Just back (Exeter)

A few thoughts;

Exeter fully deserved their win, played very well, and Harley's goal well taken but should have been closed down better.

Sawyer doesn't look that good to me, ok left back for League 2 but for next season he'll need to be replaced.

Injuries to Hartley, McCormick, Boateng, McHugh and Reid has ripped 5 of PAFC's best players from the team, so it was always going to be a tough game. Fingers crossed they'll all be back soon.

Disappointed that Bentley didn't start ahead of Croll, and Bittner should have started. Don't think Jo Hart needs to quake in his boots, Walton looks like he's not ready for competitive football but not bad as cover.

Ryan Brunt is an excellent player and vastly under rated, any long ball in his direction and there's a fair chance he will head it on/lay it off to another green shirt.

Great support from the Exeter fans, a great day out for them.

Bittner start ??? Wtf.

Yes, Bittner should've started, very harsh on him after playing in a winning team last week and tbh he couldn't have done any worse than longshanks did today.

Pafcintheplace wrote:

A few thoughts;
Exeter fully deserved their win, played very well, and Harley's goal well taken but should have been closed down better.
Sawyer doesn't look that good to me, ok left back for League 2 but for next season he'll need to be replaced.
Injuries to Hartley, McCormick, Boateng, McHugh and Reid has ripped 5 of PAFC's best players from the team, so it was always going to be a tough game. Fingers crossed they'll all be back soon.
Disappointed that Bentley didn't start ahead of Croll, and Bittner should have started. Don't think Jo Hart needs to quake in his boots, Walton looks like he's not ready for competitive football but not bad as cover.
Ryan Brunt is an excellent player and vastly under rated, any long ball in his direction and there's a fair chance he will head it on/lay it off to another green shirt.
Great support from the Exeter fans, a great day out for them.

Not a lot more to say really! There are very few teams from the Championship down who could replace 5 of the backbone with equal quality. If nothing else from today DA has seen some of the fringe players in action and can, if required, ship them out on loan in Jan (somewhere!) and use the wages elsewhere.

If it's any consolation we do only seem to turn up against the better sides.

At the start of the season, McCormick, Hartley, McHugh, Boateng and Reuben Reid would have been considered not only first teamers, but 5 of our best first team players.

No team at any standard would be comfortable losing 5 out of the club's best 7 players (add Nelson and Carey).

It's not Derek Adams's fault, it's not James BrentKs fault. The fans just need to suck it up and hope the physio earns his Christmas bonus.

ejh wrote:

At the start of the season, McCormick, Hartley, McHugh, Boateng and Reuben Reid would have been considered not only first teamers, but 5 of our best first team players.

No team at any standard would be comfortable losing 5 out of the club's best 7 players (add Nelson and Carey).

It's not Derek Adams's fault, it's not James BrentKs fault. The fans just need to suck it up and hope the physio earns his Christmas bonus.

Agree with that. It was basically a different side playing yesterday to the one which has got us to the top of the table. Even then, it sounds like we had enough going forward to possibly take something from the game. No massive shock that losing our aerial centre-back, on top of the keeper and 2 best holding midfielders we've shown some defensive vulnerability.

Brent can't be responsible for that and the 2 loanees aren't bad - on paper at least.

Just hope we can stop the home on Tuesday and see some of our main players back in the side soon.

To me, one of the biggest worries is how yesterday's well deserved defeat plays in the minds of Carey, Jervis and Reid.
When players weigh up the pros and cons of signing extended contracts or moving on to pastures new, they will judge how likely their present club is to advance, not just in this division, but the one above as well. Such a loss as yesterday's doesn't help Argyle's allure. Players like to be with a club going places, not one that could collapse with a couple of players missing. All three of the above players will now be setting themselves the goal of landing a Championship contract that can make all the difference to their earning potential.
It seems to me, the team has a brittle edge to it. I don't think I've ever known a top of the table Argyle with such strange results, especially at home. The spine of the team is missing, and I don't blame Adams for the lack of cover. But I do blame Brent for budgetary problems that Adams has alluded to.

Carey has an outside chance at a Championship contract offer.

