ARE THEY FRIGGING MAD

i think the poster on that thread was drunk or forgot his medication that day. Very few agreed with him to be fair. Playoffs are not happening this season at all we have to concentrate on staying in league 2 at the moment. If we can continue this form i wouldn't rule out a mid table finish but playoffs are just not happening this season.

I'm not so sure Cerbs.

There WAS an immediate difference after Reid left for sure but that's not just a 'new manager bounce'. The malaise that had set in as regards poor performance and not seemingly being 'up for it' disappeared overnight. OK so the playing ability didn't change but football is as much about being focused as it is ability (see Tony Pulis and his ability to scare players into giving 100%).

Turning a football team round is not an overnight process, training ground changes, syystem changes and personnel changes all have a 'drag factor' as regards the time it takes for improvement to show itself. There was only about a month or so between Fletch/Ro taking over and O'Driscolls involvement being announced........hardly time for changes to fully take effect.

I was at work on Boxing day but although they're shaky mobile phone images those 12-15 minutes of footage on you-tube show you just what a difference has occurred. I've seen it first hand too, there's drive and forward momentum which simply wasn't there before, commitment and urgency that was lacking. Also coming back from two goals down, that shows belief and faith in themselves.

You simply can't put THAT down to Sean O'Driscoll, he's just a voice on the end of a phone for Carl Fletcher, the players don't see him on the touchline or the training ground. That attitude change, that motivation, that belief can only be coming from Carl and Ro..........and we forget Ro sometimes, the quiet man putting an arm of encouragement round the shoulder can have just as much impact as any tea-cup throwing animation.

We benefit from having Sean O'Driscolls experience on tap, i'm sure. But to say anything positive is his doing and anything negative is Fletch's doing is grossly unfair. Step back and look at the performances and recall the lumbering, half-arsed, shoulders down attidude of Reids tenure. We're much better focused and much better motivated - O'Driscoll can only suggest tactical changes, that change in attitude is 100% home grown, 100% Fletch and Ro.

We're not the finished article, we're not world beaters, far from it but Carl Fletcher and Romain Larrieu HAVE made a positive impact and SHOULD be given the credit for that.

X Isle wrote:

I'm not so sure Cerbs.

There WAS an immediate difference after Reid left for sure but that's not just a 'new manager bounce'. The malaise that had set in as regards poor performance and not seemingly being 'up for it' disappeared overnight. OK so the playing ability didn't change but football is as much about being focused as it is ability (see Tony Pulis and his ability to scare players into giving 100%).

Turning a football team round is not an overnight process, training ground changes, syystem changes and personnel changes all have a 'drag factor' as regards the time it takes for improvement to show itself. There was only about a month or so between Fletch/Ro taking over and O'Driscolls involvement being announced........hardly time for changes to fully take effect.

I was at work on Boxing day but although they're shaky mobile phone images those 12-15 minutes of footage on you-tube show you just what a difference has occurred. I've seen it first hand too, there's drive and forward momentum which simply wasn't there before, commitment and urgency that was lacking. Also coming back from two goals down, that shows belief and faith in themselves.

You simply can't put THAT down to Sean O'Driscoll, he's just a voice on the end of a phone for Carl Fletcher, the players don't see him on the touchline or the training ground. That attitude change, that motivation, that belief can only be coming from Carl and Ro..........and we forget Ro sometimes, the quiet man putting an arm of encouragement round the shoulder can have just as much impact as any tea-cup throwing animation.

We benefit from having Sean O'Driscolls experience on tap, i'm sure. But to say anything positive is his doing and anything negative is Fletch's doing is grossly unfair. Step back and look at the performances and recall the lumbering, half-arsed, shoulders down attidude of Reids tenure. We're much better focused and much better motivated - O'Driscoll can only suggest tactical changes, that change in attitude is 100% home grown, 100% Fletch and Ro.

We're not the finished article, we're not world beaters, far from it but Carl Fletcher and Romain Larrieu HAVE made a positive impact and SHOULD be given the credit for that.

Come off it Smiffy,of course it was the new manager bounce that led to results improving after Reid's departure.It lasted for a total of four games and was followed by a run of 7 without a win,culminating in that Stourbridge debacle,during which i must confess that i saw little of the aforementioned new found attitude and motivation inspired by Ro and Fletcher.Truth is,the current revival has been inspired by the acquisition of 5 players of reasonable quality since the takeover of the club by James Brent and whose presence is probably more than coincidental with the fact that there is now a likelihood that they will get actually get paid for doing their job.Reid had no such luxury-if he had been able to sign someone like Dickinson or Elding in the pre season,let alone a commanding defender of Purse's calibre and experience,then our season would have been totally different,no matter who was in charge.Having said that,i'm not saying that i disagreed with Reid's departure-i think that the situation had started to beat the man down,very understandably so,IMHO,whether Fletcher is the answer in the long term remains to be seen.

