What's going on? (my look on problems at argyle)

Hello

I have probably not been watching Argyle for anywhere near as long as the majority of you but I feel like 10 years of home and away matches is certainly enough to feel like your part of the club, this is your club and you couldn't possibly support anybody else. Plymouth Argyle is something to look forward to, something to escape to, lets hope the future is brighter than the previous 4 years in which we (the fans) have suffered a great deal, but our support and loyalty to the football club has never dwindled but unfortunately, I feel it might be about to as the Brent Bandwagon starts to wear off slightly as we approach the season as a normal fully functional football club. Please, don't get me wrong, I am not a member of the anti Brent or the anti Fletcher or even the anti pasoti/trust crew, but I do have some serious concerns that can apply to all three of those areas.

In the early days of the Japanese owners, and also Todd and Gardener, nobody was really that worried and we actually thought with the new investment the club could head on to new horizons, and to be honest. Never trust anybody, something I think a lot of people need to take on board now, learning from earlier mistakes. the appointment of Peter Reid brought about a wave of excitement and I felt like our team (at the start of league 1) were good enough to chase promotion, which we all know was most certainly not to be.

As the club just plummeted in a downward spiral, the unwavering support from the fans shocked myself and many others, the fan base just went from strength to strength and after a woeful process conducted by Brenda we were finally rescued, and I am forever in debt to James Brent for that. Terrible results throughout last season tested the green army's patience, but when called upon (vigil, staff fund etc) the fans most certainly delivered and helped the club through the worst time in it's history. That chapter of PAFC is over, that is the exact problem.

Okay so the last 3 paragraphs summed up the past, the PAST. Plymouth Argyle now is (or at least should be) a fully operational, functional club which can move in the right direction on a sustainable basis. Yet the quote "we should be happy we have a club at all" is said with pride and triumph far to often. Yes, I am delighted we have a club to support as I was next to certain we would fold last season, but frankly, will people use this quote for the whole season, and next season, and the season after, I hope not but I fear that will be the case. There is no longer a noticeable 'off field problem' with the club, so why does the drama of last seasons crisis now affect the 2012-13 campaign? The financial disaster of the previous seasons will be used a scapegoat as we under perform this season. Brent's statements will turn from statements of promotion to statements of 'at least I saved your club', please, this isn't bashing James Brent, this is fairly simple logic, this brings me on nicely to 'the budget'...

So, James Brent has come out with multiple statements now declaring that carl fletcher should have a budget in which we can challenge for promotion, I am sorry, but if this was true I don't think Carl Fletcher (who I trust greatly) will have purchased an unknown non league youngster, an injury prone player and an average goalkeeper, not moaning at these players, it's just, they don't exactly set the world on fire. Also, it's actually rather embarrassing that Fletcher is being forced (I use that term loosely) to go picking through the Welsh leagues, which are in my opinion of the same quality level as Tiverton, who we had a struggle against last night. Let's all remember, James Brent has no prior experience in football and he has no knowledge of how our team compares to the rest of the league. I am not saying James Brent is trying to be cocky or anything, I simply feel he is being rather clumsy making statements about the football side of things, I seriously worry whether James Brent feels the current side is good enough for this 'promotion push'.

The playing side of things, well, I am not going to go bashing anybody before a ball is even kicked, any man that pulls on the green shirt deserves to have the fans full support, however our lack of attacking options worries me. What worries me more is looking at our team compared to others in this league, teams like Rotherham, Fleetwood, Southend will run rings around us. We are now carrying an injured player, we have no decent strikers or indeed much back up in defence. The alarming lack of transfer activity and incoming trialists is something to be concerned about, not to mention the pre season performances.

I am excited for the season, I can't wait to get back into the Devonport and sing my heart out for the lads, I am even 'buzzing for saturday's meeting with Birmingham, nothing will shoot my enthusiasm down. Perhaps my worries are unfounded, perhaps I shouldn't be judging us before a ball is kicked. We will see over the next 2 weeks, but I really don't think we are going to be wowed with much transfer activity.

4000+ people have pledged faith in the club and joined up, including myself, hopefully we will see that faith returned.

Maybe you agree with this post, maybe you don't, but I feel some of the worries expressed are those which sit in the stomach's of many Argyle fans.

Cobi Budge

Could of just said we're shit,would've save you a few minutes of your life doing something interesting.

I'm still undecided if it's Brent who is not releasing enough funds, Fletcher who isn't up to it or a combination of both.

I do wonder why a lot of the budget was spent on retaining players from last season who just aren't up to the task in my opinion, and maybe Fletcher feels comfortable with these players because he knows them, but from what I saw last night, it's going to be a long old season again.

On the retention I just wonder if some were on a promise of another year in return for wage reduction/deferral.

In light of the 55% salary cap exactly how much to blame is Brent for the budget that Fletcher has? The game has subtly changed and things are not what they once were.

Tbh didn't read it all but I got the jist of it

Anyone that thinks we are going to be up there challenging for the play offs / promotion as we are is completely delusional. We need a new RB, new CM, two new wingers and a striker (I'm holding back slating the signing of Fireman Sam for the time being). Unless these guys are found, we are f****d.

