

That’s according to the Daily Mail who say the governing body wants to make sure there is movement between the divisions to preserve sporting integrity.

The EFL has allowed League Two to end early - and at meetings next week will present a series of proposals for how to decide the final table.

Points per game, weighted or unweighted and a mini play-off tournament have all been suggested.

But one thing they are expected to reject is last week’s indicative vote amongst League Two clubs to save bottom-placed Stevenage.

Twenty League Two clubs voted to allow Stevenage to remain in the division despite being three points from safety.

But the Mail says ‘there is little chance they will spare clubs relegation’ - thereby removing the possibility for clubs like Norwich City, Aston Villa and Bournemouth to cite that precedent.

The Canaries, who are bottom of the Premier League, are already being accused of trying to wriggle out of relegation after their sporting director Stuart Webber argued it would not be fair to relegate Norwich if they have completed their season and replace them with an EFL club that had not.

“Football should be played, on the pitch not in the boardroom,” Webber said.

“But the Championship has to restart and play all of its games also.

"What we could not accept is a situation where we play out all of our games, get relegated, but then the Championship can’t play – because we don’t even know if the government are going to let them play, they automatically promote some teams who haven’t finished the season.”

Those comments will not have been lost on the EFL who are adamant Championship clubs must have access to the top flight.

Will the fat lady sing tomorrow for Argyle? If she does i be doing my evening walk around the park with a big smile on my face.

Salford, Portsmouth Leasing.com Trophy final opponents have ripped up their squad following Friday’s decision to bring a premature close to the 2019-20 campaign.

The full list of players released by Salford is: Josh Askew, Craig Conway, Kieran Glynn, Kyle Letheren, Chris Neal, Michael O’Connor, Nathan Pond, Mark Shelton and Scott Wiseman, Gibson and Rodney.

Tgwu wrote:

Salford, Portsmouth Leasing.com Trophy final opponents have ripped up their squad following Friday’s decision to bring a premature close to the 2019-20 campaign.

The full list of players released by Salford is: Josh Askew, Craig Conway, Kieran Glynn, Kyle Letheren, Chris Neal, Michael O’Connor, Nathan Pond, Mark Shelton and Scott Wiseman, Gibson and Rodney.

Kyle Letheren must be one of most unluckiest keepers in the game

Tgwu wrote:

Will the fat lady sing tomorrow for Argyle? If she does i be doing my evening walk around the park with a big smile on my face.

You yourself posted this:

"The EFL has allowed League Two to end early - and at meetings next week will present a series of proposals for how to decide the final table."

Seeing as the last meeting was Friday, tomorrow (Monday) may be a little early? ...and even after the EFL do meet, it sounds like a vote will need to be taken on "a series of proposals"?

Rickler wrote:

Tgwu wrote:

Will the fat lady sing tomorrow for Argyle? If she does i be doing my evening walk around the park with a big smile on my face.

You yourself posted this:

"The EFL has allowed League Two to end early - and at meetings next week will present a series of proposals for how to decide the final table."

Seeing as the last meeting was Friday, tomorrow (Monday) may be a little early?  ...and even after the EFL do meet, it sounds like a vote will need to be taken on "a series of proposals"?  

I'm with freathy on this one. I don't think promotion will happen.
Will be happy to be proved wrong.

Elias wrote:

Rickler wrote:

Tgwu wrote:

Will the fat lady sing tomorrow for Argyle? If she does i be doing my evening walk around the park with a big smile on my face.

You yourself posted this:

"The EFL has allowed League Two to end early - and at meetings next week will present a series of proposals for how to decide the final table."

Seeing as the last meeting was Friday, tomorrow (Monday) may be a little early?  ...and even after the EFL do meet, it sounds like a vote will need to be taken on "a series of proposals"?  

I'm with freathy on this one. I don't think promotion will happen.
Will be happy to be proved wrong.

But why won't promotion happen?

