The Official Mansfield are Worse then Notts Co Match Thread

Cornish Chris wrote:

Poor old Mansfield.

I wonder if they hate Sheridan. Mansfield-Chesterfield is a Crapico on the scale of the Devon A38 Mostly-Dual Carriageway Derby isn't it?

Think it stems back to the miners strike in 1984 when one town supported it, the other didn't, can't remember which was which.

Nice little two point cushion plus the gd, win on Tuesday and we should be ok for a po spot. Whatever the negatives of today it was a must win that we actually won. I think the major thing going against us at the moment is confidence, I don't think we have much either the team or the fans. You can hear the frustration from the crowd and it knocks the team back. I'm not saying I blame Argyle fans for lacking confidence but it's there, the size of the crowd reflects that as well.

I listened to JS's interview with Sparksy after the match. He said that he read that even if Argyle get in the play offs they will get beaten (Don't read PASOTI John it'll do your head in). He said that was pathetic and this is a very tight league and anyone can beat anyone and we are as good as anyone.
He's a dour man but he tells it like it is.

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

Argyle were 91st in the league when he came here. I think he's done ok but it's never enough regardless of which team you support. In your case I'm not sure who you support.

gasser9 wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

Argyle were 91st in the league when he came here. I think he's done ok but it's never enough regardless of which team you support. In your case I'm not sure who you support.

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

We are organised. Whatever the criticisms that could be fairly pointed at Argyle a lack of organisation is not one of them: everybody knows their drill; the players on the pitch rotate through positions to cover if one of them is caught upfield; set-pieces routines are well rehearsed defensively and offensively. We are organised to within an inch of our lives.

I also am unaware of any lack of effort or commitment. The players go out there play their shape and put in a shift whilst working their socks off and defending like dogs every week so in terms of leading, inspiring, managing etc Sheridan is doing fine.

And yet... and yet... It all hasn't been good enough by a long chalk over the season.

I guess we could do with a pros/cons table and a genuine assessment of our strengths and weaknesses to try and sort out what the problems are - or at least to identify weaknesses and address them.

There's 3 things that leap out at me.

Firstly we don't have much in terms of genuine pace up front. Reuben is more a battering ram that goes quickly once it gets going but takes a few steps to do so and Alessandra gets going very quickly but doesn't go that fast once he does. We could do with a "pigeon catcher".

Secondly we don't seem very big physically. Mansfield yesterday were a pretty bloody enormous side. Midgetty sides just don't get very far.

Thirdly we seem to sit off and concede possession far, far too much and yesterday, again, was a perfect example. We started the game well, scored a brilliant early goal and then went close again soon after. Make no mistake about it Mansfield were a complete shambles to begin with and we have done a Chesterfield by rattling up so many before they got started that the game was over. They were all over the place. Instead of which that all that shape, players in their slots, denying space whilst not really contesting possession became the mode we dropped into. They got a feel for the ball, surface, conditions and gradually began to improve to the point where they were, arguably, the better side on the day - and they are 88th out of the 92: 4th worst team in the league pyramid and I doubt that Sheridan would take any of their players over any of ours (although their #23 looked useful up front).

I think all of our problems come from the same root as much of our success. Playing 3 CBs leaves us regularly a man short in midfield and this in turn allows mediocre teams like Mansfield an easy advantage which they can readily exploit as long as they are good enough to pass the ball around a little.

This is a deep-rooted issue and even non-league Fylde did the same thing to us. It is a recurring theme and deeply frustrating but while we play with 5 at the back I don't think it is going to change very much.

we play with 3 at the back and 2 wing backs

I once offered to walk from Tring to Plymouth and buy all farm members a pint and a pasty, if Argyle with Stapleton involved, got to the PL.

I'll make the same offer if Argyle, with the reluctant one and/or sheridan involved, make the Championship.

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

We are organised. Whatever the criticisms that could be fairly pointed at Argyle a lack of organisation is not one of them: everybody knows their drill; the players on the pitch rotate through positions to cover if one of them is caught upfield; set-pieces routines are well rehearsed defensively and offensively. We are organised to within an inch of our lives.