However, get these in and I think we could do something special (CF is the right man for us IMO)

If the Owner isn't to blame SFD then who is? We have gates that exceed most other clubs and I would presume our other income interests aren't much different from them so overall we should have more money. But, other Owners are clearly putting their hands in their pockets to some extent and it is clear that Brent isn't. There in lies the difference in what a Manager has to spend. I don't think anyone expects, other than a few, that Brent is going to go gung-ho at the transfer market and spend millions but I think he has led people to believe he will do at least something towards what it takes to move the club along. The quote being that he believes that Argyle should be in the Championship at least and he will do what it takes to get us back there.

I think there has been a shift in that attitude and he isn't actually prepared to do it out of non Argyle funds. He didn't say he would do it this season or next but it was not unreasonable for supporters to believe it would be sooner rather than later. He hasn't exactly lied and has always said Argyle should be self financing. But, perception is everything to a supporter and there in lies the problem. Expectation having been raised doesn't look like being realised and the love affair is in danger of wearing off when you read posts from staunch followers such as Cobi. If he has lost the love affair then it seems logical that the numbers will drop following the disappointment and therefore the budget will suffer even more. I am not confident that Argyle can or will mount a challenge this season but am still clinging on to hope at least.

But it's his money, Sensible, it's up to him how he spends it

Is THIS more sign of the natives getting restless?

Looks like reality might be setting in. I hope we're wrong but the signs aren't that positive that Brent isn't just picking off the carcass for personal gain and will up sticks when it suits him leaving a tenant with no assets once again looking for someone to "save" us, but this time with no real estate involved.

Absolutely knecht and that has been my stance all along which hasn't changed. I still think there was an expectation which leads to the posts on here and the beginnings of similar posts elsewhere. The expectation is fast wearing off which is not a good sign for the floating voters who make up the other half of the matchday crowd.

What a long post.

Beer and birds, cobi. Start to take an interest in one of these or both. It will shorten up your posts

knecht wrote:

But it's his money, Sensible, it's up to him how he spends it

Is THIS more sign of the natives getting restless?

You better believe it Knecht.

Attempting to keep the natives happy with a few murals on the Demport end, a f*ck off BIG flag as a c*ck extension and a couple of wholesome janner bheys rallying the troops is wearing thin before the MASSIVE Fleetwood and Rotherham have even pitched up at Home Park.

Competitive budget? Yeah maybe for the SWL!

Brent isnt going to part with a dime end of.

Cue the usual Harry propagandists to defuse Mr Harris's accurate observation

I thought you could only be depressed on ATD.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Saltash green wrote:

What a long post.

Beer and birds, cobi. Start to take an interest in one of these or both. It will shorten up your posts

Fortunately, the girlfriend is a PAFC season ticket holder.

This is interesting from Pasoti as well. Where people think Argyle will be on January 1st 2013. Let's say the talk of play-offs on other threads is conspicuous by it's absence.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

In light of the 55% salary cap exactly how much to blame is Brent for the budget that Fletcher has? The game has subtly changed and things are not what they once were.

They don't seem to have "subtly changed" for a lot of teams in this division,who are signing reasonable quality players on far less projected and actual gate money than Argyle.Maybe the only subtle change from our championship days is that although we've still got a local businessman in charge,inadequate funding will now be provided two rungs lower down the scale.

All this crap about it will take 2 or 3 years to re-build is really starting to wear thin now, other clubs on a par size wise are already in leagues above us. Other clubs are going to come from lower leagues and overtake us and they aren't all owned by Saudi billionaires. We have a millionaire owner who is only concerned with the asset stripping of the club and adding to his pension fund, when we went for the safe and cheap option of signing Fletcher it was a nail in the already screwed down lid of Argyles cofffin. Without MacDonald, Hemmings and Tsoumou (who wasn't even that brilliant) we will be lucky to be as crap as we were last year. Where are the goals going to come from?

"Whats going on" is that as fans we were fed the line that "we should be in the championship" the reality is now kicking in that with 16 days to go to the first league game, we have a mediocre squad. I personally trust my own footballing intuition and knowledge and the views of other seasoned Argyle followers rather than the crass comments about our positive prospects from Fletcher and Brent. Which is we are in for a season of average performances and football quality.

You may have been saved for now but Argyle look dead in the water to me.

You have not got any money, the money Brent has (and can access!!) he won't spend. Fletcher is an absolute shite manager and easily the cheapest option in the entire football league (he has no contacts, he has no experience, he is a yes man) and you still think your Club is something special outside Plymouth. At the moment it isn't seen as anything special inside Plymouth.

Your population doesn't care, they would rather watch Man Utd on TV like the rest of the plastic generation than attend an Argyle match or for that matter a Man Utd match. Before you get your flabby arses in your hands and say this is sour grapes from a City fan, you need to understand this has been reality for us for 20 years.

You aint going down, however you won't be finishing higher than your position last season. Fletcher will be sacked within the first 10 league games, Purse will then be placed in caretaker charge and the whole cycle will repeat itself.