Smiffy, I am not saying that anything positive is down to O'Driscoll and and all negativity is down to Fletch. Just that a major change seems to have taken place, which I am struggling to credit Fletch with 100%. Surely if he had been this good from day one, we wouldn't have gone on such a disastrous losing streak.

Something is definitely going on though, our discipline seemed better at Bristol, whether that was a fluke or not remains to be seen. We were lucky at Bristol, that is for sure, but someone said something to the lads at half time.

I think that if we can keep this squad together and get one or two to augment our team in January, we will finish mid table - providing the current form and fitness is maintained.

I agree with you on the last bit.

But please answer me this, who do you think said those things at half time?.

a) Carl Fletcher & Romain Larrieu

b) Sean O'Driscoll

Carl Fletcher DOES deserve the credit 100%. Remember, if he's sought advice from a trusted confident and that's helped then that's STILL credit to Carl Fletcher, only a stubborn fool would do otherwise (keep his own counsel and not seek a fresh pair of eyes to offer advice).

He's doing OK, he/they deserve better than the constant question marks and calls for dismissal they're being given. What's more we'll benefit from the deep end he's holding his own in next season, when he's cut his managerial milk teeth and we can regroup.

Cerbera wrote:

Freathy you would be of the opinion that we cannot maintain league status with the squad we have?

We have to supplement, where?

Not disagreeing with you, just interested.

As it is we're still far too easy to score against. Saturday proved that. Bristol Rovers are truly woeful and if it wasn't for their shocking defending and a howler by their keeper we would have lost. We need a commanding central midfielder and a defender. We may be OK upfront with Chadwick and Hemmings for now but we lose them both next month, well certainly Hemmings anyway. So we need two strikers. And we need these players as soon as the window opens not on 30 Jan!! So sort it out brent or stand aside for someone who will invest in the team!!

X Isle wrote:

I agree with you on the last bit.

But please answer me this, who do you think said those things at half time?.

a) Carl Fletcher & Romain Larrieu

b) Sean O'Driscoll

Carl Fletcher DOES deserve the credit 100%. Remember, if he's sought advice from a trusted confident and that's helped then that's STILL credit to Carl Fletcher, only a stubborn fool would do otherwise (keep his own counsel and not seek a fresh pair of eyes to offer advice).

He's doing OK, he/they deserve better than the constant question marks and calls for dismissal they're being given. What's more we'll benefit from the deep end he's holding his own in next season, when he's cut his managerial milk teeth and we can regroup.

Clearly the answer is a) it could be no other.

I admit I thought Fletch was out of his depth at management, and to be honest still need convincing. A run of four without defeat is hardly a 'Huddersfield' is it? However, I think he is getting some serious mentoring from Mr O'D. I didn't see him or Ro frantically talking into their mobiles at the Rec, so can only assume that they are getting it together. A result at Aldershot will help convince me further, which, if your thoughts are right is on the cards. The 'Shots are having a poor run of form and we are apparently on the up. It will also be more of an indicator since we won't be playing fellow relegation fodder - well, they aren't yet!

Freathy wrote:

Cerbera wrote:

Freathy you would be of the opinion that we cannot maintain league status with the squad we have?

We have to supplement, where?

Not disagreeing with you, just interested.

As it is we're still far too easy to score against. Saturday proved that. Bristol Rovers are truly woeful and if it wasn't for their shocking defending and a howler by their keeper we would have lost. We need a commanding central midfielder and a defender. We may be OK upfront with Chadwick and Hemmings for now but we lose them both next month, well certainly Hemmings anyway. So we need two strikers. And we need these players as soon as the window opens not on 30 Jan!! So sort it out brent or stand aside for someone who will invest in the team!!

Agree we are far too easy to score against, which is why we need Darren Purse growling at our back four. We need another defender, for certain.

Whilst I think it will be difficult to hold onto Hemmings, there's nothing to suggest he's definitely going is there? He would be a major, major loss. A totally different class.

Freathy wrote:

Cerbera wrote:

Freathy you would be of the opinion that we cannot maintain league status with the squad we have?

We have to supplement, where?

Not disagreeing with you, just interested.

As it is we're still far too easy to score against. Saturday proved that. Bristol Rovers are truly woeful and if it wasn't for their shocking defending and a howler by their keeper we would have lost. We need a commanding central midfielder and a defender. We may be OK upfront with Chadwick and Hemmings for now but we lose them both next month, well certainly Hemmings anyway. So we need two strikers. And we need these players as soon as the window opens not on 30 Jan!! So sort it out brent or stand aside for someone who will invest in the team!!

So Freathy, Brent decides to step away, where do you think is the person who is going to turn up and invest in the team? They were pretty quiet for the last year unless you know something I don't. He's paying players, enabled Fletch to bring some others in asap and we haven't made the first transfer window yet.

