Reduced budget next season

Winter Green wrote:

Not much point if there are not many businesses with decent money willing to be involved. Argyle are a busted flush these days, and just like many of us fans, the owner is going to have to up his game if he wants business partners other than what has become the norm recently.  And I mean real businessmen, not academics or some educational quango that come bearing gifts of government grants for his pension pot.  
If we were up North the likes of Dawson would have been a football and Argyle fan. As it is, we're not, he isn't, and we're left with a bunch of fans who have never run a business in their life giving naive ideas from their Plympton semi D.
I'v had a chuckle or two over the last couple of years watching the Pasoti gang try to undermine the club's commercial 'department' at every opportunity, and are at present embarked in discrediting the club's communications 'department'. Anyone would think they wanted the gig for themselves, and on that note does anyone have any idea who got the communications assistant job recently at the club ?

Welcome back ?   

Lord Tisdale wrote:

punchdrunk wrote:

This whole venture is a cost-cutting exercise.

Look, without wishing to start another race war, Harry.P took over a club which, despite its huge crowds and massive history, was £17 million in debt with no revenue streams to service that debt, do you not think that "a cost-cutting exercise" was in order?

You are still £5 million in debt with, apparently, insufficient revenue streams despite the selfless benevolence of Nikk the Userer to service that debt, QED. Costs are still too high.

Your crowds are averaging just under 7k which is nearly half Portsmouth's so a big well done for that, yet you are still potless. Those of you now whining about your playing budget while the likes of Accy, Dags and Morecambe get by on less than or slightly above a quarter of that and others, including the Mighty ECFC and the poor old Turks would give their eye teeths for the same budget, please, please, please, get over it.  

Regarding Portsmouth,how long will they get reasonable sized crowds though ?.

At the moment they are in 20th position and only 2 points off the dreaded bottom two. Football is a funny old game and they could easily end up in the shit if results go against them in the coming weeks and months.

If they did end up going down,then that would be a tragic blow to the club and City. And what a scalp for the Conference clubs to have a crack at.

They [like Argyle] are relying on loan signings to shore up the team. Their Manager said yesterday that it seems players are not proud to wear the Pompey shirt and that was worrying.

Portsmouth have had it, just like we have. Some clubs strike it lucky in admin, like Southampton, and carry on. Most don't.
Pompey can probably rely on their Premiership legacy in fan loyalty for another 3 seasons. After that the fans will disappear quicker than decent new employers,and they'll be back to their former 3 to 4,000 of 20 years ago. But the former owners will be using a slide rule to take as much out of the club as they can without bankrupting it and risking their agreed repayments. A lingering death for a decade and more. A payday mule of a club just like us.

Another couple of years in this league will also see the end of our 6 year Championship legacy. Even counting the non attending St holders as is the way these days, we will still see our published crowds dip below 4,000.
If Brenty boy ever does actually build anything, anywhere, a new pokey stand will only have a 12 month honeymoon period of maybe an extra 1000 over and above at most. Just look at Drakes Circus and many other malls across the country. The big uplifts are over. Well, apart from the lewd jokes.

And in the end, the bad karma passes down to the players. It's inevitable. You rarely escape these things. What young man from elsewhere desperate to make his way is going to give tuppence for a club that has a dodgy feel. These things are real. We're all human.

Winter Green wrote:

Portsmouth have had it, just like we have. Some clubs strike it lucky in admin, like Southampton, and carry on. Most don't.
Pompey can probably rely on their Premiership legacy in fan loyalty for another 3 seasons. After that the fans will disappear quicker than decent new employers,and they'll be back to their former 3 to 4,000 of 20 years ago. But the former owners will be using a slide rule to take as much out of the club as they can without bankrupting it and risking their agreed repayments. A lingering death for a decade and more. A payday mule of a club just like us.

Another couple of years in this league will also see the end of our 6 year Championship legacy. Even counting the non attending St holders as is the way these days, we will still see our published crowds dip below 4,000.
If Brenty boy ever does actually build anything, anywhere, a new pokey stand will only have a 12 month honeymoon period of maybe an extra 1000 over and above at most. Just look at Drakes Circus and many other malls across the country. The big uplifts are over. Well, apart from the lewd jokes.

And in the end, the bad karma passes down to the players. It's inevitable. You rarely escape these things. What young man from elsewhere desperate to make his way is going to give tuppence for a club that has a dodgy feel. These things are real. We're all human.

