get this feckin idiot out now before its too late

Our home form will take us down. An away loss against Rotherham is to be expected given our current squad. The failure to beat D&R, Hereford and crap midtable sides at home (mainly due to defensive football) is the issue. The young players seem to have spirit on twatter, but on the pitch that togetherness is lacking.

The consensus on the Rotherham fans site is that we were the worst team they've played all season.

Chemical Ali wrote:

Our home form will take us down. An away loss against Rotherham is to be expected given our current squad. The failure to beat D&R, Hereford and crap midtable sides at home (mainly due to defensive football) is the issue. The young players seem to have spirit on twatter, but on the pitch that togetherness is lacking.

Stick a Nando's takeaway at the back of the opposition goal, maybe that would encourage them to attack more.

knecht wrote:

The consensus on the Rotherham fans site is that we were the worst team they've played all season.

At Port Vale I was speaking to some of their fans after the game who were amazed they beat us, because even back then they knew they were heading for administration, and they said exactly the same thing. They were expecting us to go at them and couldn't believe their luck when we turned up and played without any passion, skill or attacking intent.

Congratulations to you Greenskin if you "mouthed off" as you put it in public at the ground. The point that I was making is that the 10000 people who were unblinkered did nothing more than the 6000 who supposedly were not. Therefore to blame those that still support the club for the clubs position when doing absolutely sod all yourself is pathetic. These people could have done many things other than to post on a website and only argue with others who do the same. They could have stood outside the ground on a soapbox and shouted their objections to the masses on a matchday. They could have written to the club, Herald, Prime Minister, Queen or anyone else to bring their objections to the fore. They could have gone into the ground and shouted their objections at the top of their voices for 90 minutes, organised the other 9999 to join them. Lots of things but chose to do..........erm.......nothing but post on a website. I get sick of people blaming other people for things when the stood by and did nothing themselves. Hence the Tut into their beer comment to demonstrate the lack of anarchy they achieved. Not literally they did tut into their beer.

In all things there are people who either take longer than others to see something happening or in some cases do not want to contemplate the happening so try to ignore it until it is confirmed. They are not stupid people because of that and to suggest they are or are to blame is plain wrong. Some people like Freathy chose to abandon the match day thing and stay at home. Some like Tring shout from afar and ridicule the "Avivas" for being too willing. Others chose to do their thing their own way which is to continue to support and back the club as best they can. Who is to say which one is wrong or right. Each to their own but they are entitled to do it nonetheless. I would still go to matches on a Saturday even in the BSP. That isn't being blind to what has and is happening. It is because I still want to go despite everything. Foolish in some people's book that might be but it is my money and my choice.

Most of the 10 k gone awol don't care that much. The few who do have the capacity to see the bigger picture are shouted down on football forums by the easily pleased. Do you really think that Tringy, or anyone else, standing on a soap box outside Home Park would receive anything other than being ignored at best ?

Enjoy the ride. Whatever makes you happy.

Sensiblegreeny wrote:

Congratulations to you Greenskin if you "mouthed off" as you put it in public at the ground. The point that I was making is that the 10000 people who were unblinkered did nothing more than the 6000 who supposedly were not. Therefore to blame those that still support the club for the clubs position when doing absolutely sod all yourself is pathetic. These people could have done many things other than to post on a website and only argue with others who do the same. They could have stood outside the ground on a soapbox and shouted their objections to the masses on a matchday. They could have written to the club, Herald, Prime Minister, Queen or anyone else to bring their objections to the fore. They could have gone into the ground and shouted their objections at the top of their voices for 90 minutes, organised the other 9999 to join them. Lots of things but chose to do..........erm.......nothing but post on a website. I get sick of people blaming other people for things when the stood by and did nothing themselves. Hence the Tut into their beer comment to demonstrate the lack of anarchy they achieved. Not literally they did tut into their beer.