The Red Star wrote:

You may have been saved for now but Argyle look dead in the water to me.

You have not got any money, the money Brent has (and can access!!) he won't spend. Fletcher is an absolute shite manager and easily the cheapest option in the entire football league (he has no contacts, he has no experience, he is a yes man) and you still think your Club is something special outside Plymouth. At the moment it isn't seen as anything special inside Plymouth.

Your population doesn't care, they would rather watch Man Utd on TV like the rest of the plastic generation than attend an Argyle match or for that matter a Man Utd match. Before you get your flabby arses in your hands and say this is sour grapes from a City fan, you need to understand this has been reality for us for 20 years.

You aint going down, however you won't be finishing higher than your position last season. Fletcher will be sacked within the first 10 league games, Purse will then be placed in caretaker charge and the whole cycle will repeat itself.

Did you read something on Pasoti and decide to reply to it here?

The Red Star wrote:

You may have been saved for now but Argyle look dead in the water to me.

You have not got any money, the money Brent has (and can access!!) he won't spend. Fletcher is an absolute shite manager and easily the cheapest option in the entire football league (he has no contacts, he has no experience, he is a yes man) and you still think your Club is something special outside Plymouth. At the moment it isn't seen as anything special inside Plymouth.

Your population doesn't care, they would rather watch Man Utd on TV like the rest of the plastic generation than attend an Argyle match or for that matter a Man Utd match. Before you get your flabby arses in your hands and say this is sour grapes from a City fan, you need to understand this has been reality for us for 20 years.

You aint going down, however you won't be finishing higher than your position last season. Fletcher will be sacked within the first 10 league games, Purse will then be placed in caretaker charge and the whole cycle will repeat itself.

And yet we still had a better ave attendance lady year than you? Oh dear...

With regards to fletch, I think he has the makings of a good manager tbh. He is the cheap option I agree but he created a cohesiveness that we didn't have before, the one thing fletch and Ro have is a passion and a belief in the club and the city, that passion keeps things together.

I have concerns about this season though, the jb bubble hasn't burst because I never really saw him as anything other than a businessman looking to make money, I think he genuinely believes that we will do well. His naivate works against him in football terms.

A couple of decent signings and we will be ok this year. Ecfc on the other hand? Well who knows!

Mrrapson wrote:

The Red Star wrote:

You may have been saved for now but Argyle look dead in the water to me.

You have not got any money, the money Brent has (and can access!!) he won't spend. Fletcher is an absolute shite manager and easily the cheapest option in the entire football league (he has no contacts, he has no experience, he is a yes man) and you still think your Club is something special outside Plymouth. At the moment it isn't seen as anything special inside Plymouth.

Your population doesn't care, they would rather watch Man Utd on TV like the rest of the plastic generation than attend an Argyle match or for that matter a Man Utd match. Before you get your flabby arses in your hands and say this is sour grapes from a City fan, you need to understand this has been reality for us for 20 years.

You aint going down, however you won't be finishing higher than your position last season. Fletcher will be sacked within the first 10 league games, Purse will then be placed in caretaker charge and the whole cycle will repeat itself.

And yet we still had a better ave attendance lady year than you? Oh dear...

With regards to fletch, I think he has the makings of a good manager tbh. He is the cheap option I agree but he created a cohesiveness that we didn't have before, the one thing fletch and Ro have is a passion and a belief in the club and the city, that passion keeps things together.

I have concerns about this season though, the jb bubble hasn't burst because I never really saw him as anything other than a businessman looking to make money, I think he genuinely believes that we will do well. His naivate works against him in football terms.

A couple of decent signings and we will be ok this year. Ecfc on the other hand? Well who knows!

Is this a euphemism?

Lol, no. Typo, I'm on my phone!

Iggy wrote:

The Red Star wrote:

You may have been saved for now but Argyle look dead in the water to me.

You have not got any money, the money Brent has (and can access!!) he won't spend. Fletcher is an absolute shite manager and easily the cheapest option in the entire football league (he has no contacts, he has no experience, he is a yes man) and you still think your Club is something special outside Plymouth. At the moment it isn't seen as anything special inside Plymouth.

Your population doesn't care, they would rather watch Man Utd on TV like the rest of the plastic generation than attend an Argyle match or for that matter a Man Utd match. Before you get your flabby arses in your hands and say this is sour grapes from a City fan, you need to understand this has been reality for us for 20 years.

You aint going down, however you won't be finishing higher than your position last season. Fletcher will be sacked within the first 10 league games, Purse will then be placed in caretaker charge and the whole cycle will repeat itself.

Did you read something on Pasoti and decide to reply to it here?

Iggy, I was banned from Pasoti 2 years ago and read nothing there. You lot really are a little tetchy aren't you.

Mrrapson wrote:

Lol, no. Typo, I'm on my phone!

Thats what Sol Campbell said

The Red Star wrote:

Mrrapson wrote:

Lol, no. Typo, I'm on my phone!

Thats what Sol Campbell said