Syria

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Les Miserable wrote:

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Refugees yes.

Terrorists no.

Birds of a feather I'm afraid.

I have met thousands of asylum seekers and refugees and none of them have been terrorists.

You can have absolutely no idea whether that comment is true, the muslim communities in this country have produced plenty of terrorists who have acted already, you can't possibly be sure that none of those you have seen weren't complicit in acts already committed, nor that they will not be involved in some act in the future.

Smug, know all bollox is what that is.

The security services have identified over 5,000 muslims of of concern in this country and they are actively attempting to monitor as many of them as they can, you can be absolutely certain that if there are 5,000 "of concern" there are many more we know nothing about yet, plenty of whom could have been in your presence.

Lord Tisdale wrote:

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Les Miserable wrote:

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Refugees yes.

Terrorists no.

Birds of a feather I'm afraid.

I have met thousands of asylum seekers and refugees and none of them have been terrorists.

You can have absolutely no idea whether that comment is true, the muslim communities in this country have produced plenty of terrorists who have acted already, you can't possibly be sure that none of those you have seen weren't complicit in acts already committed, nor that they will not be involved in some act in the future.

Smug, know all bollox is what that is.

The security services have identified over 5,000 muslims of of concern in this country and they are actively attempting to monitor as many of them as they can, you can be absolutely certain that if there are 5,000 "of concern" there are many more we know nothing about yet, plenty of whom could have been in your presence.

Sorry Tis, its you who is talking bollox.

I have been a front line Immigration Officer for 10 years. 7 years of which were in Enforcement - arresting and removing people who were illegally in the UK. I have spent 3 years working in an airport where I encounter close to 1000 people a day. I am also a fully trained customs officer. I have also spent time working in the Home Office policy department in Marsham Street.

You may think you know more about everything then everyone else, but you don't.

For the last time, the two warmongering murdering suicide bombers were Belgian nationals, not refugees.
Europe's, and that includes us, biggest threat is that it eats itself. It's already a multi cultural/ethnic society, apart from Okehampton, and that isn't going to change any time soon. In my mind, stirring up racist/religious radical hate, as the far right are so obviously doing here, Germany, Hungary and many other countries, is part of the warmongering, as it has been in the past. A race to the bottom. Still, we get the society we deserve.

Lord Biro wrote:

For the last time, the two warmongering murdering suicide bombers were Belgian nationals, not refugees.
Europe's, and that includes us, biggest threat is that it eats itself. It's already a multi cultural/ethnic society, apart from Okehampton, and that isn't going to change any time soon. In my mind, stirring up racist/religious radical hate, as the far right are so obviously doing here, Germany, Hungary and many other countries, is part of the warmongering, as it has been in the past. A race to the bottom. Still, we get the society we deserve.

What is us vs is if not a race war?

Deep down ? Haves and have nots.
Both sides have their loons that want it to be a race war.

Fully agree with Lord B on this one.

It's all about power, empowering (or rather not) and disenfranchising.

Those at the very bottom of the pile are easily led into actions that they might ordinarily think better of but after years, decades, generations of being denied a fair crack of the whip they are easily radicalised to follow a cause - it's exactly the template Hitler used except in his case the scapegoats were Jews. Once the fuse of injustice and discontent is lit is smoulders away and, unless extinguished, leads to a big bang.

If that is your intention then sprinkling in as much factionalisation as possible and then feeding it furiously with as much nationalism and religion as you can muster is the way forward and if there's also rich pickings (in this case oil) to finance it all as you go and a whole host of arms traders, legitimate and illicit, looking to make a buck you can hardly go wrong.

Assad vs ISIS is hardly a race war, is it. Same old oppressor vs oppressed.

How are the radicals that were born & live in Europe oppressed. They (males) have exactly the same opportunities, rights, benefits,  etc as all the rest of us.
Some would say they get better treatment than whites as everyone goes out of their way to avoid being tainted by the R word.
How the hell is that oppression ?.

Muslim women are oppressed for sure but we're not allowed to talk about that.

Why do the lefties have to turn everything into a guilt trip ?

Isis are hardly oppressed ?

Oh well, all those millions fighting Assad are just having a picnic. Life in Syria has been a bed of roses these last decades. ISIS, and all the other groups, are all just radicals from Peckham and Paris, just like the Taliban in Afghanistan doesn't really have any grass root local support at all.

Lord Melbury wrote:

How are the radicals that were born & live in Europe oppressed. They (males) have exactly the same opportunities, rights, benefits,  etc as all the rest of us.
Some would say they get better treatment than whites as everyone goes out of their way to avoid being tainted by the R word.
How the hell is that oppression ?.

Muslim women are oppressed for sure but we're not allowed to talk about that.

Why do the lefties have to turn everything into a guilt trip ?

