Closer to play-offs next year than some might think??

Don't shoot me down, and I haven't checked my facts BUT

In our first 18 matches of this season, I think we managed a paltry 9 points. We then brought in some more experienced players and
from the remaining 28 games, we manages to muster 37 points. That's just over 1.3pts a match.

If we had had the experienced players in from the start of the season, on that form, we could have hit 60pts for the season (46 x 1.3)

Crewe made the play-offs with 72pts this season.

Are we in slightly better shape for next season than some of us might think?

Nope!

Even that would have seen us finish precisely mid table. The only thing of concern is how to turn a mid table team who have played to not lose into a team that wins.

At the moment those stats would make us as good as Port Vale. How much effort, new players and a change in playing style are required to turn us into Swindon Shrewsbury or Crawley.

I think we are a long way off even getting in the playoffs. All power to the Board and the management over the summer.

Captain Spudgun wrote:

Don't shoot me down, and I haven't checked my facts BUT

In our first 18 matches of this season, I think we managed a paltry 9 points. We then brought in some more experienced players and
from the remaining 28 games, we manages to muster 37 points. That's just over 1.3pts a match.

If we had had the experienced players in from the start of the season, on that form, we could have hit 60pts for the season (46 x 1.3)

Crewe made the play-offs with 72pts this season.

Are we in slightly better shape for next season than some of us might think?

"are we better off than we think"

Ask me half way through next season and I might have an answer. If football was predictable then we wouldn't bother following it would we.

Its a point that's been raised before and so have lots of other statistics which all make sense in a way. Personally I still think with our budget we should have escaped relegation far sooner than we did and should be aiming for a lot more than 60 points this season coming.

We shall have to wait and see who gets signed in the close season. My fear is that we don't make many signings of note and too many people will be happy with 60 points next season, 64 the following season and so on. At that rate it could be 5 years before we're in the playoffs, but at least we still have a club!

"People" all want promotion and all of the fans of all of the clubs in league 2 will want the same. I keep hearing this promotion word being thrown about as if by some magical act Argyle will get it or should. Why should Argyle be different from any other club in this league? Just because we have a bigger pot for pay than most of them does not mean there is any right or even prbablility for promotion. We have had a number of expensively paid players in recent years who have gotten us into this league as repayment. Signing players of a better calibre doesn't mean they will become a promotion team either.

I think people are putting too much store in money we supposedly have and have come to believe Argyle are "too big" for this league when clearly they are not. Just sign this class player or that one or both and problem sorted. If only football worked that way we would be laughing. My first priority next season is not to become embroiled in yet another dog fight to stay in the league. Not sure my nerves will stand another one of them. If we get in the playoffs then happy bonus time. If we get promoted then deep joy all around. I'm not expecting it though just hoping for it. There is no such thing as a nailed on outcome unless you are Celtic in the Scottish premiership right now.

With the size of playing budget we have, anything less than automatic promotion will be a disappointment.

To progress year on year I'd suggest we have to start playing football some time. I'd prefer it to be sooner rather than later. How I'd love a Swansea philosophy to be imposed from day 1 of next season.

Yes wouldn't we all love great flowing football. Yes we all hope for promotion. But would you take 1 - 0 wins and crap and promotion? Go on say yes cause you know you want to...........

No, not really SG. Attritional football only gets you so far as we saw on the last upswing...we nearly got there but fell short when good footballers were sold for a quick buck. I'd like a footballing culture to pervade the club from top to bottom but I know that would take a very special person to impose and I can't see CF being that man. particularly given the limited success he's attained so far has been from just about grinding out results.

So you would rather have flowing football and failure to get promoted? Remember this is league 2 we are talking about and not nearly promoted from the Championship. We have to get back to there first before we can aspire to progress.

I'll take any number of dire binary wins to get us out of L2.

I don't really care if we play like Barca. I want success. Don't care how it comes. As Ollie said, sometimes you have to win ugly.

Sensiblegreeny wrote:

So you would rather have flowing football and failure to get promoted? Remember this is league 2 we are talking about and not nearly promoted from the Championship. We have to get back to there first before we can aspire to progress.

If the club decided to impose a swansea style philosophy on the team I personally would be happy to give it time and not demand instant promotion. These things take time.

The loan players that have gone back to their clubs need to be replaced by at least similar or better quality.

The need of a genuine goal scorer, attacking mid-field general and another experienced goalkeeper must be dealt with.

Then we will decide if we will be a force in this basement league....and if we've got the management in place to achieve it.

I'm basing the scenario on the fact that loads of people are "demanding" promotion Womble so the give it time thing wasn't really in my point. I would be prepared to give it a bit of time as well but I would rather promotion next season above that so would take lovely football and winning first but ugly football and winning a close second.

Charlie Wood wrote:

To progress year on year I'd suggest we have to start playing football some time. I'd prefer it to be sooner rather than later. How I'd love a Swansea philosophy to be imposed from day 1 of next season.

Do you think we could tempt Martinez away from Wigan ?

