Match sponsorship

I wouldn't be able to make a golf day in Plymouth, but I'll do what I can to contribute. My new best friends the PASOTI mods, who keep e-mailing me to let me know how much they care for me, would probably be well up for an ADT day out somewhere. When they e-mail next I'll ask them what day is best for them.

how about atd v pasoti, it may heal a few wounds in the process..

im rubbish at goaf, but an excellent keeper , how about a football match before an argo game on the hallowed turf, or a wrathall shoot up, i mean out... m7 faces on a goal sized board, ten points for a nose hit

shonbo wrote:

Hi Greenskin
I don't think we slid from fourth, we more kind of bounced up for half a season. Look back at history. Low div 2, pretty good div 3. Yes this is lower than we've been for ooh 15 years. Looking at your age, theirs one year apart between us and most of that time has been div 2 & 3. (proper divs)

This is what we do. We've done it for the lat 125 years. Local business guys doing the same thing getting the same results. We tried doing something different and got burnt.

I don't see how anyone supporting Argyle could be cynical about local folks trying to support the club. For most of that time, we've been higher than where we are now.

When did you start becoming cynical?

Cheers
Mike

I'm very well aware of the history,i've seen four different manifestations of it over a period of 47 years in supporting Argyle.It doesn't sit easily with me that if something has been consistently mediocre throughout its life,no effort should be made to improve it.One aspect which is rarely looked at when the alleged cynicism of people like Tringreen,Freathy,GOB,the two PP'S,myself and others is discussed is that we believe that Argyle should have done much better in the past and should be doing better now.Indeed,there would be an argument that the attitude of "its what we do" is far more cynical than the views expressed by the above named posters,who believe in the potential of Plymouth Argyle as a reasonably big football club and have been sickened by the half hearted,incompetent and plain fecking greedy actions of those at the top which has thwarted progress over many years.One encouraging aspect about the advent of Mr Brent is his statement that he and his cohorts would probably not be able to take the club further than the CCC, and would look elsewhere for help should that status be achieved-a shame that this realistic attitude was not taken by the powers that be earlier in our history.

When did i become cynical? Where do you want me to start? At the beginning? OK,then.

1960's-the promise of "first division football in 5 years",followed by the sale of players like Trebilcock,Book,Jackson,Jennings,Jones etc and the replacement of those players by bargain bucket replacements,resulting in inevitable decline,relegation and financial trouble-nothing to do with gates,either,they were as good as any at that time.

1970's-the betrayal of a brlliant manager in Tony Waiters by the sale of Mariner and Rafferty to a couple of market town clubs and the inevitable purchase of rubbish to replace them,with inevitable results.Nothing to do with gates either-6th best in the old second division in the season before M and R were sold.

1980's-good manager in Dave Smith,took us to the verge of the play offs.Was he backed properly? Of course not.If you want evidence of how venal and stupid Argyle directors can be,just read "Left foot Forward" by Garry Nelson-its very revealing.

I'm not going to go over the recent past,its been done to death,suffice to say that the "attempt to do something different" as you put it, was a half baked hotch potch at best,a cynical and greedy exercise in asset stripping at worst.As far as fans raising money for the staff,the club etc,i'm actually not that cynical-i believe that the best of intentions,rather than any lust for power or status,are the motives behind the fund raising for staff etc and indeed i've got a janner banner on PASOTI because i contributed to the fund-how much more proof of avivaness do you need than that? Whether it was the best way forward,rather than staff taking industrial action is very debatable but as i say,motives were sound as far as i'm concerned.

Greenskin wrote:

Whether it was the best way forward,rather than staff taking industrial action is very debatable but as i say,motives were sound as far as i'm concerned.

That's exactly as I see it. Those who wanted to contribute ? Do your own thing. We all help people out when we think it is the right thing to do. But stop the hounding of the people who thought quite clearly it was counter productive and nothing but long term proxy cash into the pockets of the money men doing the deal, and a sure fire way to extend the process. It could be argued it was only the late strike threat that actually brought the matter to an end.

The way forward was indeed DEBATEABLE, and my view was always industrial action to bring the money men's mind into sharp immediate focus, particularly the secured creditors and previous owners .. their feet wouldn't have touched the ground in the rush to do a deal.... any deal, rather than sitting back counting the money as wages went unpaid. Indeed Chris Webb stated that if the Argyle thing were his postal workers, that's exactly what he would have reccomended to his staff.