So much garbage in so few words! I hardly know where to begin...

Not everybody is allowed the same opportunities; saying that "they" get better treatment than "whites" is explicitly racist so why shouldn't anybody say so; nobody anywhere is stopping you from talking about the oppression of women.

ISIS is oppressing all sorts of people in all sorts of ways - almost too many to begin to name them; Assad is oppressing people by rigging elections and dropping bombs on them; western societies oppress people through institutionalised racism; people like you oppress others by posting such dribble.

Lord Biro wrote:

Assad vs ISIS is hardly a race war, is it. Same old oppressor vs oppressed.

It's both a race and religious war, most daesh fighters are not arabs and the organisation are Sunni muslims who would, given their head, murder brutally every Alawhite, Shiite and Christian in Syria.

As oppressors go daesh and their US, Saudi, Qatari, Turkish facilitators knock Assad into a cocked hat. Before this sh1t kicked off Syria was a wealthyish, peacefulish and secular country where everyone was free to worship whichever fairy sky friend they wished to, that was the Assad version of oppression, I guess you prefer the daesh stylee?

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Lord Melbury wrote:

How are the radicals that were born & live in Europe oppressed. They (males) have exactly the same opportunities, rights, benefits,  etc as all the rest of us.
Some would say they get better treatment than whites as everyone goes out of their way to avoid being tainted by the R word.
How the hell is that oppression ?.

Muslim women are oppressed for sure but we're not allowed to talk about that.

Why do the lefties have to turn everything into a guilt trip ?

So much garbage in so few words! I hardly know where to begin...

Not everybody is allowed the same opportunities; saying that "they" get better treatment than "whites" is explicitly racist so why shouldn't anybody say so; nobody anywhere is stopping you from talking about the oppression of women.

ISIS is oppressing all sorts of people in all sorts of ways - almost too many to begin to name them; Assad is oppressing people by rigging elections and dropping bombs on them; western societies oppress people through institutionalised racism; people like you oppress others by posting such dribble.

Such a knob jockey, Assad and his army are fighting for the lives of every non sunni muslim in Syria, if he loses every one of them will be brutally murdered.

Lord Biro wrote:

Oh well, all those millions fighting Assad are just having a picnic. Life in Syria has been a bed of roses these last decades. ISIS, and all the other groups, are all just radicals from Peckham and Paris, just like the Taliban in Afghanistan doesn't really have any grass root local support at all.

There are not "millions fighting Assad" and the Taliban is not daesh, most of daesh's fighters are not arabs, they come from all over the world, and let's not forget that the other main group fighting Assad are Al Qaeda FFS.

This forum seems to be full of terrorist sympathisers.

Lord Tisdale wrote:

Lord Biro wrote:

Oh well, all those millions fighting Assad are just having a picnic. Life in Syria has been a bed of roses these last decades. ISIS, and all the other groups, are all just radicals from Peckham and Paris, just like the Taliban in Afghanistan doesn't really have any grass root local support at all.

There are not "millions fighting Assad" and the Taliban is not daesh, most of daesh's fighters are not arabs, they come from all over the world, and let's not forget that the other main group fighting Assad are Al Qaeda FFS.

This forum seems to be full of terrorist sympathisers.

I didn't say they were. They are just another current example in that area of the world of a flag that the dispossessed flock under, purely because they have no power. Revolutions happen because the people have had enough of their lot, for whatever reason. That's how it has always been the world over. We've even done it here.  
I have no sympathy or empathy whatsoever with any killing murdering warmongers on any side. I'm just saying it how it is.

My feelings of us and our love of war in the middle east is well documented as is my dislike of tarring all Muslims with the same brush as the radicals but I think to distance ourselves from the uproar in the sandpit and claim all the terror attacks over here, France and Belgium has been carried out by "us, Europeans ect". is farcical. The gist is try and distance your love of all immigrants from the real problems that can occour when you let the wrong kind in. How long have the Belgian bombers been passport holders? Were they recently immigrants or were their parents? Do the Muslim enclaves in Britain and Belgium see themselves as "one nation and all in it together?" do they fook.
The rise of IS and terrorism generally is a result of both our involvement in Iraq, Afghanistan, Lybia and Syria plus importing other races then not integrating them into our society but letting them stew in their own juices in deprived areas. This is also the problem of allowing uncontrolled immigration into a densely populated country with an already pretty severe housing shortage. Build the houses and you still need schools, hospitals and doctors. it's as easy to shout terrorist as it is racist but Franny and Biro take a much too simplistic view of the problems IMO and denying that the terrorists are foreigners (which was actually Homeslice) takes the biscuit. These IS guys can have all the paperwork they like it doesn't make them "one of us" and I hope it never will do, they are miles apart from us in all manner of ways.