Jervis is nowhere near that grade yet and Reuben hasn't had a good goalscoring season in League One let alone in the Championship.

What Championship clubs do you anticipate coming in for these players?

Argyle came in for Jermaine Easter. Carey, Jervis and Reid are better players. Happens all the time. Clubs take a punt if the player fits a particular slot in their set up.

Sir John Hawkins wrote:

Argyle came in for Jermaine Easter. Carey, Jervis and Reid are better players. Happens all the time.

Easter was slightly different. He was playing for Wales whilst in the fourth tier and it was quite obvious he was ready for a jump up.

We also paid £200k for him after a 21 goal season.

He's more the equivalent of Reuben, than Jervis.

Jervis hadn't scored more than 4 goals at a club before coming to Argyle. I can't see Bristol City making him their new number 9 after hitting 10 goals, some of them so scrappy he was sat on his arse when he tapped them in.

ejh wrote:

Sir John Hawkins wrote:

Argyle came in for Jermaine Easter. Carey, Jervis and Reid are better players. Happens all the time.

Easter was slightly better.

No, he wasn't
Just look at the players Sturrock brought in at CCC level and tell me any of those three can't find a club there.

Is this the same period, shortly after which we ended up in League Two and fighting for league survival?

Not particularly a good example of what constitutes good sensible Championship recruitment.

Sir John Hawkins wrote:

To me, one of the biggest worries is how yesterday's well deserved defeat plays in the minds of Carey, Jervis and Reid.
When players weigh up the pros and cons of signing extended contracts or moving on to pastures new, they will judge how likely their present club is to advance, not just in this division, but the one above as well. Such a loss as yesterday's doesn't help Argyle's allure. Players like to be with a club going places, not one that could collapse with a couple of players missing. All three of the above players will now be setting themselves the goal of landing a Championship contract that can make all the difference to their earning potential.
It seems to me, the team has a brittle edge to it. I don't think I've ever known a top of the table Argyle with such strange results, especially at home. The spine of the team is missing, and I don't blame Adams for the lack of cover. But I do blame Brent for budgetary problems that Adams has alluded to.

It's not a couple of players though, is it? 5 of the names nailed into the 1st XI were missing and those 5 form the spine through the middle.

I'm not in disagreement that we have a smaller budget than is comfortable but any squad in the bottom 2 divisions would struggle with so many key players out.

What is odd about the league results so far? We've lost at home to a good Pompey side early season and come off worst in a derby whilst injury-depleted. Whether or not things take a dive from here remains to be seen but the only odd thing so far is how many games we've won.

With the benefit of hindsight neither of the new loanees should have started. Arriving just a day or so before the game, to play in front of what was quite possibly the largest crowd either have ever started a game before, gave neither of them no time to settle in with the team and wasn't fair on either of them. That said it is a damning indictment of the quality of our stand-ins for those positions (Bittner and, presumably, Bentley). Adams clearly just doesn't rate them therefore we need to recruit urgently. We've decided to take a gamble, have rolled the dice and we've shat out. No excuses about budget or anything else will do.

Apart from all of that losing both Boateng and McHugh was disastrous for us. McHugh, in particular, is the rock around which the rest play and the combined loss of that pairing left us weak both in terms of physique and shape. So there's another player we urgently need.

Of the ones who did play I thought Simpson worked his socks off and was always looking for possession. Well done to him. Threlkeld just doesn't seem up to it to me. He seems to vanish for large chunks of the game. Harvey needs more than 10 minutes - the poor kid must be doing his nut at coming on when all is lost and being expected to change a game. If he's good enough to do that then he's good enough to start. Nelson was usual reliable self. Mellor's "tackle" for the penalty was a shocking decision. You could see it coming even before he did it. Shockingly braindead.

But for all of that the spine was ripped out of our side yesterday and it resulted in a spineless, literally and metaphorically, performance. If those missing players are fit for Tuesday we might not lose our 4th consecutive home game against Orient but if they are not it has to be on the cards that we will.