On another note, on current form [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] we're 16th and Aldershot are 13th. Any of you going to the Garden Gate on Sat for a prematch tipple.

Cheers
Mike

shonbo wrote:

Freathy wrote:

Cerbera wrote:

Freathy you would be of the opinion that we cannot maintain league status with the squad we have?

We have to supplement, where?

Not disagreeing with you, just interested.

As it is we're still far too easy to score against. Saturday proved that. Bristol Rovers are truly woeful and if it wasn't for their shocking defending and a howler by their keeper we would have lost. We need a commanding central midfielder and a defender. We may be OK upfront with Chadwick and Hemmings for now but we lose them both next month, well certainly Hemmings anyway. So we need two strikers. And we need these players as soon as the window opens not on 30 Jan!! So sort it out brent or stand aside for someone who will invest in the team!!

So Freathy, Brent decides to step away, where do you think is the person who is going to turn up and invest in the team? They were pretty quiet for the last year unless you know something I don't. He's paying players, enabled Fletch to bring some others in asap and we haven't made the first transfer window yet.

On another note, on current form [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] we're 16th and Aldershot are 13th. Any of you going to the Garden Gate on Sat for a prematch tipple.

Cheers
Mike

Leaving Brent out of the equation for a moment,possibly one of the reasons for the lack of interest in the club was that,by his own admission,Guilfoyle did not seek either to market or advertise the club and accepted that Ridsdale had "already done the work".

shonbo wrote:

On another note, on current form [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] we're 16th and Aldershot are 13th. Any of you going to the Garden Gate on Sat for a prematch tipple.

Cheers
Mike

Good chance I'll be there. Depends on the weather, hate walking about in the rain!

Cerbera wrote:

shonbo wrote:

On another note, on current form [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] we're 16th and Aldershot are 13th. Any of you going to the Garden Gate on Sat for a prematch tipple.

Cheers
Mike

Good chance I'll be there. Depends on the weather, hate walking about in the rain!

In that case I'll look out for the car, Look out for a fat bloke with glasses and a red face, I'm sure I'll be the only one.

Unless I can park the car there for the match and it's not a bloody long walk to the ground AND the car will be safe, it'll be hidden somewhere else (in a car park!!)

Otherwise, you'll hear it long before you see it.

Is it a straight six or the V8?

I love a V8.

GibGreen wrote:

Is it a straight six or the V8?

I love a V8.

AJP V8 - TVR's own V8, 75 degree Vee 4475cc on straight through pipes (with a teensey weencey bit of silencing at the very back)

Football supporters are the strangest breed going. Two loses on the trot and the world has suddenly ended or a couple of wins and suddenly they are invincible and the world is their oyster. Survival is the key to this season and it always has been.

I'm not so sure that Argyle need to push the boat out much at all in January. We are ok up front now and as long as Purse stays on the pitch then not too foul at the back either. I would like to see a decent midfielder in the mode of a Friio perhaps and at a push a second one as well. The players confidence has improved no end recently and the results have begun to come good. Argyle need a squad to survive only this season and if a boat is to be pushed out I would much rather it be in the closed season in preparation for a more decent season next time. Save the money until then.

Sensiblegreeny wrote:

Football supporters are the strangest breed going. Two loses on the trot and the world has suddenly ended or a couple of wins and suddenly they are invincible and the world is their oyster. Survival is the key to this season and it always has been.

I'm not so sure that Argyle need to push the boat out much at all in January. We are ok up front now and as long as Purse stays on the pitch then not too foul at the back either. I would like to see a decent midfielder in the mode of a Friio perhaps and at a push a second one as well. The players confidence has improved no end recently and the results have begun to come good. Argyle need a squad to survive only this season and if a boat is to be pushed out I would much rather it be in the closed season in preparation for a more decent season next time. Save the money until then.

The trouble is that some of ours are on loan. Their clubs could recall them - especially if they see their improved form from being here. I don't know what the situation is regarding rules about more loan signings. Equally a couple of loan players may stay with us only if we buy them and the fees for players of the level of Hemmings or Bignot may be beyond the budget. I've said already, january will be an interesting period concerning players in or out.

GOB wrote:

Frank Bullitt wrote:

It will be interesting to see how much Brent dips his hand into his pocket during January. Our current revival is built on sand and things could go pear shaped very quickly. I will use Chadwick as an example. He has made a real difference to us since his return, but he is only here on loan and he has never been a consistent player. If we manage to keep him will he be able to maintain his form?

Bignot, Sutherland and Hemmings are all inexperienced. Will they be able to perform week in week out until the end of the season?

Purse has been impressive so far, but we are pinning a lot of hopes on a 35 year old centre back. Lets hope that injuries and fitness don't become a problem. I won't mention the disciplinary record.