In all things there are people who either take longer than others to see something happening or in some cases do not want to contemplate the happening so try to ignore it until it is confirmed. They are not stupid people because of that and to suggest they are or are to blame is plain wrong. Some people like Freathy chose to abandon the match day thing and stay at home. Some like Tring shout from afar and ridicule the "Avivas" for being too willing. Others chose to do their thing their own way which is to continue to support and back the club as best they can. Who is to say which one is wrong or right. Each to their own but they are entitled to do it nonetheless. I would still go to matches on a Saturday even in the BSP. That isn't being blind to what has and is happening. It is because I still want to go despite everything. Foolish in some people's book that might be but it is my money and my choice.

Why the sarcastic "congratulations" comment? I did as you suggested in your above post and let my feelings towards the hierarchy be known.Rather contrary of you to give a sniffy and implicitly critical dismisal of my actions,i'd have thought,especially when in your post,you refer to "shouting objections at the tops of their voices", but there you go.And as for letters to the paper,i think Tring was writing to the local press as far back as 2004 outlining the unlikelihood of further progress under the regime in situ.Put it this way,do you honestly think that there would have been a sufficient groundswell at the time to make his opinions influential in any way? Please,as Tring said earlier,get real.People were too busy basking in the glory of the previous successes [which in all fairness was understandable to a degree] and thinking that it would last forever to undertake any rational or critical analysis of the future prospects under Stapes and co.

Nobody is arguing about your money and your choice.I'm not sure if you read my previous post closely enough to notice that i stated that i'm still one of the 6000 who still attend.As are Chemical Ali,Peggy,Pepsi,Plympton Pilgrim and others.What exactly is your point there? I haven't seen a single comment on this site "blaming" people who still go matches for the current predicament.Maybe you could point me in the right direction.

No sarcasm intended in my congratulations greenskin, what I meant was actually congratulations because the voices of discontent were nowhere to be heard and clearly you were a lone voice at that time. My theme throughout this has been to object to the titles thrown at people who do not want to see things as being as yet terminal. Or even can't see in some cases. It's the "wake up and smell the coffee you glad clapper Avivas" type comment and that somehow these people are imbaciles. They are people with a different view is all. The very people who blame the supposed blind faithful are generally the very people who did nothing themselves except not bother to go to the ground or continued to and said nothing where it mattered. A number of people on ATD slam PASOTI for cyber bullying of people who no longer keep silent about the downfall and look to blame the Club. What ATD does in it's own way is reverse that and have a go a anyone who dare to voice a pro-club view. Dismissed with greentint comments as if their opinion doesn't matter. An argument can be put up to try to change that view without the insult bits. That's what discussion is meant to be about. Not telling somebody they are an idiot but to pursuade by reasoned rational argument that your opinion is more valid than the one they hold. How many posts on this site overall rubbish threads and posts on PASOTI that are pro rather than anti Argyle? How many posts include the expressions "Avivas" and "farm" and go on to be self congratualtory in that this site is so much freer than that other one. I got invited by Freathy to go join PASOTI. Why? Because I don't always subscribe to the way people on here portray others and the constant putting down of other sites? I have never been and am unlikely to be a poster or even member of PASOTI. Tell me what that is if it isn't a sort of bullying attempt just like the ones people complain about daily happening on PASOTI.

It was Coxside Green who blamed the "blind faithful" in a post earlier by the way. By that I took it to mean those that continue to go i.e. the 6000.

Perhaps some of what you say is correct Sensible, but at least you can openly post pro-argyle posts/ threads on this site. Tringy and Freathy were both banned for the heinous crime of being negative on pasoti.

You seem very unhappy with ATD and it;s users SG and every post you make seems to be bursting with anger, why do you use it if it causes you such frustration, are you here just to defend pasoti or is there another agenda?

GOB wrote:

You seem very unhappy with ATD and it;s users SG and every post you make seems to be bursting with anger, why do you use it if it causes you such frustration, are you here just to defend pasoti or is there another agenda?

Maybe he's the son of a well known pBay auctioneer.....

Yes Chemical Ali you can which is something that does differ from PASOTI. But, look at the two posts above this one and tell me that isn't a similar response to what is complained about PASOTI. You voice an alternative opinion and you get labelled and an attempted put down.