All the 'evidence' points to the contrary. Clubs are falling over backwards, putting their health at risk, and going into even more debt to try and finish the season in order to get promoted? Some such as Port Vale are giving up the fight for the 'good of the game'. Why in the face of all this would the EFl say feck you lot?

It will all be down to what the greed league decide,  think they will play on and so the lower leagues will either cancel the season which means no promotion or play on behind closed doors, we will finish 5th and lose a play off with Northampton which means no promotion.

FFS I’m glad I’m a glass half full person!

I'm a miserable bastard most of time (the result of fifty odd years of hard knocks and unrealised Argyle dreams) yet I still think well be promoted.

Earwegoagain wrote:

I'm a miserable bastard most of time (the result of fifty odd years of hard knocks and unrealised Argyle dreams) yet I still think well be promoted.

Really I wouldn’t have thought that ears!

Joking aside and off topic I suppose but your earlier mention of Mashfords Boat Yard brought back memories of 1967 when Chichester’s Gypsy Moth was anchored on one of their moorings, the following day getting my 16ft boat ready at Mutton Cove for a days fishing I was approached by about 6 reporters to take them across the river, took them across, circled the GM, stopped so they could take some pics and all the twats went to one side of the boat and nearly sunk us, took some water, one fell in, served him right, but they did give me a pound each.
I and just about all the boat owners spent the rest of the day ferrying people across for pics, Bleddy good earner that day, the only boat owner who got prosecuted was the only one who was actually licensed to carry passengers, he was carrying one too many, the rest of us made sure we got paid half way across the river out of the way of plods eyes, they challenged us but we said we weren’t charging anything so feck all they could do.

Move it if you want Mods but I couldn’t resist it

i'm not saying we won't be promoted, we may well be but there is just as much chance we won't be. The teams in 1st or 2nd positions are far more likely to be promoted than Argo and it's a real possibility we will have to go through play-offs.

Freathy wrote:

i'm not saying we won't be promoted, we may well be but there is just as much chance we won't be. The teams in 1st or 2nd positions are far more likely to be promoted than Argo and it's a real possibility we will have to go through play-offs.

No there isn’t

Freathy wrote:

i'm not saying we won't be promoted, we may well be but there is just as much chance we won't be. The teams in 1st or 2nd positions are far more likely to be promoted than Argo and it's a real possibility we will have to go through play-offs.

The only way we wont go up is if the higher up leagues do away with relegations which will be the snowball effect to the prem doing away with it for this season meaning promotions wont be possible at least into the championship.

EFL, FA and Prem are giving teams too much say and its going to lead in the likes of peterborough chairman suing to improve their standing to get a playoff place along with the clown who owns sunderland.

I am not getting carried away until it is 100% confirmed Argyle are up and that will all depend on what this meeting brings.

I see Rochdale put the boot into those clubs dragging their heels.

Today statement from Grimsby Town Football Club


At the meeting of League 2 clubs, it was agreed that the 2019/2020 season should be brought to an end. Final positions would be determined by points per game and the play offs would take place and four teams would be promoted.

That view will now be taken to the Board of the EFL and then regulations will need to be drafted to put this into effect. There is nothing in the current regulations which provides for ending a season. The regulations will have to be voted on by all 71 clubs and a 50% majority of all clubs and a 50% majority of the Championship clubs will be required for the regulations to be adopted. A majority of clubs expressed a view that as the season is being terminated early there should be no relegation.

Grimsby Town Football Club were represented by Chairman Philip Day who commented:

“Prior to the meeting, I had obtained the views of my fellow directors and we were unanimous in agreeing that the season should end. Our paramount concern was the health and welfare of our staff and players. The EFL had produced guidelines for return to training which included onerous obligations on clubs. Amongst the obligations was a requirement to have players and ground staff tested at least twice a week with the club doctor present."

"The cost of tests alone was estimated to be £140,000. Our club doctor works in the NHS and our view was that it was unreasonable to take him from his duties there. As soon as the players came back, we would have to have taken them and other staff off furlough at a cost of approximately £200,000. There were other requirements which we and most League 2 clubs could not comply with. The total cost of all the requirements and loss of furlough would have been in excess of £400,000 at a time when we had no income."

