New Stand

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

The way I see it is there needs to be some sort of forward plan to justify the re-valuation of the ground or, to put it another way, the only way that Hallett, Brent and Wrathall make their buck is by re-valuing the ground.

They can revalue it all they like, they won't make any money until they sell.

Rickler wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

The way I see it is there needs to be some sort of forward plan to justify the re-valuation of the ground or, to put it another way, the only way that Hallett, Brent and Wrathall make their buck is by re-valuing the ground.

They can revalue it all they like, they won't make any money until they sell.

Not strictly true.

They can draw directly against the value of their stake or use it to securitise other deals and the more it is valued at the better. The blue print was the Pavillions deal: buy it at X, revalue it to X+Y and promptly stash £900,000 in the pension pot. Easy as long as X>£900,000.

So there's a purchase, a re-valuation and £900k sweet cash profit in the pension pot without a sale being made.

It's all there in B&W in the Natatomissam accounts should you care to look.

Hold on... If X is 900,000, and is what they paid. If they stashed 900k they haven't made a profit.

No matter how you wanna confuse things. There is no profit in valuations. Only sales.

Explain this then:

We all know that The Pavillions was valued at £2m when Brent acquired it from PCC, do we not?

Here's the £900k transaction lifted directly from the Five Directions abbreviated accounts up to year end 2013 as registered in line with legal requirement.

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And here's the current valuation for the Pavillions (disguised as "investment property" and "tangible fixed asset") from the accounts for Natatgomissam to year end 2015.

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Same info; different format (from the same document).

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There's no record anywhere of anything being sold so I can't post that.

If that doesn't prove it to you then nothing ever will.

Now look what you've done Pete!

Take it to the Zoo lads and crack on

Well it's done it for many of us.

Through out the entire Brentmare years nothing whatsoever will ever be built by wor Jimmy.

Don't know if this pair are any more likely to get project off paper than JB, but a 250 seat conference facility overlooking the Hoe with outisde terrace could be the next Bretonside.

## 'erald link ##

green_genie wrote:

Don't know if this pair are any more likely to get project off paper than JB, but a 250 seat conference facility overlooking the Hoe with outisde terrace could be the next Bretonside.

## 'erald link ##

No messing and up it will go. Brent should listen and learn how to do a prappper job

Rickler wrote:

Hold on...  If X is 900,000, and is what they paid.  If they stashed 900k they haven't made a profit.

No matter how you wanna confuse things.  There is no profit in valuations.  Only sales.

I thought they paid £1 (token payment) & then the council gave em £1million as well in grants & subsides
As well

RegGreen wrote:

Rickler wrote:

Hold on...  If X is 900,000, and is what they paid.  If they stashed 900k they haven't made a profit.

No matter how you wanna confuse things.  There is no profit in valuations.  Only sales.

I thought they paid £1 (token payment) & then the council gave em £1million as well in grants & subsides
As well

£2M over 10 years to cover losses, which have become profits as he was allowed to close the pool.

The £900K cream off to pension pot is as I and others have read it.

Tudor has a lot to answer for

A modern 7,300 capacity grandstand (to reach 20k overall capacity) isnt a particularly high bar to aim for but these clowns won't get anywhere near that.

The nano stand was a pathetic 4,800 capacity and now talk of 'refurbishing' a knackered old grandstand from the 1950's...

Look how far this club has fallen, 4th division with 20th century infrastructure, proud of it too.

Once superior/similar in stature to the likes of Reading/Hull/Brighton/Wigan/Cardiff/Bournemouth/Swansea who have all now long since overtaken little Plymouth.

The hardcore 6-7k now conditioned to accept finishing above Exeter, and a playoff finish as success. Oh how these yokels love it, watching on from their seat at Home Park Morgue.

Days of atmosphere long gone, the club is now an empty husk, just floating along like a turd in a sewer

I wouldn't be surprised if something did happen. If boxing in Argyle with a new ice rink still unlocks the Pavillions and Millbay for future redevelopment then Argyle in debt can afford it. Equally Argyle in debt could afford his new hotel. Not sure how this all fits with the promise of 50% of any uplift with the sale of HHP agreement but no doubt there is a way around it. In return Argyle would or could get the return of the Mayflower seats, the fanbase would be happy. Tart up the grandstand and job done.

The solution is so obvious: In N America it is common to have an ice rink built into/underneath a stand.

Why not do that here?

Everybody would end up getting what they want.

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

The solution is so obvious: In N America it is common to have an ice rink built into/underneath a stand.

It is?

I've never seen one. What is common is to have it under the floor of an arena. Something entirely different.