Absolutely which is why I genuinely fear now for the future of the club as we know it, I think the faithful 6k will quickly dwindle to sub 5k at best in a couple of seasons if the mid/bottom 6 league 2 scenario continues the lack of ambition from Brent as his cronies will permeate the fan base, future mangers and players. I would say it already is - most games now, the atmosphere is pretty flat yesterday it is fair to say consisted of a lot of disgruntled fans me included and we won!

I can't see why James Brent does not get some football savvy people [with a bit of spare cash] to get on board at Argyle. He has got what he wanted,which is this development lark. The least he could do is make an effort.

Back to Pompey again..[Echoes of the Fletcher era at Home Park not that long ago..]

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Winter Green wrote:Portsmouth have had it, just like we have. Some clubs strike it lucky in admin, like Southampton, and carry on. Most don't.
Pompey can probably rely on their Premiership legacy in fan loyalty for another 3 seasons. After that the fans will disappear quicker than decent new employers,and they'll be back to their former 3 to 4,000 of 20 years ago. But the former owners will be using a slide rule to take as much out of the club as they can without bankrupting it and risking their agreed repayments. A lingering death for a decade and more. A payday mule of a club just like us.

Another couple of years in this league will also see the end of our 6 year Championship legacy. Even counting the non attending St holders as is the way these days, we will still see our published crowds dip below 4,000.
If Brenty boy ever does actually build anything, anywhere, a new pokey stand will only have a 12 month honeymoon period of maybe an extra 1000 over and above at most. Just look at Drakes Circus and many other malls across the country. The big uplifts are over. Well, apart from the lewd jokes.

And in the end, the bad karma passes down to the players. It's inevitable. You rarely escape these things. What young man from elsewhere desperate to make his way is going to give tuppence for a club that has a dodgy feel. These things are real. We're all human.

Absolutely which is why I genuinely fear now for the future of the club as we know it, I think the faithful 6k will quickly dwindle to sub 5k at best in a couple of seasons if the mid/bottom 6 league 2 scenario continues the lack of ambition from Brent as his cronies will permeate the fan base, future mangers and players. I would say it already is - most games now, the atmosphere is pretty flat yesterday it is fair to say consisted of a lot of disgruntled fans me included and we won!

VillageGreen wrote:

They [like Argyle] are relying on loan signings to shore up the team. Their Manager said yesterday that it seems players are not proud to wear the Pompey shirt and that was worrying.

The one thing they they have going for them, which you eschewed, other of course than actually being a big club, is that they are being run by fans rather than a property developer.

They, like so many others, are following the well worn path of journeymen and loaners, odd really when I watched their erstwhile rivals, there is no such thing as the "dockyard derby", lose fairly unluckily to £200 million Spurs with a team full of youngsters from their academy and judicious bargain buys.

Village... nope you are wrong,argyle are not relying on loan signings at this moment in time,just proper signings.And the defence is looking rather good.As for being run by fans for fans,thats laughable considering argyle were once fans run by fans straight into admin...

greensleeves wrote:

Village... nope you are wrong,argyle are not relying on loan signings at this moment in time,just proper signings.And the defence is looking rather good.As for being run by fans for fans,thats laughable considering argyle were once fans run by fans straight into admin...

Won't be too long before you're choking on you're own words Greensleeves....or are you too stupid to see whats blindingly obvious to the rest of us ?

Portsmouth supporters basically thought they were going to piss this division. Whatever they are getting now won't last

Football has followed the outside industrial scene.
Leaving out the big money, board rooms,the big clubs, the big corporations and the big steals, the whole country and it's Auntie from football to healthcare is being run on "loanees". It's cowboy economics and cowboy football. No wonder we're in big trouble. Nobody wants to actually employ someone decently anymore, be responsible for their injuries, and invest in their future. Rack and stack is what Holloway used to call it in football terms leaving little option for the small clubs to nurture it's local talent.
If you actually mean to advance, in the end it is counter productive to rely too much on "Agency staff" and/or football agents that are not much more than glorified gangmasters.
I laughed at Gardner's million pound 25 a year striker comments and I still laugh every January. What was it last season ? ah yes ... the outstanding individual is an intelligent operator, he's saving some of his budget for January. Pleeeeeeeeeeeease Brenty. And you Greensleeves. It's just noise pollution.
Any fan can see there's hardly a decent player in the squad capable of playing at a higher level and that won't be changing in January. Only one player out of all these comings and goings in the last couple of years has actually shown anything, and that was the little Palace winger who scored a few late in the season and saved the team from relegation on his own.