If people bothered to read, all I'm trying to say is that people who want to blame others want to look at themselves and ask what they could have done. Answer appears to be very little apart from a shouting off in the Stands and a letter from Mr Angry to the papers from Cyprus. It's ok to blame the last Board and it is ok to doubt the credentials or rather intentions of the new one but to say that supporters were to blame is not in my book. To blame people for wanting the best for the club and doing it in their own way which may be blind faith is not. I won't accept this club will be in the BSP until it either gets away with it or is. That is not to say I'm blind to the position or believe it can't happen. It simply isn't fact until it is fact is all. What is wrong with saying you support Fletcher for example if that is your opinion. ATD invite freedom of opinion or so I keep being told. Does it matter if they post that on here or PASOTI. Forget the pack leaders, others appear to be able to have a discussion on the topic with or without them.

Is this another "where were you in the war" rant, SG?

When you've learned to read and understand joined up argument GOB come back and we can have a chat. Until then practice your put downs because you clearly need it.

Is that your perception of anyone that does not agree with your stance SG?

You seem to be suggesting that fans must have done something to assist certain pasoti users in their role as Brent helpers before fans are entitled to an opinion, if not you seem determined to rubbish any comment they nake. Have I got that right? Serious question.

Serious answer where the feck have I suggested that?

If you read the previous posts I was responding to somebody, Coxside-green as it happens who was laying blame, or some of it, on the supporters who continued with their support. Blindly as I think it was put. What I was originally asking is what did the unblind do exactly? Where were the protest marches or even protests in the ground. Where was the unrest at all? It amounted to a few posts on a website is about all I can gather apart from one who shouted his dissent in the ground at the Directors. Now excuse me for thinking that is not a lot. The bottom line is that the blind were no more to blame than the unblind were they.

As for the putting down of anyone who "happy claps". Why the put down if people chose to show their support in their own way? Not everyone will see a hopeless case in Argyle and will continue not to see it until the relegation is mathmatically confirmed. Is that so wrong? Why do they deserve to be branded as some kind of idiot breed? It is the kind of branding that people condemn PASOTI for in reverse. All I am doing is pointing that out and there are other ways to discuss or even argue than resorting to branding a section with a title.

Now just for you as you seem not to get it. I am not a PASOTI member now, have never been a PASOTI member and probably never will be one under this user name or any other one. The only other site I post on is not606. I also did "in the war" as little as the vast majority and as much as some others. I donated to the staff fund at every match by putting money in the buckets. I did not stand on the picket lines outside the ground, go to marches, attend meetings or anything other than I have declared. I applaud those that did and gave up their time and effort by doing so.

I've had the pleasure to have known Sensible, through various Argyle forums, for 3 or 4 years now, and I can categorigacally state that he is most certainly not Ian Newell's son. Father maybe, but definitely not his son

Sensible is a die-hard Argyle fan who goes to every home game and isn't really interested in all of the in-fighting and politics that seem to have intensified over the last couple of seasons. I guess that makes him an Aviva in some peoples eyes, but he isn't a swallow whatever line is given old fool by any means. I would say that he is someone for whom Argyle is his great pleasure in life, and what he spends "luxury" money on.

I know from other sites that he will always fight his corner and will give as good as he gets, but if he feels something is wrong he will speak out against it. What Sensible won't do is give up on Argyle no matter how badly they are doing. Obviously he would prefer us to be successful, but I reckon he would still be there next season even if it means BSP football. To some people Argyle is their life and what I have noticed since he started posting on here is that Sensible has got more and more vociferous, and I believe it's because there is now a real chance that come August the visitors to Home Park will be Ebbsfleet and Barrow, when just a couple of short years ago it was Wolves and West Ham. This is enough to make anyone a little bit pissed off to say the least.

That doesn't make him a bad person in my eyes. What Sensible can't do is change whatever has happened, none of us can, but what he won't do is stop going to support Argyle and sit back moaning on here about how crap we are. He would rather be there to see it for himself and if we are crap then come on and say it like it is.

I remember suggesting on another site, that what the Argyle fans should do is boycott a Home match in protest at Ridsdale and the situation the club was in, and instead of paying to go in, drop the £20 in Sue Pollards bucket for the staff. I seem to remember him being against this because he wanted to see Argyle play and it would have affected the atmosphere and damage Argyle's chances of winning the game. I think that is a loyal supporter rather than an Aviva.

