Torquay are favorites

oddball wrote:

SG...no no ....I'm talking real time...I know the jewson lot...shall we start at james brent,then peter jones ,dave felwick.....ian newell if you like.. I'm just a fan who doesn't like being 17th in league division 2.

impressve or what!!

Greenjock wrote:

GreenWhiteBlack wrote:

How else could we have lined up yesterday? Most teams play 4-5-1 away from home

Well our 3 front men were all under 5'8" and our tactic was to pump long diagonal balls towards them?

Torquay had a midget winger who waltzed his way through our defence several times and was a real danger.

I don't know how else we could've lined up, but that's because Fletcher has signed a bunch of shite players of which there are too many similar players who are lightweight and frankly not good enough. Why sign Gurrieri and then Gorman on loan if both of them are thought less deserving of a starting place than Lennox who we already had at the club, and who by the way has hardly set the world alight has he?

It's baffling to me why half of our squad was retained this year and now Fletcher keeps signing more and more players like the ones we already have

If Gorman isn't as good as Lennox let him go back to Wolves and he can get fit elsewhere and have his wages paid. Gurrieri is tiny and easy to push off the ball, just like Sims is. So why keep signing more like them?

We need a really decent midfielder and the only way we could get one is to either release or loan out several of our crap squad.

I think the long diagonal ball is an inevitable consequence of the decision to line up 4-1-4-1 and that the 4-1-4-1 is a consciously made and deliberate tactical decision aimed at cutting out the supply to the oppositions big man up front. Last week the big man was Akinfenwa and yesterday it was Rene Howe. Basically it is safety first and Wotton tries to get in between the supply and the target with a view to choking off supply or, at least, interfering with it. Defensively it worked yesterday because Torquay, unlike Northampton last week, didn't score and so it wasn't changed. Offensively it is obviously limiting because it leaves us a man short up front and Wotton has neither the legs, speed, dribbling ability nor inclination to run very far with the ball so he looks up and quarterbacks it out to a wide player who has found some space out wide resulting in the long diagonal ball. The 4-1-4-1 also sees Wotton as being the easy ball when possession gets squeezed when we attack. Once again he gets the ball because he is playing deep and sitting in space and once again all the options are in front of him resulting in the long diagonal ball.

I think it is fair to say we shouldn't be where we are league and position wise given a lot of things but we are there and have to live with that. It is not Fletcher's fault that we are in the basement. I have no idea what his budget is and nor do any of you. It is not his fault that the budget is the budget he has to work with. That isn't endorsing him as a manager it is a simple fact of life.

This club has a history of losing not just over one season but over numerous seasons now. The pressing need is to reverse the mentality that leads or helps us to lose. I think that's where Fletcher's head is. From what I see the simple tactic is try not to lose. By not losing then it instills a bit of confidence that you probably won't. Building a winning mentality is a little harder but it must start by not losing. He is a novice that's true but he needs or thinks he needs to build the confidence first and foremost. Maybe when that losing habit isn't so prevalent then he will change tack and try to win rather than not lose. I might be way wide of the mark but that's how I see what he does.

This isn't going to endear him to the masses as the comments on here and elsewhere indicate. It isn't going to entertain the masses either. I don't know if he is right or wrong but I guess time will tell. Whether people like it or not we are the third club in Devon right now and it was a decent point yesterday. Torquay fans would have a right to have expected better for them and so they should. No patronising from me merse I promise you.

Just spoke to my neighbour who is a Torquay home and away die hard, his verdict? "an alwful game", listened to it on the radio, sparksy was somewhat baffled by playing Feeney up front as lone striker. Great tatic of course as Feeney is known for his prolific goal scoring is'nt he?. More confirmation for me that Fletcher is tatically naive, but that's what comes of Brent employing the cheap easy option. Short sighted? it's pratically blind. Sure we played better the second half, but we did'nt score. Yes we are the third best team in Devon, and all credit to Exeter for being where they are at the moment in the league given their budget. But fellow Greenies we are'nt where Exeter are because the clubs owners have no vision or experience - it's not all down to budget I don't accept that. This situation of getting in more strikers because the ones Fletcher and Brent have either kept or bought in are crap, is nothing short of laughable. Budget my arse, they don't know what the feck they are doing.

It's getting a bit of a habit now playing well for 45 minutes. Too late against Oxford, turned the game round against Northampton and we were lucky to not be behind yesterday before we started playing.

Playing well for 45 minutes isn't enough, so whatever is making the team buck up should be said or done from the start.

But that's what I mean by setting out not to lose Jock. We waste a half of the game trying to achieve that and it is only when the game is half over that we try to win it if it isn't too late. For the spectator that is crap to watch but for a result driven occupation then for Fletcher it isn't. I'm only trying to read why Fletcher would play like this and the only solution I can come up with is that he is trying to overturn the losing mentality that has been around for too long. Despite his lack of experience and as some would say ability. he still must have a game plan in his head even if it isn't always obvious.

Which is fine away from home when you're winning your home games, but we haven't been.

If all Fletcher is after is an improvement on the last few seasons then it's going to be a long long time until we see the dizzy heights of League 1 again.

That's where the lack of experience comes in though. I think the losing thing extends to both home and away sadly. We have been crap results wise both home and away for so long now that I don't think he can see the difference. One slight glimmer of light might be the last home match. Same old first half. Second half he did change it and the players he brought on showed they could score and play quite well. Just maybe he will learn from this Feeney on his own start to a game and actually start with an attacking line up. It is not a crime to lack experience but it is a crime not to learn lessons as you gain it.