I also am unaware of any lack of effort or commitment. The players go out there play their shape and put in a shift whilst working their socks off and defending like dogs every week so in terms of leading, inspiring, managing etc Sheridan is doing fine.

And yet... and yet... It all hasn't been good enough by a long chalk over the season.
...

Not good enough for who? A demanding over-expectant section of the fanbase which includes a small but very vocal group who will defend the owner at all costs. Personally I'd say overall we're pretty much par for course.

The summer signings of Reid and Cox were good 'uns, 2 of our better players last season who played their part in lifting us to 10th, well away from relegation but well short of the play-offs come the end. Hartley, McHugh and perhaps to a lesser degree Mellor have proven to be good additions. So 4 out of 5 signings who have all played their part in making us one of the tightest of defences, I'm sure we're all happy with that so far. Throw in O'Connor and job done defensively.

Banton has been a disappointment and of course we lost Hourihane after much of our summer activity had already happened, two huge gaping holes in our attacking ability. Goal-scoring midfielders are hard to come by, especially when you're restricted financially and much of your pre-season budget is already spent, the money received for Houriane clearly wasn't enough to find an adequate replacement at such short notice, pretty much confirmed by Sheridan himself taking a punt on the non-league Norburn. The lack of goals from midfield come as no real surprise. Bobby Reid has been a decent loanee chipping in with a couple of goals but the endless coming and going has been disruptive. Olly Lee looks set to be another disappointment but still time for him, perhaps.

Roobs has done his bit but really needs a rest. Another summer signing, Dean Smalley unfortunately got injured for the rest of the season. Brunt no doubt comes cheaply and Ansah is a last ditch attempt.

It could be argued perhaps Sheridan could've loaned less defensive minded players but there seems to be a number of the few players we do actually own who have been playing while carrying niggling injuries, Hartley, Mellor and Cox spring immediately to mind. Our over reliance on loan signings this season has proven disruptive and IMO quite shameful. The fact we're still in contention is progress and should be applauded as far as Sheridan is concerned.

Not a pretty affair and nor did I expect one at this stage, as others have said, the players are feeding off the tension from the fans and vice versa, I expect the same on Tuesday but another win no matter how ugly will be immense. A few mugs again started booing on the half time whistle and we were 1 nil up FCOL !! OK the standard of football wasn't great but come on, a bit of positivity from the fans might just help the team over the finishing line and give us a chance to finally escape this graveyard division. COME ON ARGYLE

Coxside_Green wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

We are organised. Whatever the criticisms that could be fairly pointed at Argyle a lack of organisation is not one of them: everybody knows their drill; the players on the pitch rotate through positions to cover if one of them is caught upfield; set-pieces routines are well rehearsed defensively and offensively. We are organised to within an inch of our lives.

I also am unaware of any lack of effort or commitment. The players go out there play their shape and put in a shift whilst working their socks off and defending like dogs every week so in terms of leading, inspiring, managing etc Sheridan is doing fine.

And yet... and yet... It all hasn't been good enough by a long chalk over the season.
...

Not good enough for who?  A demanding over-expectant section of the fanbase which includes a small but very vocal group who will defend the owner at all costs.  Personally I'd say overall we're pretty much par for course.

The summer signings of Reid and Cox were good 'uns, 2 of our better players last season who played their part in lifting us to 10th, well away from relegation but well short of the play-offs come the end.  Hartley, McHugh and perhaps to a lesser degree Mellor have proven to be good additions.  So 4 out of 5 signings who have all played their part in making us one of the tightest of defences, I'm sure we're all happy with that so far.  Throw in O'Connor and job done defensively.

Banton has been a disappointment and of course we lost Hourihane after much of our summer activity had already happened, two huge gaping holes in our attacking ability.  Goal-scoring midfielders are hard to come by, especially when you're restricted financially and much of your pre-season budget is already spent, the money received for Houriane clearly wasn't enough to find an adequate replacement at such short notice, pretty much confirmed by Sheridan himself taking a punt on the non-league Norburn.  The lack of goals from midfield come as no real surprise.  Bobby Reid has been a decent loanee chipping in with a couple of goals but the endless coming and going has been disruptive.  Olly Lee looks set to be another disappointment but still time for him, perhaps.