"I was in the minority who did not agree that there should be no relegation. If we expected relegation from the Premier League, the Championship and League 1 how could we justify no relegation from League 2? My view is that first the outstanding disciplinary proceedings against Macclesfield for their fourth failure to pay wages should be concluded. Then and only then could the final position at the foot of the table be determined and that the bottom team should be relegated. Even though the majority of the clubs wanted no relegation it is not the end of the matter as the FA and the National League will have to be involved."

"I believe that the regulations to end the season will be passed. At least we have certainty on that. We can now plan the way forward knowing we will have no income from gates and commercial sources for some time. No-one knows when the next season will commence and if and when it does how soon we will be playing in front of crowds. We have prepared several budgets based on different scenarios going forward to ensure that our Club can get through this crisis. There are some difficult decisions to make. Once the budgets have been agreed by the Board then our first responsibility as employers is to speak with the staff and players and seek their support for our proposals. I am sure that with goodwill on all sides we can get through this and ensure that there is still a Grimsby Town Football Club going forward”.

Graiser wrote:

Earwegoagain wrote:

I'm a miserable bastard most of time (the result of fifty odd years of hard knocks and unrealised Argyle dreams) yet I still think well be promoted.

Really I wouldn’t have thought that ears!

Joking aside and off topic I suppose but your earlier mention of Mashfords Boat Yard brought back memories of 1967 when Chichester’s Gypsy Moth was anchored on one of their moorings, the following day getting my 16ft boat ready at Mutton Cove for a days fishing I was approached by about 6 reporters to take them across the river, took them across, circled the GM, stopped so they could take some pics and all the twats went to one side of the boat and nearly sunk us, took some water, one fell in, served him right, but they did give me a pound each.
I and just about all the boat owners spent the rest of the day ferrying people across for pics, Bleddy good earner that day, the only boat owner who got prosecuted was the only one who was actually licensed to carry passengers, he was carrying one too many, the rest of us made sure we got paid half way across the river out of the way of plods eyes, they challenged us but we said we weren’t charging anything so feck all they could do.

Move it if you want Mods but I couldn’t resist it

My Old Man took me down to West Hoe Pier (if my memory serves me right?) to watch Gypsy Moth coming home I remember there being crowds of people there and Chitister looked like he could do with a good wash and change of clothes. I was only four but one of those really vivid memories.

The only way I can see everyone being happy is if there's no relegation from the PL, Leeds and WBA get promoted and the next 6 or 8 teams play off for the third promotion spot (Clubs outside the top 6 will say they could have finished higher should the season have been completed). The same scenario will be repeated down through the Divisions.

Argyle are in a slightly different position as only 2 teams need to get promoted to restore L1 to it's usual number. Be ironic if RL's team is denied promotion due to the demise of his previous team.

Despite what they have "agreed" I can't see how the L2 Chairmen can justify denying promotion to Barrow, or indeed Barrow + A N Other should Macclesfield fold or be deducted further points.

Hanging over the whole thing is the question of just how many clubs will be in a position to convince the EFL that they can survive another season-especially if that season starts behind closed doors or with other restrictions in place, such as Clubs having to pay to have players tested for Covid. As things stand, several Clubs are only able to survive because they have furloughed staff. Come October they will have to start paying some level of wages again.

Earwegoagain wrote:

Graiser wrote:

Earwegoagain wrote:

I'm a miserable bastard most of time (the result of fifty odd years of hard knocks and unrealised Argyle dreams) yet I still think well be promoted.

Really I wouldn’t have thought that ears!

Joking aside and off topic I suppose but your earlier mention of Mashfords Boat Yard brought back memories of 1967 when Chichester’s Gypsy Moth was anchored on one of their moorings, the following day getting my 16ft boat ready at Mutton Cove for a days fishing I was approached by about 6 reporters to take them across the river, took them across, circled the GM, stopped so they could take some pics and all the twats went to one side of the boat and nearly sunk us, took some water, one fell in, served him right, but they did give me a pound each.
I and just about all the boat owners spent the rest of the day ferrying people across for pics, Bleddy good earner that day, the only boat owner who got prosecuted was the only one who was actually licensed to carry passengers, he was carrying one too many, the rest of us made sure we got paid half way across the river out of the way of plods eyes, they challenged us but we said we weren’t charging anything so feck all they could do.