English is a second language for him but his manner ,style and belief always comes across. Fletch ? Errrrm, y'know...............................

Sensiblegreeny wrote:

So you would rather have flowing football and failure to get promoted? Remember this is league 2 we are talking about and not nearly promoted from the Championship. We have to get back to there first before we can aspire to progress.

Well if we have to get 'there', before we can aspire to progress, we might as well give up now... Because how are we going to get to 4th or 7th in the championship (depending on what statistic you want to believe) unless we progress? We are almost the worst team in the league, if we cant progress gawd help us!

And I know we are Argyle... But why can't we have a free flowing team that does actually get promoted? That seems to be the basic law in football. The teams that generally do play that way at whatever level are the winners.

And I agree with Greenskin... It doesn't matter what level you are playing at... From kindergarden to the World Cup finals... The team that generally passes better will win.

But don't worry about answering... I understand why you want to ignore me.

Rickler wrote:

Sensiblegreeny wrote:

So you would rather have flowing football and failure to get promoted? Remember this is league 2 we are talking about and not nearly promoted from the Championship. We have to get back to there first before we can aspire to progress.

Well if we have to get 'there', before we can aspire to progress, we might as well give up now... Because how are we going to get to 4th or 7th in the championship (depending on what statistic you want to believe) unless we progress? We are almost the worst team in the league, if we cant progress gawd help us!

And I know we are Argyle... But why can't we have a free flowing team that does actually get promoted? That seems to be the basic law in football. The teams that generally do play that way at whatever level are the winners.

And I agree with Greenskin... It doesn't matter what level you are playing at... From kindergarden to the World Cup finals... The team that generally passes better will win.

But don't worry about answering... I understand why you want to ignore me.

All you have to do now is to ignore me Nigel and the circle will be complete !

I am not necessarily demanding promotion, I am demanding that we have a proper go at it and don't aim at mid table, we need to see ourselves as as club that is going somewhere.

Iggy wrote:

I am not necessarily demanding promotion, I am demanding that we have a proper go at it and don't aim at mid table, we need to see ourselves as as club that is going somewhere.

You mean you won't 'enjoy' travelling up and down the country to watch dire football at dire grounds ?

And then, listen to Fletch take up three minutes of air time saying nothing in particular ?

Youuuuum naaaaaat a praaaaaaaaper faaaaaan !

Womble wrote:

Sensiblegreeny wrote:

So you would rather have flowing football and failure to get promoted? Remember this is league 2 we are talking about and not nearly promoted from the Championship. We have to get back to there first before we can aspire to progress.

If the club decided to impose a swansea style philosophy on the team I personally would be happy to give it time and not demand instant promotion. These things take time.

Agree totally Womble.

The 60 second euphoria of scoring a goal, is engulfed by the rest of the performance being painful to watch. I'd happily take 90 minutes of actually being good to watch, even if it didn't necessarily means wins.

SG, unless you are being purely argumentative (for a change... ) then it doesn't have to be either/or in terms of playing style. Rickler is bang on when he says that generally, the team that passes better will win, more often than not.

I think Rickler the obsessed and Tringreen the foreign correspondent miss the point but that isn't unusual. I have said several times now that I would love Argyle to play good football and get promoted. However, and this is the point, I just want Argyle to be promoted first and foremost. If it had to be ugly, and I would rather it wasn't, then I would take that if I had to. What we have is people demanding Argyle get promotion this season. Not hoping for it but demanding it. Now we have people demanding promotion and also demanding they do it like Barca. Given the seasons we have just endured, well most of us because some won't go or haven't gone to matches, you would think any kind of successful season would be most welcome wouldn't you.

I am not being argumentative for the sake of it either. I have a point of view and stick with it unless somebody comes up with a compelling reason to change my mind. I don't however resort to childish name calling and belittling as some seem to do. A criticism may I add that the very same people have with another site. It's not my fault if Tringreen talks through his ass most of the time and Rickler can't see past a conspiracy against him.

Sensiblegreeny wrote:

I think Rickler the obsessed and Tringreen the foreign correspondent miss the point but that isn't unusual. I have said several times now that I would love Argyle to play good football and get promoted. However, and this is the point, I just want Argyle to be promoted first and foremost. If it had to be ugly, and I would rather it wasn't, then I would take that if I had to. What we have is people demanding Argyle get promotion this season. Not hoping for it but demanding it. Now we have people demanding promotion and also demanding they do it like Barca. Given the seasons we have just endured, well most of us because some won't go or haven't gone to matches, you would think any kind of successful season would be most welcome wouldn't you.

I am not being argumentative for the sake of it either. I have a point of view and stick with it unless somebody comes up with a compelling reason to change my mind. I don't however resort to childish name calling and belittling as some seem to do. A criticism may I add that the very same people have with another site. It's not my fault if Tringreen talks through his ass most of the time and Rickler can't see past a conspiracy against him.

Hmm, yes, well.

And anyway it's only Freathy demanding promotion, isn't it?

I hate prats that call people names