And GS is right, there has been a littany of let downs at the club, Trebilcock, Mariner and Rafferty being the worst for me. But at least in those days we could keep a future England star like Mariner for 3 seasons !! These days, the likes of Gosling and SEB are sold on before some of them even command a plac in OUR first team. Tony Book was a strange one, as he was 27 when he got into league football. Time was short for him, so I understood that one somewhat. No wonder we're cynical.... decades of being sold out. Other clubs manage it, even Blackpool managed to keep Charlie Adam long enough to get them up. Bad custodians, that's been the problem.

penzancepirate wrote:

Greenskin wrote:

Whether it was the best way forward,rather than staff taking industrial action is very debatable but as i say,motives were sound as far as i'm concerned.

That's exactly as I see it. Those who wanted to contribute ? Do your own thing. We all help people out when we think it is the right thing to do. But stop the hounding of the people who thought quite clearly it was counter productive and nothing but long term proxy cash into the pockets of the money men doing the deal, and a sure fire way to extend the process. It could be argued it was only the late strike threat that actually brought the matter to an end.

The way forward was indeed DEBATEABLE, and my view was always industrial action to bring the money men's mind into sharp immediate focus, particularly the secured creditors and previous owners .. their feet wouldn't have touched the ground in the rush to do a deal.... any deal, rather than sitting back counting the money as wages went unpaid. Indeed Chris Webb stated that if the Argyle thing were his postal workers, that's exactly what he would have reccomended to his staff.

And GS is right, there has been a littany of let downs at the club, Trebilcock, Mariner and Rafferty being the worst for me. But at least in those days we could keep a future England star like Mariner for 3 seasons !! These days, the likes of Gosling and SEB are sold on before some of them even command a plac in OUR first team. Tony Book was a strange one, as he was 27 when he got into league football. Time was short for him, so I understood that one somewhat. No wonder we're cynical.... decades of being sold out. Other clubs manage it, even Blackpool managed to keep Charlie Adam long enough to get them up. Bad custodians, that's been the problem.

"The past is a foreign country - they do things differently there " . I suggest that you and a few others on this Board live in the past . We cannot affect the past but by god we can affect the future . Are you still AWOL PP . Is it accomplishing anything ? . My invite to have a drink and chat is always open . Come to a Fans Fest meet people who are trying to make the Club a better Club .

greengenes wrote:

penzancepirate wrote:

Greenskin wrote:

Whether it was the best way forward,rather than staff taking industrial action is very debatable but as i say,motives were sound as far as i'm concerned.

That's exactly as I see it. Those who wanted to contribute ? Do your own thing. We all help people out when we think it is the right thing to do. But stop the hounding of the people who thought quite clearly it was counter productive and nothing but long term proxy cash into the pockets of the money men doing the deal, and a sure fire way to extend the process. It could be argued it was only the late strike threat that actually brought the matter to an end.

The way forward was indeed DEBATEABLE, and my view was always industrial action to bring the money men's mind into sharp immediate focus, particularly the secured creditors and previous owners .. their feet wouldn't have touched the ground in the rush to do a deal.... any deal, rather than sitting back counting the money as wages went unpaid. Indeed Chris Webb stated that if the Argyle thing were his postal workers, that's exactly what he would have reccomended to his staff.

And GS is right, there has been a littany of let downs at the club, Trebilcock, Mariner and Rafferty being the worst for me. But at least in those days we could keep a future England star like Mariner for 3 seasons !! These days, the likes of Gosling and SEB are sold on before some of them even command a plac in OUR first team. Tony Book was a strange one, as he was 27 when he got into league football. Time was short for him, so I understood that one somewhat. No wonder we're cynical.... decades of being sold out. Other clubs manage it, even Blackpool managed to keep Charlie Adam long enough to get them up. Bad custodians, that's been the problem.

"The past is a foreign country - they do things differently there " . I suggest that you and a few others on this Board live in the past . We cannot affect the past but by god we can affect the future . Are you still AWOL PP . Is it accomplishing anything ? . My invite to have a drink and chat is always open . Come to a Fans Fest meet people who are trying to make the Club a better Club .

But have those people learnt from the mistakes of the past?

"The past is a foreign country - they do things differently there " . I suggest that you and a few others on this Board live in the past . We cannot affect the past but by god we can affect the future .

Very philosophical.Here's a bit of counter philosophy;

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

You could say the same about the future GG. There's always plenty of jam tomorrow ... no relegations there.
I live my life in the present, the day if I can. We are bottom of L2.
Like it or not, the past affects the present somewhat. Some would say the future too, something I have a leaning toward ( D M Thomas .. a fine Booker prize nominated Cornish author ).
The past is there to show us a better way and ignored at our peril.