SG has been critical of Chris Webb on here, as he feels that the Club President should not be spouting off and arguing on fan forums, whether it is under the name Chris Webb or Mr President, so he is certainly not a sycophantic groveller like you get on Pasoti, where you see Chris post something really mundane and there are a dozen replies within 5 minutes all congratulating Chris for keeping us informed. And I can say hand on heart that sensible dislikes Pasoti with a passion, even though his son is a poster on there.

I think some people on here should have take step back and ask themselves if it is right that anyone who dares to have a differing opinion on ATD is ridiculed and shouted down. After all, isn't that what Pasoti does in reverse? And isn't that one of our main gripes against Pasoti? I felt the same when GreenGenes used to post on here regularly. I enjoyed his posts and admired him for venturing into the lions den as it were, but eventually it got too much for GG as he was always pounced on and abused, and he doesn't post on here anymore.

We should enjoy debate and welcome other people's views, without it descending into "Aviva" every time somebody does give a differing opinion, Jesus we even allow Shitty fans on here! And it isn't always black and white. I don't agree with every single post by every single poster on here, and there are some people who I rarely agree with, but sometimes it does feel as though as a site there is a party line, similar to what we accuse Pasoti of having.

I would also like to say that Sensible is a miserable old bugger in general and should be reminded of this as often as possible, but then again so is Freathy and if Freathy is ok then so is Sensible.

Just a perception SG, you just seem so angry and anti ATD with virtually every post and you seem to mention ATD an awful lot, often in a condemning context. Maybe it's just my perception?



Jock I really don't agree. GG was made welcome and even invited for a pint. He stopped posting here when IJN involved his family. As for SG, I'm asking him genuine questions on the basis that it appears to me that any questioning of the club seems to be rubbished by him and I am trying to understand why.

Christ greenjock that sounds like my end of term report. I knew you were older than you pretend. In defence of my son I might add that he is often taking certain people to task for their criticisms of other posters on PASOTI and gets the same kicking. Not that he is easily put off either though and it has never stopped him so far. It would be wrong of me to add his user ID on here though but I doubt anyone would put him in the "happy clappy" band. Thank you for your vote of confidence and my purpose was to say exactly what you did at the end of your essay. ATD should not allow itself to descend into the same depths as PASOTI by rubbishing people for not agreeing.

Now feck off and look after you kid.

Christ almighty, how many times do I need to say this GOB. You can criticise the club all you want to. You can call James Brent anything you wish. I may not agree with you and may argue alternatively but I have never said anywhere that you cannot make a point. I'm sorry because I know capitals are considered shouting on a forum but I need this to be understood loudly. I DO NOT AGREE WITH ONE POSTER OR SET OF POSTERS LABELLING OR PUTTING DOWN OTHERS SIMPLY FOR THEIR VIEWS WHICH MAY GO AGAINST THE MAJORITY. THEY ARE NOT STUPID BECAUSE THEY DON'T AGREE WITH YOU. Hope that is now clear.

Christ, was that an 'Empire Strikes Back' moment and SG is the father Greenjock never knew he had? Feel the Force....

well he definitely seems angry to me

Chin up SG, only joking

GOB wrote:

Just a perception SG, you just seem so angry and anti ATD with virtually every post and you seem to mention ATD an awful lot, often in a condemning context. Maybe it's just my perception?



Jock I really don't agree. GG was made welcome and even invited for a pint. He stopped posting here when IJN involved his family. As for SG, I'm asking him genuine questions on the basis that it appears to me that any questioning of the club seems to be rubbished by him and I am trying to understand why.

I know GG was invited for a drink several times, but there were always little comments like he was a spy and that the meeting place wouldn't be divulged other than by PM so that the meet wasn't sabotaged. I know a lot of it was banter but he did get stick for no real reason quite often. I didn't know anything about IJN involving GG's family, so I apologise if I misunderstood why GG stopped posting on here.

Damn you to hell and back Chemical Ali. I never wanted it to come out this way...........

I thought GG said one of his family was seriously ill and was taking a break?

I see he's posting on pasoti again, but he does seem quite negative (towards Argyle) than he has been in the past.