This has to end

Cerbera wrote:

Frank Bullitt wrote:

A very nice post from Knecht over there - sums up my view entirely.

Entirely agree. Is Knecht on here?

I don't know. He would be most welcome.

I have to say I rather like posting on here. People call each other out but I've never seen it descend into mud slinging or personal abuse, at least nothing that isn't generally taken on the chin and responded to in kind. I've also seen more apologies offered when people have gone over the top. Thats the difference for me. Bad humour bad posts or bad views are meant with good humour good posts and good views.

The eye opener for me has been how IJN has acted against the previous incarnation of this forum and on Exeweb whilst behaving as a 'saintly' overseer on the other place . His call to rescind pseudonyms yet posting vicariously on Exeweb using one was and is a double standard. His love of banter on there but not on Pasoti was another thing I can't reconcile. From this much I can see how the older hands on here have a problem that is really quite entrenched.

Once President Webb aligned himself with Ian its double jeopardy especially as he posts in a different tone here than on Pasoti. No 'excuse' for that as his problems with this site must have in part been inherited. Once you always stand by your real mates you can be pushed into a corner sometimes instead of turning round and telling them to back off. Too many times on Pasoti is you get iJN you also get Chris Webb and visa versa. The old boxers one-two.

I think Chris without the baggage is a good thing and seems the type of person who should/would enjoy the knockabout rough and tumble of ATD. I do agree with the poster who said he will always be The President whether posting as such or not. It appears Chris doesn't see it that way but its a valid truth for some people, me included.

The olive branch is welcome. I think most people will accept it but I can understand that some won't and I think that should be equally accepted together with the reasons for it.

(Here's a good example. The banner change is very good and more or less says alot about this forum. A nice sarcastic biting bit of humour)

Well seeing as Chris hadn't even bothered notifying the other site that he wants a truce between, I think that tells us that what Chris really meant to say was "You lot have to stop"

How can Chris slag this site off again when there has been no chance to see what is said on Pasoti? The majority of Pasoti users just go along with what Chris and Ian say anyway, so it's not really the masses on there that need to change. It's the way the site is administered and the people who post on there are obviously not banned so it doesn't affect them, unless of course they dare to question anything Ian says or does. Nice try Cerbera, but let the Roman Emperors carry on ruling their empire.

Right I'm home and can post now .

First of all I believe ATD has about just over 100 or so posters of which maybe 20 are very regular posters . I await being corrected on this but thats my guesstimate . The regular posters have a core who are anti Ian Newell and anti Pasoti due to personal stuff that has gone on in the past .
As a percentage of the whole fanbase that is very low so the fact that the Club President is reaching out to those people must surely be appreciated . It means that he his devoting quite of bit of time to a few individuals - so why not accept on face value for now and see where it leads ?

I only joined ATD when I found out I was being mentioned on here in what could be described as less than flattering terms . No need to go into that but it was uncalled for . All I seemed to have done to deserve that is have a large number of posts to my name on Pasoti . I am by no means the most prolific poster on Pasoti as several others have changed names and accounts and reregistered for various reasons . I post just under 5 times a day on average but I'm a bit of a binge poster when I get my teeth into certain topics . I've posted more on here lately . My other " crime" appears to be my willingness to be associated with and happy to help with fundraising . Fair enough .

My experience of this site can best be described as feeling confused by the general attitude on here . I speak as I find but I feel there is a very negative vibe running through this forum as a whole towards Argyle as a Club . A couple of prominant posters seem to see no earthly good in anything Argyle related and criticise with a scatter gun approach . I don't get that and I never will but whatever rocks your boat thats your choice . Anyone Pasoti related who does anything can be rediculed with out any real consideration to what they are trying to achieve . I've been welcomed to this site by people but honestly don't feel welcome .

I met Frank a few weeks before Christmas and we got on fine . I did say to him - "When is this bollox that goes on between Pasoti and ATD going to come to an end as its just a waste of time and resources ". He agreed with me as I recall ( I stand to be corrected by Frank if my memory is wrong ) .

Bad things have happened and as Chris says we can't do anything about that now its happened and you can't change the past . I think i've been reasonable in my posting on here ( a bit of banter granted ) but I always feel a bit apprehensive as to the responses I'll get . Only the other night I was described as Pasotis emissary and acting on the instructions of General Newell and thats rediculous.

I'm giving my support to this initiative of Chris . I think this COULD be a very good site if it ignored Pasoti entirely and found its own identity and just let all the stuff regarding Ian Newell remain in the past . Lets look to the future .