Frank Bullitt wrote:

greengenes wrote:

penzancepirate wrote:

Greenskin wrote:

Whether it was the best way forward,rather than staff taking industrial action is very debatable but as i say,motives were sound as far as i'm concerned.

That's exactly as I see it. Those who wanted to contribute ? Do your own thing. We all help people out when we think it is the right thing to do. But stop the hounding of the people who thought quite clearly it was counter productive and nothing but long term proxy cash into the pockets of the money men doing the deal, and a sure fire way to extend the process. It could be argued it was only the late strike threat that actually brought the matter to an end.

The way forward was indeed DEBATEABLE, and my view was always industrial action to bring the money men's mind into sharp immediate focus, particularly the secured creditors and previous owners .. their feet wouldn't have touched the ground in the rush to do a deal.... any deal, rather than sitting back counting the money as wages went unpaid. Indeed Chris Webb stated that if the Argyle thing were his postal workers, that's exactly what he would have reccomended to his staff.

And GS is right, there has been a littany of let downs at the club, Trebilcock, Mariner and Rafferty being the worst for me. But at least in those days we could keep a future England star like Mariner for 3 seasons !! These days, the likes of Gosling and SEB are sold on before some of them even command a plac in OUR first team. Tony Book was a strange one, as he was 27 when he got into league football. Time was short for him, so I understood that one somewhat. No wonder we're cynical.... decades of being sold out. Other clubs manage it, even Blackpool managed to keep Charlie Adam long enough to get them up. Bad custodians, that's been the problem.

"The past is a foreign country - they do things differently there " . I suggest that you and a few others on this Board live in the past . We cannot affect the past but by god we can affect the future . Are you still AWOL PP . Is it accomplishing anything ? . My invite to have a drink and chat is always open . Come to a Fans Fest meet people who are trying to make the Club a better Club .

But have those people learnt from the mistakes of the past?

We've all learnt a lot this year . No one takes anything on face value any more . I just wish a few people on here could learn from their mistakes and move on from long entrenched views . Views buried deep in history in some cases . Its different now . The outright criticism of people working to raise funds and help the staff makes me sick to be honest .

penzancepirate wrote:

You could say the same about the future GG. There's always plenty of jam tomorrow ... no relegations there.
I live my life in the present, the day if I can. We are bottom of L2.
Like it or not, the past affects the present somewhat. Some would say the future too, something I have a leaning toward ( D M Thomas .. a fine Booker prize nominated Cornish author ).
The past is there to show us a better way and ignored at our peril.

Well bloody well DO something . Tippy tapping away with snidey comments from afar on a pc does you no credit at all PP .

greengenes wrote:

The outright criticism of people working to raise funds and help the staff makes me sick to be honest .

Are you talking about the Green Taverners thread Penzer started?

'Cos if you are then I personally think it helped achieve openness and clarity on an issue which didn't sit too easily with many.

Otherwise, I don't see many examples of the above tbh.

Mock Cuncher wrote:

greengenes wrote:

The outright criticism of people working to raise funds and help the staff makes me sick to be honest .

Are you talking about the Green Taverners thread Penzer started?

'Cos if you are then I personally think it helped achieve openness and clarity on an issue which didn't sit too easily with many.

Otherwise, I don't see many examples of the above tbh.

Tell me what doesn' sit too easily with you .

Meanwhile back on topic............


What about an ATD board on the side of the Mayflower? As someone said, it's the right side for most fans to see and since we have no real interest in TV advertising, should be cheaper.

Matchball sponsorship at £100 a head is a bit strong methinks, for a three course lunch and tour of the Mayflower. Okay, so we would get our name in the programme, but I personally think we should investigate the advertising board thing first. Then perhaps we can arrange our own corporate jolly?

I'm happy to look into all this if someone would like to give me official permission to speak on behalf of ATD? At the moment, I'm just an anonymous cyber person who posts from Willand.

I'll be at Bristol on Boxing Day and at the three home games in January if anyone wants to meet up and discuss in more depth? Raising the money, and how, bank account required? etc, etc. PM or email me, perhaps?

And all you golfists, you're on the wrong forum. Handbag.com is over there -------------------------------------->

Cerbera wrote:

Meanwhile back on topic............


What about an ATD board on the side of the Mayflower? As someone said, it's the right side for most fans to see and since we have no real interest in TV advertising, should be cheaper.

Matchball sponsorship at £100 a head is a bit strong methinks, for a three course lunch and tour of the Mayflower. Okay, so we would get our name in the programme, but I personally think we should investigate the advertising board thing first. Then perhaps we can arrange our own corporate jolly?

I'm happy to look into all this if someone would like to give me official permission to speak on behalf of ATD? At the moment, I'm just an anonymous cyber person who posts from Willand.