GOB wrote:

According to our manager!

I think that sums up PAFC very well at the moment.

Haven't read the rest of this thread but for the manager of PAFC to say ................

Plymouth Argyle manager Carl Fletcher tells BBC Radio Devon that he was pleased with his side's bravery in trying to retain possession during the goalless draw at Torquay.

tells me all I need to know about how far he's moved this group of players on.



The classic though is, ' Errrrrrm yeah, Torquay are a good side and it's a difficult place to visit, y' know what I mean ?'

Welcome back Tring! How are things?

mouldyoldgoat wrote:

Welcome back Tring! How are things?

A bit better than they were a week ago today mouldybloke. Haven't had a beer for 6 days in this hellish sandpit.

a pour game ,,turkeys shaded the first half and the second was even stephens,,,,they wernt ripping us apart jock,jake had little to do,,,

Brent couldn't give a toss he will do just enough to keep the aviva's moderately happy and no more.

Sadly that's the way it seems Grumpy.

tcm wrote:

a pour game ,,turkeys shaded the first half and the second was even stephens,,,,they wernt ripping us apart jock,jake had little to do,,,

I didn't say they ripped us apart, but I did say Stevens waltzed through our defence, which according to sparksy several times he did, and I Saud it seems like we only play for 45 minutes and we were lucky to be level at halftime.

Went to the game and was pleased with what I saw. I saw Torquay struggle against a side devoid of ideas, short on experience and going backwards. Fletcher will take you nowhere and you appear to be wasting a season. Luckily this is a very very poor league. I actually don't think your experienced players or your yoof think Fletcher is the right person and that comes across on the pitch.

Fletcher goes and who will take his job, probably another with no experience, Purse...you will waste another season or two.

What also is becoming evident is that your fans don't see you as a big club anymore...they expect to lose, happy with a goaless draw and in the end they will drift away and money will become tighter and things will get even worse.

You had the chance with the Trust to get real fan involvement (you have got the opposite), more community spirit, an "we are all in it together" mentality. You gave that up for an owner who doesn't know football, a manager that has no contacts and cannot manage, a lack of real transparency and accountability at board level and have taken a further backward step as a professional football club.

You would have been better off going bust and starting again, you could have been a real force

waiting for the scummer lovers to come and lick your arse,,,,they wont be long

The Red Star wrote:

Went to the game and was pleased with what I saw. I saw Torquay struggle against a side devoid of ideas, short on experience and going backwards. Fletcher will take you nowhere and you appear to be wasting a season. Luckily this is a very very poor league. I actually don't think your experienced players or your yoof think Fletcher is the right person and that comes across on the pitch.

Fletcher goes and who will take his job, probably another with no experience, Purse...you will waste another season or two.

What also is becoming evident is that your fans don't see you as a big club anymore...they expect to lose, happy with a goaless draw and in the end they will drift away and money will become tighter and things will get even worse.

You had the chance with the Trust to get real fan involvement (you have got the opposite), more community spirit, an "we are all in it together" mentality. You gave that up for an owner who doesn't know football, a manager that has no contacts and cannot manage, a lack of real transparency and accountability at board level and have taken a further backward step as a professional football club.

You would have been better off going bust and starting again, you could have been a real force

Why do you have to copy everything I have been saying for 12 month's?

tcm wrote:

waiting for the scummer lovers to come and lick your arse,,,,they wont be long

The trick is to respond to the person, regardless of their football-supporting handicaps, ponder the points they've made, and then tell them they're talking bollocks...

(FWIW, Mr Star usually calls it about right, and that post is no exception...)

Good post Red Star, well I'm one of those that have drifted away (for the time being) as long as Fletcher is manager we will be limited to getting players only from Burnley or Bournmouth. The whole situation is lacking any ambition I'm afraid I can think of better ways of parting with £20 on a Saturday at the moment.

akagreengull wrote:

Good post Red Star, well I'm one of those that have drifted away (for the time being) as long as Fletcher is manager we will be limited to getting players only from Burnley or Bournmouth. The whole situation is lacking any ambition I'm afraid I can think of better ways of parting with £20 on a Saturday at the moment.

Spot on you and lots of others (me included)

If want to watch a pub team there are lots of places I can do that for free.

yeah yeah yeah,,,,,roll up for the 4th division syndrom ,,,,,

Mike have you spoke to Tony yet? To ask at what point the club were in the shit and when that was in relation to ordering the new pitch?

Just wondering like, seeing as he's not to blame for any of this shit.

jock youle find him at HPmate if you have questions go and ask them,i am totallly 100% not interested in that side of footy as well you know,,,,,,i dont like the word blame,it dosnt interest me either,the thought questioning some one at the match just makes me laugh,and the thought of doing it on some one elses behalf,,,,, ,,,naa,,i like the saying (its no good crying over spilt milk) or some thing like that,,,,,i get exactly out of football what i need,any football fan that dosnt know its about taking a punt (which you can win or loose)is gona either be happy as a sand boy or down in the dumps,,,,,its supposed to be a enjoyable day out something nice to do ,if you cant enjoy it dont do it,,,,,so sorry jock i wont be asking qeustions on anyones behalf,

That's fair enough Mike but you did jump to his defence that's all.

My view is he may well be a supporter but he does have questions to answer along with the other six.

I know you don't like all the politics but until certain questions are answered I don't think he should go to home park and definitely not be sponsoring games.