Amsterdamage wrote:

Do the Muslim enclaves in Britain and Belgium see themselves as "one nation and all in it together?" do they fook.

And nor do I. And I won't be "cleaning for the queen" either when her birthday pops up.

So, what is the difference between the communities you talk of, and I ?
Is your view of a secular state more narrow than it is intended to be ? Are we all to be forced to watch Corrie once a week ?

Lord Biro wrote:

Amsterdamage wrote:

Do the Muslim enclaves in Britain and Belgium see themselves as "one nation and all in it together?" do they fook.

And nor do I. And I won't be "cleaning for the queen" either when her birthday pops up.

So, what is the difference between the communities you talk of, and I ?
Is your view of a secular state more narrow than it is intended to be ? Are we all to be forced to watch Corrie once a week ?

Shorely the secular state is the solution not the problem? I would like more of an integrated one and I think that ignoring or denying obvious problems is not the way forward. As for the difference of the communities I talk of you can walk down my road at any time of night safely yet where my mate lives off the Brixton Road it's quicker walking into the park through the tower blocks but you can't do it at night. I lived in High Wycombe for a while and you couldn't go down one end of town at night if a white young male, the same could be said of an Aisian male in the opposite side of town. I worked in the South of France years ago and the Algerian quarters were no go areas it's not an isolated problem. The same could be said for parts of East London where it's all white young males who are after your wallet, jacket and boots sometimes so it's not isolated to race. We've created these areas by closing down the docks in Glasgow and moving all the workers to Stirling where there are few jobs but plenty of off licences, don't go in certain pubs and speak loudly in an English accent the Glasgow smile will result. I've been around a bit, a lot more than most I'm not in denial like a lot of people that advocate unlimited immigration and ignore the obvious problems it creates when people, white, black or yellow are dumped in poor areas and especially when all the same people be they Muslims, dockers or Yardies are lumped together in one area causing an obvious difference between communities.
In short we already have enough problems at home without trying to sort out Europe, the middle east and Africa, which we won't do but it could bankrupt us trying.

Lord Biro wrote:

They are just another current example in that area of the world of a flag that the dispossessed flock under, purely because they have no power. Revolutions happen because the people have had enough of their lot, for whatever reason. That's how it has always been the world over. We've even done it here.  

The problem with this was that the West was the revolution.

What possesses us to think we can impart democracy on what is basically tribes.

The Taliban, Hashemite, Sunni, etc do not recognise countries.

They have had borders forced on them.

We have much to answer for.

Rollo Tomasi wrote:

The problem with this was that the West was the revolution.

What possesses us to think we can impart democracy on what is basically tribes.

The Taliban, Hashemite, Sunni, etc do not recognise countries.

Well, if you're talking Iraq, it's a pity there weren't even more people demonstrating against it along with myself and a million or two others.
I take it you took the trouble Rollo, given your legendary sense of fair play, and knowing it was an unjust war to start, with unforeseen results bound to follow. Somebody had to tell the warmongers they were creating a storm.

I'm not talking Iraq.

Well done for demonstrating against the war.

You kept that quiet

I did for all the good it did, same goes for the poll tax riots, everybody moans about the council tax but if even ten percent of the population would have marched on London and it would have been history. It was meant to have been the biggest tax hike ever that council tax with the old rates going from a couple of hundred quid for your bins, sewage and water to paying for the old bill, fire engines and all the rest. I suppose we all end up with the society we deserve. I was talking to a mate of mine in Cornwall today his CT has gone up by ten percent because we have to replace the old people's homes and social care that we sacrificed to pay for the bankers bonuses. You might now have to wait for three weeks for an emergency op on a brain tumour but the bankers had bupa insurance anyway so who gives a fook?

Lord Biro wrote:

Well, if you're talking Iraq, it's a pity there weren't even more people demonstrating against it along with myself and a million or two others.

Wasted your time then.

A couple of million muppets who walked around for a bit then voted again for Blair in 2005.

As usual, you have no idea what you are talking about and no respect for people with principles, who actually act on them.  You've rattled on with your well known BNP shit for years on several football forums, hiding behind the UKIP badge who could well do without your like,  moaning about how the Europeans/Americans entered wars they shouldn't have. And yet, you never ever once campaigned against those wars and put your feet where your racist mouth is. You're a fraud. You're worse than Newell.

Huge numbers of Labour voters never voted for Blair again.  Iraq was ultimately the seed of the end for the New Labour project, or more accurately, Blair. Brown would never have toppled him without Iraq. It has finally filtered out and produced Jezza. Oh, and I never voted for Labour in the first place, and huge numbers of antiwar demonstrators don't either. You haven't a clue how the "broad left"/left of centre/centre ground aligns itself. You're blinded by hate.