I'll be at Bristol on Boxing Day and at the three home games in January if anyone wants to meet up and discuss in more depth? Raising the money, and how, bank account required? etc, etc. PM or email me, perhaps?

And all you golfists, you're on the wrong forum. Handbag.com is over there -------------------------------------->

If I was a betting man which I am I reckon nothing will happen . Why ? Because its all a bit Aviva for this site .

greengenes wrote:

penzancepirate wrote:

You could say the same about the future GG. There's always plenty of jam tomorrow ... no relegations there.
I live my life in the present, the day if I can. We are bottom of L2.
Like it or not, the past affects the present somewhat. Some would say the future too, something I have a leaning toward ( D M Thomas .. a fine Booker prize nominated Cornish author ).
The past is there to show us a better way and ignored at our peril.

Well bloody well DO something . Tippy tapping away with snidey comments from afar on a pc does you no credit at all PP .

What did you have in mind, when you say do something?

Personally, I am uncomfortable about raising money to pay staff back dated wages (without doubt a priority) but it should be JB and his company that are paying back the money. I don't think funds should be raised when the sole owner of PAFC is a multi millionaire and many of us ordinary janners are just about making a living.

For my part, I am attending Bristol away, and via the deal the club has done, all the home games in January. For me and my son, that's was a quick £92 the other day. I feel that is the best way to support the club and staff financially at the moment, or have I misunderstood you? If so, sorry.

greengenes wrote:

Mock Cuncher wrote:

greengenes wrote:

The outright criticism of people working to raise funds and help the staff makes me sick to be honest .

Are you talking about the Green Taverners thread Penzer started?

'Cos if you are then I personally think it helped achieve openness and clarity on an issue which didn't sit too easily with many.

Otherwise, I don't see many examples of the above tbh.

Tell me what doesn' sit too easily with you .

The fact that no-one was aware of what their donations were going to until penz poked about and we eventually got an answer.


Go for it Cerbs, no harm enquiring, if it is reasonable and feasible then I'd chip in a dollar or two (in return for a banner of course, to prove how much of a fan I am)

greengenes wrote:

If I was a betting man which I am I reckon nothing will happen . Why ? Because its all a bit Aviva for this site .

I'll take your bet. How much do you want to wager?

All we are talking about is looking into a board at HP to raise the profile of ATD. Don't think for one moment I am going to stand outside the Demport flogging scarves or getting a f-off great ATD flag

We could get an ATD flag with the ATD cote-of-arms, drape it round our shoulders as a mass unit of ATD manliness in Block Two, and heckle the camp ultras (and Peggy) waving their great new flags (black an green, who'd have thought it?!!!) in block 3!

Or we could just watch football like we normally do...

FACT - The momey is going to helping the staff . I met a few yesterday and they are highly appreciative of everything the GTs do and continue to do for them financially .
FACT - The Fans Fests not only make money to help the staff but for lots of ordinary fans enriches the matchday "experience" for them . I have a battle hardened Celtic supporting friend who attends with me and he cannot praise it more highly .
FACT - James Brent is not responsible for the mess the previous shameful Directors left . he is an astute business man who has saved Argyle and wants it to become self supporting . That I believe is a great aim to have . It just wouldn't be Argyle if we had some sugar daddy looking after us .

If you attend matches then that is great - it helps the Club .

Cerbera wrote:

greengenes wrote:

If I was a betting man which I am I reckon nothing will happen . Why ? Because its all a bit Aviva for this site .

I'll take your bet. How much do you want to wager?

All we are talking about is looking into a board at HP to raise the profile of ATD. Don't think for one moment I am going to stand outside the Demport flogging scarves or getting a f-off great ATD flag

£10 worth of beer to be enjoyed together

Mock Cuncher wrote:

We could get an ATD flag with the ATD cote-of-arms, drape it round our shoulders as a mass unit of ATD manliness in Block Two, and heckle the camp ultras (and Peggy) waving their great new flags (black an white, who'd have thought it?!!!) in block 3!

Or we could just watch football like we normally do...

I know it's probably part of a carefully orchestrated plot to take the mind of the masses of how crap we are on the football pitch, but all this bollox about flag waving (£3,500 for a flag ffs!), fan festing, forza verdying, song sheeting, auctioneering etc etc etc, is just that - bollox.

The real meat on the bones of this football club is how we perform on the pitch - and that's been dire for the last 3 years.

So Mr Brent, hand in pocket in January please, get some decent players down here, get us moving up the league and all this other nonsense will fade away into the background, which is where it should be - not pushed to the forefront of what's happening at Home Park.