Move it if you want Mods but I couldn’t resist it

My Old Man took me down to West Hoe Pier (if my memory serves me right?) to watch Gypsy Moth coming home I remember there being crowds of people there and Chitister looked like he could do with a good wash and change of clothes. I was only four but one of those really vivid memories.

We took our boats out to Cawsand Bay and followed him in, awesome site with hundreds of boats forming a fleet to accompany him in, memorable day alright

I remember as a kid hiring the plastic canoes at Cawsand and paddling round a large metal pipe near the beach, realised what it was when I saw the turds floating near it.

Overview of most League 2 clubs on finishing the season early-

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Grovehill wrote:

The only way I can see everyone being happy  is if there's no relegation from the PL, Leeds and WBA get promoted and the next 6 or 8 teams play off for the third promotion spot (Clubs outside the top 6 will say they could have finished higher should the season have been completed). The same scenario will be repeated down through the Divisions.

That scenario is never going to be repeated down through the divisions. You and others are in denial (yet again). Do you not read what is going on? The clubs have already given their wishes on how the season should end and your proposal isn't among any of them. The EFl is highly unlikely going to go with something the clubs haven't proposed at all, or what was the point of canvassing them in the first place?

Rickler wrote:

Grovehill wrote:

The only way I can see everyone being happy  is if there's no relegation from the PL, Leeds and WBA get promoted and the next 6 or 8 teams play off for the third promotion spot (Clubs outside the top 6 will say they could have finished higher should the season have been completed). The same scenario will be repeated down through the Divisions.

That scenario is never going to be repeated down through the divisions.  You and others are in denial (yet again). Do you not read what is going on? The clubs have already given their wishes on how the season should end and your proposal isn't among any of them.  The EFl is highly unlikely going to go with something the clubs haven't proposed at all, or what was the point of canvassing them in the first place?

From what I can gather is all clubs have unamimously agreed to award promotions and relegations apart from the league 2 relegation place? Obviously the governing bodies have to ratify it but they aren't going to go against the clubs after asking them to vote for it.

Rickler wrote:

Grovehill wrote:

The only way I can see everyone being happy  is if there's no relegation from the PL, Leeds and WBA get promoted and the next 6 or 8 teams play off for the third promotion spot (Clubs outside the top 6 will say they could have finished higher should the season have been completed). The same scenario will be repeated down through the Divisions.

That scenario is never going to be repeated down through the divisions.  You and others are in denial (yet again). Do you not read what is going on? The clubs have already given their wishes on how the season should end and your proposal isn't among any of them.  The EFl is highly unlikely going to go with something the clubs haven't proposed at all, or what was the point of canvassing them in the first place?

Not in denial, but I am in the real world.

Clubs throughout the pyramid have only put forward what suits them. It will only take one or two clubs being relegated or denied promotion to start legal action and the whole thing falls apart.

In Scotland Hearts have already said that a Legal challenge is cheaper than relegation.

Can you really see Villa and Leeds starting next season in the Championship without a fight? And what happens if the PL accepts promoted clubs but halts relegation? Will 6 teams be relegated at the end of next season?

Everyone on here seems to think that things have to be decided almost immediately, but the reality is that Clubs don't want the next season to start until fans are allowed in and that may not be for another six months! So there could well be four months for any play off or promotion/relegation deciders to be played.

And we still don't know how many Clubs will fold before things get back to normal-which is just what the EFL CEO told Parliament.

The whole situation could change if the EFL goes from 71 to say, 66 teams before the new season.



Same scenario down through the Leagues-Stevenage voted for the status quo as it's the only way they won't get relegated, but I can't see Barrow accepting this.