Roobs has done his bit but really needs a rest.  Another summer signing, Dean Smalley unfortunately got injured for the rest of the season.  Brunt no doubt comes cheaply and Ansah is a last ditch attempt.

It could be argued perhaps Sheridan could've loaned less defensive minded players but there seems to be a number of the few players we do actually own who have been playing while carrying niggling injuries, Hartley, Mellor and Cox spring immediately to mind.  Our over reliance on loan signings this season has proven disruptive and IMO quite shameful.  The fact we're still in contention is progress and should be applauded as far as Sheridan is concerned.

Confirmation that Greenskin and Coxside are twins.

AstiSpumante wrote:

Not a pretty affair and nor did I expect one at this stage, as others have said, the players are feeding off the tension from the fans and vice versa, I expect the same on Tuesday but another win no matter how ugly will be immense. A few mugs again started booing on the half time whistle and we were 1 nil up FCOL !!  OK the standard of football wasn't great but come on, a bit of positivity from the fans might just help the team over the finishing line and give us a chance to finally escape this graveyard division.  COME ON ARGYLE

I think it all boils down to everyone being on the nervy side. The fans want the team to do well, the team want to satisfy the fans and so on and so on.

I am nervy, seeing Argyle get over the finishing line is all i want. If that goes on to include a trip to Wembley, all the better.

The club have not been in this type of position for sometime now and those fans that boo and complain are only letting frustrations be known. The players are man enough to take criticism and should shrug it off and go about the task they are trying to achieve.

We as fans all moan when Argyle are not doing well and we all praise the side when they have played good football and got a result.

As for we, the fans, the end of the season would be better to voice and air opinions toward the manager and team. Right now though, we the fans should give 100% backing and help lift the side into the Play-Offs, and possibly beyond.

Having said that, should the above not happen, then the post-mortem and inquest brigade can write at will, and i will be one of them..

Greenskin wrote:

Coxside_Green wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

We are organised. Whatever the criticisms that could be fairly pointed at Argyle a lack of organisation is not one of them: everybody knows their drill; the players on the pitch rotate through positions to cover if one of them is caught upfield; set-pieces routines are well rehearsed defensively and offensively. We are organised to within an inch of our lives.

I also am unaware of any lack of effort or commitment. The players go out there play their shape and put in a shift whilst working their socks off and defending like dogs every week so in terms of leading, inspiring, managing etc Sheridan is doing fine.

And yet... and yet... It all hasn't been good enough by a long chalk over the season.
...

Not good enough for who?  A demanding over-expectant section of the fanbase which includes a small but very vocal group who will defend the owner at all costs.  Personally I'd say overall we're pretty much par for course.

The summer signings of Reid and Cox were good 'uns, 2 of our better players last season who played their part in lifting us to 10th, well away from relegation but well short of the play-offs come the end.  Hartley, McHugh and perhaps to a lesser degree Mellor have proven to be good additions.  So 4 out of 5 signings who have all played their part in making us one of the tightest of defences, I'm sure we're all happy with that so far.  Throw in O'Connor and job done defensively.

Banton has been a disappointment and of course we lost Hourihane after much of our summer activity had already happened, two huge gaping holes in our attacking ability.  Goal-scoring midfielders are hard to come by, especially when you're restricted financially and much of your pre-season budget is already spent, the money received for Houriane clearly wasn't enough to find an adequate replacement at such short notice, pretty much confirmed by Sheridan himself taking a punt on the non-league Norburn.  The lack of goals from midfield come as no real surprise.  Bobby Reid has been a decent loanee chipping in with a couple of goals but the endless coming and going has been disruptive.  Olly Lee looks set to be another disappointment but still time for him, perhaps.

Roobs has done his bit but really needs a rest.  Another summer signing, Dean Smalley unfortunately got injured for the rest of the season.  Brunt no doubt comes cheaply and Ansah is a last ditch attempt.

It could be argued perhaps Sheridan could've loaned less defensive minded players but there seems to be a number of the few players we do actually own who have been playing while carrying niggling injuries, Hartley, Mellor and Cox spring immediately to mind.  Our over reliance on loan signings this season has proven disruptive and IMO quite shameful.  The fact we're still in contention is progress and should be applauded as far as Sheridan is concerned.