Like.

greensleeves wrote:

Village... nope you are wrong,argyle are not relying on loan signings at this moment in time,just proper signings.And the defence is looking rather good.As for being run by fans for fans,thats laughable considering argyle were once fans run by fans straight into admin...

Blackman - loan (I think ... or was he a free agent?)
Reid - loan
Lavery - loan
Obadeyi - loan
Reckord - loan


Blackman looked to be one of the worst players I've seen to have the privilege of gracing the green shirt.

Lavery looks damn good for us and scored a very good goal yesterday. Reid played unimpressively yesterday (maybe getting used to have a player of skill to play alongside) but has been doing well by all accounts. Obadeyi looked unimpressive when I saw him but also had the unpredictability of Bolasie (without the innate skill).

So you are right - just four real loanees out of a match-day squad of 16 made up with out-of-contrats & frees. That's what happens in this division.

Knecht you are confusing season long loans with short term loans with short term contracts with free agents..I made the same mistake myself....

greensleeves wrote:

Knecht  you are confusing  season long loans with short term loans with short term contracts with free agents..I made the same mistake myself....

Sorry, I know you're not used to that on here, I was actually agreeing with you    even though what you're saying doesn't quite make sense.

I got my info fromHERE. But even they made a mistake by not recording Reckord as a loanee from Wolves.

Tringreen wrote:

Winter Green wrote:

Not much point if there are not many businesses with decent money willing to be involved. Argyle are a busted flush these days, and just like many of us fans, the owner is going to have to up his game if he wants business partners other than what has become the norm recently.  And I mean real businessmen, not academics or some educational quango that come bearing gifts of government grants for his pension pot.  
If we were up North the likes of Dawson would have been a football and Argyle fan. As it is, we're not, he isn't, and we're left with a bunch of fans who have never run a business in their life giving naive ideas from their Plympton semi D.
I'v had a chuckle or two over the last couple of years watching the Pasoti gang try to undermine the club's commercial 'department' at every opportunity, and are at present embarked in discrediting the club's communications 'department'. Anyone would think they wanted the gig for themselves, and on that note does anyone have any idea who got the communications assistant job recently at the club ?

Welcome back ?   

Foreshore.   

Lord Tisdale wrote:

VillageGreen wrote:

They [like Argyle] are relying on loan signings to shore up the team. Their Manager said yesterday that it seems players are not proud to wear the Pompey shirt and that was worrying.

The one thing they they have going for them, which you eschewed, other of course than actually being a big club, is that they are being run by fans rather than a property developer.

They, like so many others, are following the well worn path of journeymen and loaners, odd really when I watched their erstwhile rivals, there is no such thing as the "dockyard derby", lose fairly unluckily to £200 million Spurs with a team full of youngsters from their academy and judicious bargain buys.

The Soton academy is absurdly well run compared to the short term-ism that has always been the case on the island. Expecting Portsmouth's kids to suddenly step into league football without the sort of investment needed 5 years ago is fanciful. I'm not sure who the last youth player to get into their side was out of choice rather than necessity, itd probably pre-date 'Arry and mad Mandaric though. Supat Rungratsumee there isn't.

greensleeves wrote:

.As for being run by fans for fans,thats laughable considering argyle were once fans run by fans straight into admin...

That's pretty garbled, I can't imagine anyone on ATD being stupid enough to use a phrase like "fans run for fans" or even "fans run by fans", but then again you are just a Pashiite plant so I suppose intelligence would be the last thing one might expect you to display.

In that vein I should acknowledge that Argyle do have one intrinsically unique perspective for a football club, where else would on find so many sheep run by a pig?

Winter Green wrote:

Football has followed the outside industrial scene.
Leaving out the big money, board rooms,the big clubs, the big corporations and the big steals, the whole country and it's Auntie from football to healthcare is being run on "loanees". It's cowboy economics and cowboy football. No wonder we're in big trouble. Nobody wants to actually employ someone decently anymore, be responsible for their injuries, and invest in their future. Rack and stack is what Holloway used to call it in football terms leaving little option for the small clubs to nurture it's local talent.
If you actually mean to advance, in the end it is counter productive to rely too much on "Agency staff" and/or football agents that are not much more than glorified gangmasters.
I laughed at Gardner's million pound 25 a year striker comments and I still laugh every January. What was it last season ? ah yes ... the outstanding individual is an intelligent operator, he's saving some of his budget for January. Pleeeeeeeeeeeease Brenty. And you Greensleeves. It's just noise pollution.
Any fan can see there's hardly a decent player in the squad capable of playing at a higher level and that won't be changing in January. Only one player out of all these comings and goings in the last couple of years has actually shown anything, and that was the little Palace winger who scored a few late in the season and saved the team from relegation on his own.