I hesitantly press the send button .

gg

Dougie wrote:

I have to say I rather like posting on here. People call each other out but I've never seen it descend into mud slinging or personal abuse, at least nothing that isn't generally taken on the chin and responded to in kind. I've also seen more apologies offered when people have gone over the top. Thats the difference for me. Bad humour bad posts or bad views are meant with good humour good posts and good views.

I agree, it's a respect thing here Dougie. If asked, and it is very rare, almost everytime in cases of decency, almost all posters then moderate their own posts if asked .. that's what I call a proper online community.
We disagree, we have our tiffs, but in a more generous way. We know the referee ( moderator ) isn't fixed.

gg,

I think you need to understand that posters on here post whatever they think without fear of editing or censorship if you prefer. Because of that, you might get the feeling that we are negative on here (Freathy certainly is!) but I prefer realist.

Your views are most welcome, and whilst I may not agree with your views all the time, it would be shame if you only posted on Pasoti. I know what you mean, because of late I have felt that way when I post on Pasoti - you just wait for the abuse, don't you?

Good post by the way.

GG - you are correct. We did discuss the end of this nonsense. Its not doing anyone any good. Mark Russell brought it up as well if you remember. I pm'd him on Pasoti the other day saying he was welcome to contact me if he had any issues with ATD.

Within an hour I was banned from sending PM's.

Its a two sided story. But I am ever hopeful that peace will break out

penzancepirate wrote:

The main protagonist has no interest in giving one inch. Never has, never will. I would suggest their proy/shared forrays on here are viewed in a similar vein as their pointless chest beating during the sale process.
It's all very Stalinist, very luggy, very Willie Walsh.... my way or the highway.... I think I've had enough of that sort of thing.

its a clear case of cyber flouncing if ever i saw one. Like a child taking his ball home if he isnt winning..

Pathetic of a man called President.

if Chris was serious about a truce being made between the sites or at least better relations he might start by talking to people on here with respect that he wants back in return and stop making snidey comments about this place on pasoti too.

Cerbera wrote:

gg,

I think you need to understand that posters on here post whatever they think without fear of editing or censorship if you prefer. Because of that, you might get the feeling that we are negative on here (Freathy certainly is!) but I prefer realist.

Your views are most welcome, and whilst I may not agree with your views all the time, it would be shame if you only posted on Pasoti. I know what you mean, because of late I have felt that way when I post on Pasoti - you just wait for the abuse, don't you?

Good post by the way.

I don't get it I really don't . I see very little support on here for any initiative taken by people to raise funds for The Club or in support of the Trust .
The Green Taverners are a nice group of people doing damn good work and having spoken to staff at the Club they are greatly appreciated . They've done amazing stuff over the last year but they get very little praise on here .

One thing you hear constantly is " Typical Argyle " , "Same old Argyle " but now we have people working hard to change that perception . Various things are being tried and some might fail and some might succeed . However on this forum I see so many snidey remarks about efforts like that .
You can only change an institution from within . Argyle needs changing - please don't knock those efforts . In fairness there are people on Pasoti that take the same negative view but hey thats life .

This Club will not recover from the recent trauma fully for at least 5 years in my opinion but every journey starts with one single step . I expect no miracles - it'll take slow progress and hard work .

There have been a couple of positive responses for Cerbera thread but now the "Big Guns" have been summoned to belittle it. I think that certain people hate to be questioned and their ideas for reconciliation is to say this is the way and only way to do it.

Wouldn't it be nice if ALL Plymouth Argyle Supporters On The Internet could be united and accepting of different views. Sadly I believe that one or two characters would not allow it and even fear it.

What a joke of a response from Chris Webb over there all because we didn't all just bow down and do as we were told.

Although it looks like there may well be a few more members on here soon as most seem quite complimentary of ATD.

Phenom wrote:

penzancepirate wrote:

The main protagonist has no interest in giving one inch. Never has, never will. I would suggest their proy/shared forrays on here are viewed in a similar vein as their pointless chest beating during the sale process.
It's all very Stalinist, very luggy, very Willie Walsh.... my way or the highway.... I think I've had enough of that sort of thing.

its a clear case of cyber flouncing if ever i saw one. Like a child taking his ball home if he isnt winning..

Pathetic of a man called President.

if Chris was serious about a truce being made between the sites or at least better relations he might start by talking to people on here with respect that he wants back in return and stop making snidey comments about this place on pasoti too.

I would love a peacable way of discussing all things Argyle. Love it.... that's what we all want... well, 99% of us, maybe not those that actually benefit from all the conflict... some people get off on it. I don't... far from it.
I can't say my being gratuitously called an out and out liar and god knows what else yesterday by a Club President no less is very helpful. Very sad.
I had that nonsense continually on Pasoti... no wonder people move on.