Credit to Exeter for controlling long passages of play - especially just after we scored. In truth they tonked us and 1-2 didn't do their dominance justice.

ejh wrote:

At the start of the season, McCormick, Hartley, McHugh, Boateng and Reuben Reid would have been considered not only first teamers, but 5 of our best first team players.

No team at any standard would be comfortable losing 5 out of the club's best 7 players (add Nelson and Carey).

It's not Derek Adams's fault, it's not James BrentKs fault. The fans just need to suck it up and hope the physio earns his Christmas bonus.

Surely the lack of cover in the squad has something to do with JB. Is it normal for a professional club which is top of its league to bring in a CB who comes in on the Thursday, trains once with the squad then plays in a losing effort on the Saturday? Quality cover should have been there already, why wasn't it?

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

With the benefit of hindsight neither of the new loanees should have started. Arriving just a day or so before the game, to play in front of what was quite possibly the largest crowd either have ever started a game before, gave neither of them no time to settle in with the team and wasn't fair on either of them. That said it is a damning indictment of the quality of our stand-ins for those positions (Bittner and, presumably, Bentley). Adams clearly just doesn't rate them therefore we need to recruit urgently. We've decided to take a gamble, have rolled the dice and we've shat out. No excuses about budget or anything else will do.

Apart from all of that losing both Boateng and McHugh was disastrous for us. McHugh, in particular, is the rock around which the rest play and the combined loss of that pairing left us weak both in terms of physique and shape. So there's another player we urgently need.

Of the ones who did play I thought Simpson worked his socks off and was always looking for possession. Well done to him. Threlkeld just doesn't seem up to it to me. He seems to vanish for large chunks of the game. Harvey needs more than 10 minutes - the poor kid must be doing his nut at coming on when all is lost and being expected to change a game. If he's good enough to do that then he's good enough to start. Nelson was usual reliable self. Mellor's "tackle" for the penalty was a shocking decision. You could see it coming even before he did it. Shockingly braindead.

But for all of that the spine was ripped out of our side yesterday and it resulted in a spineless, literally and metaphorically, performance. If those missing players are fit for Tuesday we might not lose our 4th consecutive home game against Orient but if they are not it has to be on the cards that we will.

Credit to Exeter for controlling long passages of play - especially just after we scored. In truth they tonked us and 1-2 didn't do their dominance justice.

Mostly fair points but Walton has played at White Hart Lane in front of thousands and TV cameras. He's also an England under-20/19/18 international.

The amount of injuries and to the type of players involved is pretty damn unlucky.

Yes, there needs to be adequate cover brought in and budget provided to do that - if we are to maintain our position - but 5 key players out would rock any squad, irrespective of size, apart from at the richest clubs.

Innocent Egbunike wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

With the benefit of hindsight neither of the new loanees should have started. Arriving just a day or so before the game, to play in front of what was quite possibly the largest crowd either have ever started a game before, gave neither of them no time to settle in with the team and wasn't fair on either of them. That said it is a damning indictment of the quality of our stand-ins for those positions (Bittner and, presumably, Bentley). Adams clearly just doesn't rate them therefore we need to recruit urgently. We've decided to take a gamble, have rolled the dice and we've shat out. No excuses about budget or anything else will do.

Apart from all of that losing both Boateng and McHugh was disastrous for us. McHugh, in particular, is the rock around which the rest play and the combined loss of that pairing left us weak both in terms of physique and shape. So there's another player we urgently need.

Of the ones who did play I thought Simpson worked his socks off and was always looking for possession. Well done to him. Threlkeld just doesn't seem up to it to me. He seems to vanish for large chunks of the game. Harvey needs more than 10 minutes - the poor kid must be doing his nut at coming on when all is lost and being expected to change a game. If he's good enough to do that then he's good enough to start. Nelson was usual reliable self. Mellor's "tackle" for the penalty was a shocking decision. You could see it coming even before he did it. Shockingly braindead.

But for all of that the spine was ripped out of our side yesterday and it resulted in a spineless, literally and metaphorically, performance. If those missing players are fit for Tuesday we might not lose our 4th consecutive home game against Orient but if they are not it has to be on the cards that we will.