Good - a man of some vision, none very palatable but at least realistic - perhaps the reason I am never short of 5 pints when entering the Lyndhurst!!   

[quote="Lord Tisdale"]

greensleeves wrote:

.As for being run by fans for fans,thats laughable considering argyle were once fans run by fans straight into admin...

That's pretty garbled, I can't imagine anyone on ATD being stupid enough to use a phrase like "fans run for fans" or even "fans run by fans", but then again you are just a Pashiite plant so I suppose intelligence would be the last thing one might expect you to display.

In that vein I should acknowledge that Argyle do have one intrinsically unique perspective for a football club, where else would on find so many sheep run by a pig?[/quote

and you are an exeter pig...intelligence on the fingers of one finger

Lord Tisdale wrote:

punchdrunk wrote:

This whole venture is a cost-cutting exercise.

Look, without wishing to start another race war, Harry.P took over a club which, despite its huge crowds and massive history, was £17 million in debt with no revenue streams to service that debt, do you not think that "a cost-cutting exercise" was in order?

You are still £5 million in debt with, apparently, insufficient revenue streams despite the selfless benevolence of Nikk the Userer to service that debt, QED. Costs are still too high.

Your crowds are averaging just under 7k which is nearly half Portsmouth's so a big well done for that, yet you are still potless. Those of you now whining about your playing budget while the likes of Accy, Dags and Morecambe get by on less than or slightly above a quarter of that and others, including the Mighty ECFC and the poor old Turks would give their eye teeths for the same budget, please, please, please, get over it.  

Not read the rest of the thread, just felt compelled to reply this hyperbole.

The very fact we're still £5m in debt after 2 years of ownership suggests to me only an Exeter supporter would be happy. The £17m, if there was any justice, would be charged to previous owners, surely even you would agree with that? The fact we're potless despite decent attendances is a reason for concern, don't be jel

greensleeves wrote:

and you are an exeter pig...intelligence on the fingers of one finger

Oh my!

Easy to see why the Big Gay Bear holds such definitive sway with acolytes like this total fork'tard, the only question which exercises me is, did he get his green sleeves by sticking his one finger somewhere he shouldn't have? I mean the Pork ain't no Nigel Farage, but I guess their infat'pig'uation knows few boundaries.

Coxside_Green wrote:

Lord Tisdale wrote:

punchdrunk wrote:

This whole venture is a cost-cutting exercise.

Look, without wishing to start another race war, Harry.P took over a club which, despite its huge crowds and massive history, was £17 million in debt with no revenue streams to service that debt, do you not think that "a cost-cutting exercise" was in order?

You are still £5 million in debt with, apparently, insufficient revenue streams despite the selfless benevolence of Nikk the Userer to service that debt, QED. Costs are still too high.

Your crowds are averaging just under 7k which is nearly half Portsmouth's so a big well done for that, yet you are still potless. Those of you now whining about your playing budget while the likes of Accy, Dags and Morecambe get by on less than or slightly above a quarter of that and others, including the Mighty ECFC and the poor old Turks would give their eye teeths for the same budget, please, please, please, get over it.  

Not read the rest of the thread, just felt compelled to reply this hyperbole.

The very fact we're still £5m in debt after 2 years of ownership suggests to me only an Exeter supporter would be happy.  The £17m, if there was any justice, would be charged to previous owners, surely even you would agree with that?  The fact we're potless despite decent attendances is a reason for concern, don't be jel

"hyperbole"?

Extravagant exaggeration?

Not so chum, merely objective observation of the facts.

The only thing I can get into lock step with is the issue of limited liability, no one should be able to walk away from a debt they created with their pockets jangling with cash, I would lock every director of every fecking bank up for the rest of their naturals, your mob wouldn't get much better, obviously there would be some mitigation for them setting a path for you lot back to your natural level, but mugging off the St.John Ambulance?

greensleeves wrote:

Village... nope you are wrong,argyle are not relying on loan signings at this moment in time,just proper signings.And the defence is looking rather good.As for being run by fans for fans,thats laughable considering argyle were once fans run by fans straight into admin...

So you can't see the difference between a supporters trust and a group of businessmen?