I might be wrong but I'm pretty sure HHP is Brent's baby and he will not want PAFC encroaching on any part of it. That would rule out any combined stand/icerink,basketball court. I'm guessing height and sea view restrictions would also make it a non-starter.

If however Brent & Co were serious about delivering something, they could approach the AFT's working group (I'm sure I've named it wrong) whom clearly knew a little more than the last bunch of leeching parasites.

Rickler wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

The solution is so obvious: In N America it is common to have an ice rink built into/underneath a stand.

It is?

I've never seen one.  What is common is to have it under the floor of an arena.  Something entirely different.

Here we go again...

What?  Your statements are above question now?

Just saying I've never seen one.  The stands I've seen have retail and bar areas. Toilets etc.  Green rooms.  Hospitality suites.  Changing and training rooms.  Storage areas. LA Galaxy has some parking areas under one.

Show us some examples of what you're talking about.

Pafcintheplace wrote:

A modern 7,300 capacity grandstand (to reach 20k overall capacity) isnt a particularly high bar to aim for but these clowns won't get anywhere near that.

The nano stand was a pathetic 4,800 capacity and now talk of 'refurbishing' a knackered old grandstand from the 1950's...

Look how far this club has fallen, 4th division with 20th century infrastructure, proud of it too.

Once superior/similar in stature to the likes of Reading/Hull/Brighton/Wigan/Cardiff/Bournemouth/Swansea who have all now long since overtaken little Plymouth.

The hardcore 6-7k now conditioned to accept finishing above Exeter, and a playoff finish as success. Oh how these yokels love it, watching on from their seat at Home Park Morgue.

Days of atmosphere long gone, the club is now an empty husk, just floating along like a turd in a sewer

Are you me Absolutely all spot on...and so very sad.

Charlie Wood wrote:

Pafcintheplace wrote:

A modern 7,300 capacity grandstand (to reach 20k overall capacity) isnt a particularly high bar to aim for but these clowns won't get anywhere near that.

The nano stand was a pathetic 4,800 capacity and now talk of 'refurbishing' a knackered old grandstand from the 1950's...

Look how far this club has fallen, 4th division with 20th century infrastructure, proud of it too.

Once superior/similar in stature to the likes of Reading/Hull/Brighton/Wigan/Cardiff/Bournemouth/Swansea who have all now long since overtaken little Plymouth.

The hardcore 6-7k now conditioned to accept finishing above Exeter, and a playoff finish as success. Oh how these yokels love it, watching on from their seat at Home Park Morgue.

Days of atmosphere long gone, the club is now an empty husk, just floating along like a turd in a sewer

Are you me  Absolutely all spot on...and so very sad.

Yep, the plight of PAFC under brent has gone way beyond tragedy. Fans of any other club of similar size wouldn't put up with this shyster.  It seems not even yet another monumental collapse this season is enough to get them mobilised.  4th division shit forever.

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

The solution is so obvious: In N America it is common to have an ice rink built into/underneath a stand.

Why not do that here?

Everybody would end up getting what they want.

The expense?

Besides it wouldn't count as "continuous ice".

Rickler wrote:

What?  Your statements are above question now?

Just saying I've never seen one.  The stands I've seen have retail and bar areas. Toilets etc.  Green rooms.  Hospitality suites.  Changing and training rooms.  Storage areas.  LA Galaxy has some parking areas under one.

Show us some examples of what you're talking about.

Can't be arsed.

And if I did it wouldn't be good enough for you anyway.

Hugh Watt wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

The solution is so obvious: In N America it is common to have an ice rink built into/underneath a stand.

Why not do that here?

Everybody would end up getting what they want.

The expense?

Besides it wouldn't count as "continuous ice".

Can't see why it would be more expensive than 2 separate entities.

Nor why it wouldn't count as "continuous ice" because it would only be out of commission when there was a home game (it doesn't need to be open 24/7, does it?) on and the ice would still be there. They could schedule maintenance or something for those times.

Your point does raise the question of what "continuous ice" actually means. Does that mean that it can only be used for skating etc meaning the basketball/concert/conference options would not be applicable?

I took it to mean that the new facility opens when the old one closes not that it has to be permanently available thereafter. Surely it would shut at night, for instance?

The council aren't interested any more with continuous refuse collections, let alone continuous ice. It's an activity that most participants can and do replace with something else. Plymouth might as well have a continuous American football facility. The last time it snowed here, Frank Lord hadn't been born. A ludicrous situation but how else do you control a greedy duplicitous profiteer.
I seem to remember the Todd horror murmuring something about it was possible to strip under the stand back to steel and build new underneath and it would seem the great developer has been devising an even cheaper version. It's all going to be a piecemeal pig's ear