Credit to Exeter for controlling long passages of play - especially just after we scored. In truth they tonked us and 1-2 didn't do their dominance justice.

Mostly fair points but Walton has played at White Hart Lane in front of thousands and TV cameras. He's also an England under-20/19/18 international.

The amount of injuries and to the type of players involved is pretty damn unlucky.

Yes, there needs to be adequate cover brought in and budget provided to do that - if we are to maintain our position - but 5 key players out would rock any squad, irrespective of size, apart from at the richest clubs.

Agreed. Five players - and five of our better players - all out, a whole new central midfield partnership, and two out of the three from the triangle in central defence - going to hit any club hard. Throw in Mellor having a 'mare, we're really up against it.

Lot of whining about a few injuries, you are the ninth biggest club in the 4th division playing a pub team, you should be able to cope.

I went.

We were shit, right. Nothing in the middle of the park. Definite pen, then a good goal where the player made the defender look very ordinary.

Mock Cuncher wrote:

I went.

We were shit, right. Nothing in the middle of the park. Definite pen, then a good goal where the player made the defender look very ordinary.

Penalty was nailed on. Quite why Mellor didn't clear it on either opportunity he had, and then clattered the guy in the box, is a mystery. RB is a worry, because Mellor has 1 good game in 4, and no real competition.

I'd like to see their second again. Nice bit of footwork to get himself some space, but it didn't look to be hit that hard. Maybe Walton saw it late?

charleymouse wrote:

ejh wrote:

At the start of the season, McCormick, Hartley, McHugh, Boateng and Reuben Reid would have been considered not only first teamers, but 5 of our best first team players.

No team at any standard would be comfortable losing 5 out of the club's best 7 players (add Nelson and Carey).

It's not Derek Adams's fault, it's not James BrentKs fault. The fans just need to suck it up and hope the physio earns his Christmas bonus.

Surely the lack of cover in the squad has something to do with JB. Is it normal for a professional club which is top of its league to bring in a CB who comes in on the Thursday, trains once with the squad then plays in a losing effort on the Saturday? Quality cover should have been there already, why wasn't it?

Well let's start at GK. We had two keepers for a long spell before we worked out it was quite expensive and that keepers are rarely injured or banned. So we got rid of Jake Cole and spent his wages elsewhere, which was the right decision. That arrangement was fine until about two years later when McCormick gets injured, and suddenly JB is a tightwad who is costing us promotion. Despite us having a £250,000 England U21 in goal as well.

Then at CB. We started the season with 3 high quality CBs. They were so good DA converted one to a DM. Again the arrangement was fine when it got us 5 points clear at the top of the league, but now we have lost a game it was shambolic all along. How can you not have any quality cover, etc.? Well we did. He was just playing another position, by which he became injured too, as did his partner at centre mid.

A long story short, it is extremely unfortunate to have literally half of our strongest side unavailable. It is the equivalent of Manchester City having Joe Hart, Vincent Kompany, Yaya Toure, Fernandinho and Sergio Aguero all out at once. They have all the money in the world, can loan the highest calibre loans available in th transfer market, and are they going to adequately replace those players? Are they going to maintain top of the league form missing all of those players? Of course not. They spent 25 million on Wilfriend Bony, but he is not the striker Aguero is, and Mangala cannot hold a candle to the form of Kompany.

It is exactly the same at our level. Brent cannot afford two McCormicks, two Hartleys and two Reuben Reids. When we don't have them, be prepared that without them we are going to struggle, and Premier League and England U21 internationals on loan is as decent an attempt to replace them as the chairman and manager can really try.

I may have missed it, but what is the extent of McHugh's injury? Hopefully not long term?

Remember We hardly had our best starting 11, no Tommy, Alex, Holmes, Clint or Hoskins, we played two youth strikers, one hadnt played in the league for us since 2013 and had been on loan at Truro (the club ahead of you in your area) and the other has played around 20mins of first team football

So yes blame the defeat on having 5 players out, but also remember we didnt have 'our normal' starting 11 either

Its poss clear we have much more depth in our squad, and no loan players