Confirmation that Greenskin and Coxside are twins.

I'll be your little brother.

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

OK but Jimmy Floyd situation is similar to when Luggy left for Saints. Kevin S took over initially and all the side needed was the odd little tweak here and there. At that stage the motor was finely tuned and running well. JS said ''play-offs minimum'' so lets see if he delivers.
I wonder if the stars are lining up for a Shrewsbury (must win to be champs) vs Argyle (must win to stay in play-offs ????) Be a full house and some bleedy atmosphere.

Angry wrote:

we play with 3 at the back and 2 wing backs

Nope, they should be wingbacks but they're natural fullbacks and play as such. They're too often caught flat in line with the back three. Mellor is the best "wingback" we have, in terms of knowing how to position himself and balancing attack with defense, but he's turned into a right clumsy shite. The system depends on having wingbacks that know their roles well enough to compensate for the lack of wide personnel - that's why we flourished with an inform Mellor and Andy Kellett throughout November and early December.

tigertony wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

OK but Jimmy Floyd situation is similar to when Luggy left for Saints. Kevin S took over initially and all the side needed was the odd little tweak here and there. At that stage the motor was finely tuned and running well. JS said ''play-offs minimum'' so lets see if he delivers.
I wonder if the stars are lining up for a Shrewsbury (must win to be champs) vs Argyle (must win to stay in play-offs ????) Be a full house and some bleedy atmosphere.

I am hoping it does not come down to that as Argyle would have already secured a PO spot at home to Tranmere the week before..

Coxside_Green wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

We are organised. Whatever the criticisms that could be fairly pointed at Argyle a lack of organisation is not one of them: everybody knows their drill; the players on the pitch rotate through positions to cover if one of them is caught upfield; set-pieces routines are well rehearsed defensively and offensively. We are organised to within an inch of our lives.

I also am unaware of any lack of effort or commitment. The players go out there play their shape and put in a shift whilst working their socks off and defending like dogs every week so in terms of leading, inspiring, managing etc Sheridan is doing fine.

And yet... and yet... It all hasn't been good enough by a long chalk over the season.
...

Not good enough for who?  A demanding over-expectant section of the fanbase which includes a small but very vocal group who will defend the owner at all costs.  Personally I'd say overall we're pretty much par for course.

Failing to get promotion from this division might not be quite as bad as getting relegated to it but it isn't that far off. Every single season we fail to get out of this division is not good enough. Whoever the manger is. Whoever the owner is. Simple as that.

And I don't think we lack talent in the squad. Right now we have some of the best ball-playing, possession-retaining, good-first-touch players in the division. We can play a bit when we have the ball and we have players who can finish, too.

I also think the continuing use of The Hourihane Defence is getting a bit passé. Even if it is true we have had long enough now to fill the gap caused by his leaving.

As for scraping into the play-offs being "par"... No. No it isn't. Winning them might be but simply just getting there? No. 'Fraid not. Doesn't do it for me and didn't do it for Sheridan until recently.

Every miserable, unpromoted year spent in this division is failure writ large.

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Coxside_Green wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

We are organised. Whatever the criticisms that could be fairly pointed at Argyle a lack of organisation is not one of them: everybody knows their drill; the players on the pitch rotate through positions to cover if one of them is caught upfield; set-pieces routines are well rehearsed defensively and offensively. We are organised to within an inch of our lives.

I also am unaware of any lack of effort or commitment. The players go out there play their shape and put in a shift whilst working their socks off and defending like dogs every week so in terms of leading, inspiring, managing etc Sheridan is doing fine.

And yet... and yet... It all hasn't been good enough by a long chalk over the season.
...

Not good enough for who?  A demanding over-expectant section of the fanbase which includes a small but very vocal group who will defend the owner at all costs.  Personally I'd say overall we're pretty much par for course.

Failing to get promotion from this division might not be quite as bad as getting relegated to it but it isn't that far off. Every single season we fail to get out of this division is not good enough. Whoever the manger is. Whoever the owner is.  Simple as that.