And Cerbera is an outright liar according to Daz. You ought to ask Daz why I did get banned then Cerbera and prove it by showing my posts. Everyone on here knows I posted the link to the funny Sturtz thread and that was all. It was moved then deleted and I was banned. They can't decide between them these Pasoti mods why I was banned, because the link was later re-posted twice, and removed again, until it was eventaully "allowed" by Ian Newell.

Its a simple question Daz, why was I banned for posting it and yet when Argyle Iggy posted the exact same thing it was ok and Ian Newell said how funny it was? And if Tynans Jockstrap, my Pasoti username, was banned for another reason, prove it, show us the evidence Daz. I am so glad that Cerbera did link the Chris Webb truce on Pasoti now, because it sounds like lots of people on Pasoti were still unaware that ATD existed, so wouldnt have been aware that Ian Newell posts as Porkus on Exeweb, posts some real filth, yet bans anyone he likes on Pasoti for "Trolling", or for having multiple accounts, yet Ian Newell has multiple accounts on Exeweb.

People on Pasoti who are now browsing this site for the first time will only now be aware that Ian Newell knew all along who invited Tony Wrathall to Home Park the day he was wined and dined by the staff he had himself fucked over, but Ian didn't want to "out" the person who invited TW, so he messaged me the info calling the guy a c**t. Dozens of Pasoti users were asking for the name of the name of the person who gave the invite and yet Ian and Chris and the select few bigwigs on Pasoti didn't want to be the one who spilled the beans.

The mods on Pasoti do whatever they like, delete or move threads that they decide are not for the eyes of others, or go against the "party line" Users are banned with regularity for nothing other than questioning the views held by Ian Newell and Chris Webb. Most people on ATD DO question things freely, and are not sheep who just do as they are told. I was extremely vocal about Peter Ridsdale, and many other Pasoti users were dead against him having anything to do with the club, yet Ian and Chris dangle phrases like, you don't know what he has done behind the scenes. No we don't and we are just expected to nod our heads and say "Oh ok then. Ridsdale is a saviour"

People on ATD want to ask questions like why the staff have to wait so long for their backpay? If you ask that on Pasoti you are ridiculed or abused because James Brent is omnipotent and is not to be questioned.

Chris and Ian Newell saved Argyle apparently, not going to argue that they did more than the majority to ensure James Brent was given the opportunity to take the club over, but the reason Ian and Chris saved Argyle was because they didn't agree with the process or the info that was being given out by Guilfoyle. So why the hell are we scum for daring to ask questions about Ridsdale, Brent, Wrathall etc? If it was ok for you to question at the time, why is it not ok for ATD posters to do the exact same thing now and ask awkward questions?

Ian and Chris now expect everyone to do what they were not prepared to last year, and accept everything they are told.

I applaud Ian Newell for raising such vast sums of money for the staff, who were actually the people who saved the club, through shirt auctions etc, but why should James Brent multi millionaire owner of Argyle not be paying this back pay himself straight away? Try asking questions like that on Pasoti and see how long you last.

Jock, whilst I have no problem with you posting that, because it will at least get read by some on Pasoti now, please don't turn this thread into a debate about your beef with the modding on Pasoti.

I for one, would like to keep this thread reasonably on track since the mods on Pasoti have been good enough to let their thread run with minimal interference.

My point is Cerbera that you have just been called an outright liar by a Pasoti mod, who won't back it up, and I am trying to explain to anyone who is now going to take a look at this site, why we are called scum and hated. We are doing what Ian and Chris did originally, and questioned what was being told to us, only now we are impertinent enough to question James Brent or Chris Webb or Ian Newell. So you tell me then? Are we not just doing what Chris and Ian did when they "saved the club"? Asking questions. What if Ian and Chris had not started the ball rolling and questioned things last year? Tell me the difference anyone.

Oh and if Chunkymonkey78 really wants to know if IJN is as much of an antagonist as people like to make out, take a trip over to Exeweb and ask the same question mate, or just look at posts by Porkus. Thats if he hasn't deleted them all now.

It is useful for people to have "monsters". It happens for all sorts of reasons. That isn't to deny that some "monsters" actually are monstrous. Let's not create IJN as a monster bigger than he is.

IJN and his behaviour - for example his double standards - but he is only one person. The responses of people such as Daz are indicative that IJN is not the only one. Daz may be simply protecting his friend and that is an entirely a good thing to do. I'd say that good friends recognise and say when someone is getting things wrong. My good friends usually give me a kick or a slap when I am even more stupid than usual.