Winning games provides the feelgood factor - not flag waving or jumping up and down.

PlymptonPilgrim wrote:

Mock Cuncher wrote:

We could get an ATD flag with the ATD cote-of-arms, drape it round our shoulders as a mass unit of ATD manliness in Block Two, and heckle the camp ultras (and Peggy) waving their great new flags (black an white, who'd have thought it?!!!) in block 3!

Or we could just watch football like we normally do...

I know it's probably part of a carefully orchestrated plot to take the mind of the masses of how crap we are on the football pitch, but all this bollox about flag waving (£3,500 for a flag ffs!), fan festing, forza verdying, song sheeting, auctioneering etc etc etc, is just that - bollox.

The real meat on the bones of this football club is how we perform on the pitch - and that's been dire for the last 3 years.

So Mr Brent, hand in pocket in January please, get some decent players down here, get us moving up the league and all this other nonsense will fade away into the background, which is where it should be - not pushed to the forefront of what's happening at Home Park.

Winning games provides the feelgood factor - not flag waving or jumping up and down.

Wholeheartedly agree PP. All I wanted to organise was a bit of sponsorship!!

I'll look into the options in the New Year.

Cerbera wrote:

PlymptonPilgrim wrote:

Mock Cuncher wrote:

We could get an ATD flag with the ATD cote-of-arms, drape it round our shoulders as a mass unit of ATD manliness in Block Two, and heckle the camp ultras (and Peggy) waving their great new flags (black an white, who'd have thought it?!!!) in block 3!

Or we could just watch football like we normally do...

I know it's probably part of a carefully orchestrated plot to take the mind of the masses of how crap we are on the football pitch, but all this bollox about flag waving (£3,500 for a flag ffs!), fan festing, forza verdying, song sheeting, auctioneering etc etc etc, is just that - bollox.

The real meat on the bones of this football club is how we perform on the pitch - and that's been dire for the last 3 years.

So Mr Brent, hand in pocket in January please, get some decent players down here, get us moving up the league and all this other nonsense will fade away into the background, which is where it should be - not pushed to the forefront of what's happening at Home Park.

Winning games provides the feelgood factor - not flag waving or jumping up and down.

Wholeheartedly agree PP. All I wanted to organise was a bit of sponsorship!!

I'll look into the options in the New Year.

Sorry, wasn't having a rant at you, sponsorship is obviously crucial, it's just all this other stuff which seems to be thought of as the most important aspects in the club.

greengenes wrote:

FACT - The momey is going to helping the staff . I met a few yesterday and they are highly appreciative of everything the GTs do and continue to do for them financially .
FACT - The Fans Fests not only make money to help the staff but for lots of ordinary fans enriches the matchday "experience" for them . I have a battle hardened Celtic supporting friend who attends with me and he cannot praise it more highly .
FACT - James Brent is not responsible for the mess the previous shameful Directors left . he is an astute business man who has saved Argyle and wants it to become self supporting . That I believe is a great aim to have . It just wouldn't be Argyle if we had some sugar daddy looking after us .

If you attend matches then that is great - it helps the Club .

Sorry to continue the hijack, but....

Someone on Pasoti - may have been Newell - stated the other day that some of the staff are literally 'desperate', in terms of finance. I believe this to be FACT.

No reason to disbelieve that, which is why I find it utterly astonishing that a, ahem, Contingency Plan hasn't been put together by our multi-millionaire owner to remedy this state of desperation for the most needy. £££'s that would put their lives back on track, would be small change to Brent.

greengenes wrote:

FACT - The momey is going to helping the staff . I met a few yesterday and they are highly appreciative of everything the GTs do and continue to do for them financially .
FACT - The Fans Fests not only make money to help the staff but for lots of ordinary fans enriches the matchday "experience" for them . I have a battle hardened Celtic supporting friend who attends with me and he cannot praise it more highly .
FACT - James Brent is not responsible for the mess the previous shameful Directors left . he is an astute business man who has saved Argyle and wants it to become self supporting . That I believe is a great aim to have . It just wouldn't be Argyle if we had some sugar daddy looking after us .

If you attend matches then that is great - it helps the Club .

Brent has not stated in any way that the club should be self supporting,its a load of assumptive bollocks.For about the umpteenth time and not just on this site,here's what he actually said on completion of the takeover;

"We have made it very clear from he outset that this is not a sugar daddy operation.There is no ambition to chuck money at the club,but this is a big club and we will provide the financial support that it needs to move back to the level at which it should perform."

BTW,are you saying that you wouldn't welcome a sugar daddy who would put a few quid into the club and get a decent team and ground in place?