And I don't think we lack talent in the squad. Right now we have some of the best ball-playing, possession-retaining, good-first-touch players in the division. We can play a bit when we have the ball and we have players who can finish, too.

I also think the continuing use of The Hourihane Defence is getting a bit passé. Even if it is true we have had long enough now to fill the gap caused by his leaving.

As for scraping into the play-offs being "par"... No. No it isn't. Winning them might be but simply just getting there? No. 'Fraid not. Doesn't do it for me and didn't do it for Sheridan until recently.

Every miserable, unpromoted year spent in this division is failure writ large.

I agree not getting out of this league is a failure but putting all the blame on Sheridan? That's just nonsense. If you want to demand promotion then ensure the manager has a promotion budget, that's how Warnock and Luggy got us out of this league. Simple as that.

We don't lack talent but we lack consistency, no different to any of the other upper mid-table/chasing play-off teams. Does the endless reliance on loan signings help here? Of course not, especially when at times the handling of these loan deals have left the manager in no-mans land.

We've had long enough to replace Houriane perhaps but we haven't, not for the want of trying though, surely? Why did Barnsley pay £200k if goal-scoring midfielders are so easy to find/replace? Sheridan was afforded Bobby Reid and Olly Lee, they haven't been good enough. I suspect Sheridan tried to get others here, they didn't want to come, we couldn't afford them, whatever, they didn't come.

Scraping into the play-offs would be par for the budget, as would narrowly missing out. Try being realistic, it'll save being disappointed.

Where, exactly, have I criticised Sheridan? Or defended Brent?

Failing to win promotion isn't good enough and they could both go as far as I am concerned. Maybe it's just me and I don't get 3CBs and 2 FB/WBs - and that is Sheridan's choice and his alone.

"And yet... and yet... It all hasn't been good enough by a long chalk over the season" whilst talking about Sheridan suggests to me you are being critical of him. Perhaps that wasn't your intention but there's certainly a section of the fanbase who are holding him responsible should we fail to get promoted. It's unreasonable IMO.

Purely guessing, sticking with the 3 CBs is playing to our strengths given the limitations of our squad as a whole. Perhaps it's his coaching staff making that decision, who knows. As you said yourself, they're well organised, and Wotton has taken a lot of credit for the role he has played.

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Coxside_Green wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

It's his job to organise and inspire his team to be better. Like Jimmy Floyd has done at Burton.

We are organised. Whatever the criticisms that could be fairly pointed at Argyle a lack of organisation is not one of them: everybody knows their drill; the players on the pitch rotate through positions to cover if one of them is caught upfield; set-pieces routines are well rehearsed defensively and offensively. We are organised to within an inch of our lives.

I also am unaware of any lack of effort or commitment. The players go out there play their shape and put in a shift whilst working their socks off and defending like dogs every week so in terms of leading, inspiring, managing etc Sheridan is doing fine.

And yet... and yet... It all hasn't been good enough by a long chalk over the season.
...

Not good enough for who?  A demanding over-expectant section of the fanbase which includes a small but very vocal group who will defend the owner at all costs.  Personally I'd say overall we're pretty much par for course.

Failing to get promotion from this division might not be quite as bad as getting relegated to it but it isn't that far off. Every single season we fail to get out of this division is not good enough. Whoever the manger is. Whoever the owner is.  Simple as that.

And I don't think we lack talent in the squad. Right now we have some of the best ball-playing, possession-retaining, good-first-touch players in the division. We can play a bit when we have the ball and we have players who can finish, too.

I also think the continuing use of The Hourihane Defence is getting a bit passé. Even if it is true we have had long enough now to fill the gap caused by his leaving.

As for scraping into the play-offs being "par"... No. No it isn't. Winning them might be but simply just getting there? No. 'Fraid not. Doesn't do it for me and didn't do it for Sheridan until recently.

Every miserable, unpromoted year spent in this division is failure writ large.

Really? Aside from Reid and Alessandra, who else in the squad has demonstrated an ability to score goals consistently this season [or in any other season in their careers come to that]?

Exactly twin.

Roobs has had a decent season and Allesandra has managed 1 in 4. Nobody else has come close.

Top Posting from Coxy and Skinner, you bheys have pretty much summed it up for me!