In the end, guys, and I'm talking to me as well, this is an internet spat over a football club. It's not bloody WW3 and IJN isn't bloody Margaret Thatcher.

funny man wrote:

It's not bloody WW3 and IJN isn't bloody Margaret Thatcher.

I think we ll know that. He's not even Willie Wonka in the real world of breath and stride.

I repeat my opening of a response on another thread on here last night. I have not been party to anything previously on ATD or PASOTI and ventured the opinion then that to a relative outsider this topic appears very childish. To some extent it still does but the one thing that stands out is the attitude or supposed concilliation skills of a Union Rep and Argyle President.

Serously Mr Webb, despite your involvement in the Administration outcome of Argyle, you should consider resigning with immediate affect. You post on here in one vein and then almost in the same breath when the discussion you started is aired on another site completely reverse your original stance. You are meant to be the Club President and by definition do your best for Argyle and the Supporters. Not some but ALL of them whoever they are. To align yourself with one faction in an argument is so wrong in so many ways. This is not Stalin's Russia where the elite can ride rough shod over all dissenting opinions. You are not the President of North Korea where your every word is devine. You are a Union Official by trade and must therefore understand the concept of people having different views and a proper sense of bringing sides together to resolve issues. You clearly leave these at work.

I think you along with several others believe their own headlines these days and have lost the plot. You are no more than a Supporter of Argyle along with thousands of others with the exception you have been granted a title. You do not own the club or the thought processes of people associated with it. How you expect people to respect either you or the position you now hold is beyond me. Anything you say, whether you like it or not, is directly attributed to Argyle the Club itself and you cannot express views in a private capacity whether in your own name or a website user id. If you cannot conduct yourself in a stately manner for the benefit of everyone then as said you have to go.

Well I really don't understand the reasoning from Daz. I wanted to be banned? So when I posted the link, a majority of mods decided to ban me? Still want to know what for? If the link was out of order then it was out of order when ArgyleIggy posted it. Selective censorship again. Then the mods had a discussion about the reason why I was banned, so they changed it?

And now Ian Newell has broken his silence and said after I posted the link I then posted "lets seeb how long I last down there" WTF does that mean?

Ian has also said that he posted once maybe twice on Exeweb in 3 months! Oh ok then. Downthetrack, you want to comment on that? Ian Newell posted on Argyleiggys thread that I was banned for linking to a libellous website, and it was Exeweb I got the link from, but he goes on to say that Exeweb is not a libellous website and he never made that suggestion.

What I will say is that the person who posted on here as Porkie, who said I was banned for posting links to porn sites was not Ian Newell, but someone pretending to be him stirring the shit.

Anyway, that settles that then. I'm going to leave it there. It really is pointless, like swimming against the tide.

I see Newell has said he didn't send a pm with the name of the person who invited wratheral to game. We know there is one doing the rounds. I think it should be posted

Now this is getting funny. Another Pasoti mod has claimed that I would post something antagonistic on pasoti then come back here and say look what I have done. FFS someone ask him to show these posts? I have slagged pasoti off since I was banned because I cannot believe the way I was banned. And I also stated on here that I had e-mail the pasoti mods asking why I was banned and got no reply, this is that e-mail:

So are you going to advise me of the "crime" I committed to be permanently banned from Pasoti? Because I posted a humorous link to Exeweb? A site that Ian Newell posts on regularly under various usernames including Porkus. You really are the most insular forum I have ever encountered. If the Ian Newell stance isn't followed you get your posts removed/moved or get banned. And that is why Argyle Talk Democratic is getting more and more Pasoti users. If a Pasoti user posted a similar thread about Exeter, it would be welcomed and people would think it hilarious, but for them to post one about Argyle which I copied and posted on Pasoti has led to me being banned. Maybe Exeweb should ban Porkus from posting his vile comments on their site, but I don't think they are as low as you are on Pasoti.

No reply was forthcoming because the mods hadn't got a good reason other than the fact i use ATD. After 8 hours waiting for a reply I did send 2 abusive e-mails out of frustration, and I received one back with a clowns face on it.

Now lets see the proof of the posts I made guys, and if anyonew wants to see the private message I received from Ian Newell naming the person who invited Tony Wrathall, where Ian Newell called him a c**t, just let me know

Ian posted 93 times in November.but only 2 since,1 this year.

seriouly is there an ATD e-mail address

dane_b wrote:

I see Newell has said he didn't send a pm with the name of the person who invited wratheral to game. We know there is one doing the rounds. I think it should be posted

So do I, by Ian newell on Pasoti. Not by someone else on here on the say so of an untrustworthy source., we're not a bitch media outlet.