I think we'll be disappointed come January Frank. I don't expect to see a penny of Brent's money, he's more-or-less already said that the club must be self sufficient and I think his only ambition is to see the club remain in existence.

I think there is a budget GOB, and wouldn't be surprised to see 2 or 3 players come in, possibly letting some of the loanees return home. For all of the optimism brought about by the last 4 games, we are still short of 'been there and done it' pros, who will scrap and battle for every point.

As for this play off nonsense, it affects seemingly sensible people. One of the guys I play golf with went off and put a tenner on us making the play offs after the Northampton game - and he's a lecturer at the University.

To be honest, I'd be happy with 3rd from bottom at the moment. Other teams around us are starting to win games and I think there'll be plenty of nail chewing before the end of the season.

There is something in the offing with Bhasera and he is one that is almost bound to go. We may just get one or two loanees as part of a deal who sign permanently. As you say lets wait and see. Purse is a done deal and I also think so is Chadwick. That takes care of numerous loanees if all that turns out to be right.

I still don't think there will be a huge influx of players and I still think it is uneccessary to go too far. There is talk of a transfer pot and I have heard £200k being bandied about. But, we have heard a lot of talk before so for me I'll just sit back and wait and see. I have no inside knowledge and don't believe half of what I hear that is supposedly inside news either. After all these years I've learned not to get too carried away and if people do then they should just look back in the football history books.

Cerbera wrote:

Freathy you would be of the opinion that we cannot maintain league status with the squad we have?

We have to supplement, where?

Not disagreeing with you, just interested.

I don't think argyle will survive with the current squad. First of all they have to extend any current loan deal that is up in January to the end of the season or make them perms. Next they must add depth so that when the key players get injured or suspended its not back to the bear bones they had to put out on the pitch at the start of the season.

I agree with whoever said the club has NOT been saved till relegation has been avoided. To me this is the final hurdle in this whole process.

However what i do think is that should argyle survive, A club of there size in this league should only be thinking about winning this division next season. Therefore any perm deals done should be done with this in mind, even at this early stage

I think Argyle should learn a lesson from previous recent experience when it comes to signing anyone this season dane_b. Would you not agree that most of Argyle's financial mess was in signing the wrong people on contracts that were unsustainable when relegation followed? If they repeated this and were relegated again then his could well spell the end for the club irrespective of the bon amie being levelled at it right now because of it's saving. People jump on a love in bandwagon because often it seems the right thing to do at the time. However if we dropped again I wonder just how many of the current supporters would stick it out in the BSP. We were paying Championship wages in league one and could not sustain it. We went on to be paying some in league 2 and could sustain it even less. If we were to be paying league wages in the non league and unable to sever the contracts again what then.

I personally would rather they play softly softly with any signings for this season at least. I disagree with you that this current squad is not good enough to stay up. We may lose a couple but the backbone of the side is there now as the more recent results show. Football is always about opinions I know and the proof of the pudding always comes later where one is right and the other not so it is taking a chance. I can see one or two coming in and I do think they will be the right signings and the money will not be wasted which we can ill afford to do anyway. There is nothing wrong with putting add ons in a contract to give the option of the club taking up a longer spell if it all works out as we hope. It would make a change for a football club to have a get out clause rather than all of the nap hands being dealt to the players. Lets face it if they are signing on for a league 2 club then it is either a stepping stone to greater things or a living at the other end of the scale.

you don't have to plunge yourself into financial ruin to put together a decent side, in fact argyle did the opposite, put together a poor to average at best side and plunged into financial ruin.

The full extent of Brent's ambitions could become apparent if Bhasera is sold in January. Surely some kind of fee would be received and if it is not used towards strengthening the squad then I think we can take that as proof that he is going to try and do it on the cheap.

I agree that you don't have to which is why I was advocating a softly softly approach rather than jumping in with long term contracts. We know what happens when you sign players that don't play and the opposite of what you aimed for is achieved. I'm not saying sign nobody but I am saying just be a little careful is all. We signed a load of players in Sturrock's first stint who turned out to be double promotion players. A lot of good luck in my opinion but that is difficult to repeat. At that time we were not on the bones of our ass financially even if not flushed with cash. We cannot afford to risk the same right now as sad as that is. Just because James Brent is on the bridge does not mean the good ship Argyle can't hit another rock.

greenjock wrote:

The full extent of Brent's ambitions could become apparent if Bhasera is sold in January. Surely some kind of fee would be received and if it is not used towards strengthening the squad then I think we can take that as proof that he is going to try and do it on the cheap.

Erm, that's contrary to pretty much everything he's said all along how exactly?.

Anyone looking for a massive cash investment in january hasn't been keeping their finger on the pulse for the last few months, Brent ain't no sugar daddy and we're to stand on (or fall from) our own two feet.