Argyle will wear a Poppy on their shirts this season

The club have promised to have a Q&A at the start of the season following the demise of the PASB. Let's hope for a big turnout there and lots of pertinent questions.

I'm sure the trust would be happy to ask questions on behalf of fans not able to get there. Sam?

I've got a question for Sam, has Andy gone mental?   

Dingle wrote:

The club isn't in a financial position to give away the space, no matter how worthy the cause.

Have to agree with Tringreen here I'm afraid Dingle. There was no harm whatsoever, financially or otherwise in the Club saying that they could get x amount for back of shirt but here you are guys, have a poppy on the sleeves. The fact that commercially they struggled to get front of shirt meant this was an easy option for them to get money for back of shirt.

Damon, wouldn't the club have to cover the cost of the manufacturer putting the poppy on the sleeve? Isn't the logo going on the back actually going to include the RBL logo and the WW1 part of the logo as well? Maybe Sam or Tim will clarify.

A question for the Trust as well. What happens if the money given by the "friends" isn't covered by fundraising? Will the Trust cover the shortfall? I understand you have plans etc. but the question has crossed my mind.

Tringreen wrote:

Damon.Lenszner wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

Damon.Lenszner wrote:

And Chemical Al stated he was guessing - you made it fact to suit you argument. When front of shirt struggled to make £75k asking price? Back of shirt woupd be arounf £20k. Your constant snipes at the Trust are a bore.

If it is 'only' £20k, that too will take some raising before loans are repaid and actual profit is made. It's all sounding par for the course at PAFC these days. Still it's a great little sideshow,to take the focus off the club and council and it may result in a handful of new Trust members.

So why say that?

Because it's true.

So, let's say fund raising activities produce a decent amount of money into pot 2 for the RBL but little to pot 1 as that is to repay the loans by 'friends' of the trust and I'm guessing that pot 2 will be more attractive for donations as it goes direct to the RBL. Any shortfall in pot 1, which I feel is likely, will result in the 'friends' taking the hit financially. If the club were to allow the poppy to appear on the shirt free of charge, all the money raised would go to the charity and maybe the 'friends' would have made generous donations anyway .

Has it not occurred to you that the “friends of the AFT” have also made generous donations as well? I for the life of me can not under stand why you spend so much time and effort knocking everything that the Trust tries to do. Perhaps you would like to explain this intense dislike?

Richard Blight wrote:

Damon, wouldn't the club have to cover the cost of the manufacturer putting the poppy on the sleeve?  Isn't the logo going on the back actually going to include the RBL logo and the WW1 part of the logo as well? Maybe Sam or Tim will clarify.

A question for the Trust as well. What happens if the money given by the "friends" isn't covered by fundraising? Will the Trust cover the shortfall? I understand you have plans etc. but the question has crossed my mind.

Not if it is incorporated into the original design. The cost of setup will be the same, poppy or no poppy.

Hi,

Apologies for the lack of a reply sooner.

The back of shirt logo is the one designed by the RBL. It's their choice, and yes it will mark the 100th anniversary. It's not for the AFT to tell the RBL how its logo/design should look.

We have a very specific plan for raising the "shirt" money, details of which will be released very soon. Some more emails were exchanged on this between me, Paul, Bob and Sam this morning. There will be mechanisms aimed at both individuals and businesses to contribute towards the cost of making the RBL sponsorship happen. Some of those things come from the benefits that come with the package, others from an opportunity for fans and businesses to be rather more visible supporters of this campaign, both through the season and beyond. As and when we hit that target, that "pot" closes, and all remaining fundraising will go directly to the RBL. Those "underwriting" the deal know they are doing just that.

We also of course have many ideas for the direct fundraising, which we plan to take to a national level. The national level (and beyond) ideas require further discussions with RBL, as we have to be very sensitive to their branding, other activities, etc.

The two "pots" will be very distinct and separate.

Tim

Damon.Lenszner wrote:

Richard Blight wrote:

Damon, wouldn't the club have to cover the cost of the manufacturer putting the poppy on the sleeve?  Isn't the logo going on the back actually going to include the RBL logo and the WW1 part of the logo as well? Maybe Sam or Tim will clarify.

A question for the Trust as well. What happens if the money given by the "friends" isn't covered by fundraising? Will the Trust cover the shortfall? I understand you have plans etc. but the question has crossed my mind.

Not if it is incorporated into the original design. The cost of setup will be the same, poppy or no poppy.

There are FA rules for what can go on the shirts though (search for "FA Kit and Advertising Regulations 2013-14" if interested, pages 16-19). For example only one front-of-shirt logo is allowed. The one-off poppy on Remembrance week is an exception.  What we're doing, and what the RBL like very much, is keeping the RBL in people's minds all year round.

What I didn't know about sponsor logos is there's no prescribed shape, only an area limit in sq cm, so front of shirt can be 5cm wide and 40cm tall, if you chose to; the reg is 200sq cm max.

Tim

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Very nice, but Barcelona don't follow FA rules!

OK - forgetting that we have Skybet/Carling/BlueSquare/Barclays/whoever on the sleeve - the point is that the club have charged for this when so much more kudos could have come from giving the space away - especially as no other company was competing for the space.

Damon.Lenszner wrote:

OK - forgetting that we have Skybet/Carling/BlueSquare/Barclays/whoever on the sleeve - the point is that the club have charged for this when so much more kudos could have come from giving the space away - especially as no other company was competing for the space.

That bit isn't actually true, as I understand.

I can see it both ways to be honest. The Trust did at one point think that it would be of value to the club if we went in with an offer of £0- due to the associated PR that they'd get in spite of missing out of the back of shirt sponsor. Then again, as we all know, the club is in shit and they're gonna want to eek out every last penny with the persistent loss that we're making.

Of course we'd rather be able to devote all money to the RBL but we've got to make do as things are.

Richard: to answer your question- the sponsors have a lot of 'freebies' and advertising as a result of their sponsorship which are things that we can sell on to other companies. This will be sold to make up a sizeable proportion of pot 1. We'll be able to move on to fundraising for Pot 2 sooner than people think- and even that's not including people's direct donations to pot 2 itself.

To clarify the above post as I've been advised of a potential misunderstanding.

We will be holding collections for pot two from the off anyway. But most active fundraising will be for pot one until we fill it- which may be sooner than you think.

Sorry Sam... I gotta laugh...

Having to have two different buckets raising money for the same organization is just a bad joke.
So Argyle...

GreenSam wrote:

Damon.Lenszner wrote:

OK - forgetting that we have Skybet/Carling/BlueSquare/Barclays/whoever on the sleeve - the point is that the club have charged for this when so much more kudos could have come from giving the space away - especially as no other company was competing for the space.

That bit isn't actually true, as I understand.

I can see it both ways to be honest. The Trust did at one point think that it would be of value to the club if we went in with an offer of £0- due to the associated PR that they'd get in spite of missing out of the back of shirt sponsor. Then again, as we all know, the club is in shit and they're gonna want to eek out every last penny with the persistent loss that we're making.

Of course we'd rather be able to devote all money to the RBL but we've got to make do as things are.

Richard: to answer your question- the sponsors have a lot of 'freebies' and advertising as a result of their sponsorship which are things that we can sell on to other companies. This will be sold to make up a sizeable proportion of pot 1. We'll be able to move on to fundraising for Pot 2 sooner than people think- and even that's not including people's direct donations to pot 2 itself.

Thank you Sam.

The Trust is obviously confident that it has checked all it's figures etc. and I would imagine the RBL and club have as well. Shout if there's anything members can help with, although time is something I don't have much of these days.