Retail Units in the Not-grandstand.

I've been having a little think about these units since it became apparent that contracts with would-be tenants are still in abeyance.

Take a day like today. A day not dissimilar to many that we'll get throughout the year. Grey. Damp. Miserable. Where is the footfall going to come from to fill these restaurants and make them economically viable? Ok there'll be a cinema and hotel close by, but apart from that nobody comes to a Park when it's pissing down with rain. Drop-in figures would be non-existent. You're average Life Centre punter ain't gonna go to the gym and follow it up with Piri Piri Chicken and chips at Nandos.

It doesn't surprise me one bit that Brent has intimated that chains aren't queuing up yet to sign contracts to lease these potential white elephants.

Czarcasm wrote:

I've been having a little think about these units since it became apparent that contracts with would-be tenants are still in abeyance.

Take a day like today. A day not dissimilar to many that we'll get throughout the year. Grey. Damp. Miserable. Where is the footfall going to come from to fill these restaurants and make them economically viable? Ok there'll be a cinema and hotel close by, but apart from that nobody comes to a Park when it's pissing down with rain. Drop-in figures would be non-existent. You're average Life Centre punter ain't gonna go to the gym and follow it up with Piri Piri Chicken and chips at Nandos.

It doesn't surprise me one bit that Brent has intimated that chains aren't queuing up yet to sign contracts to lease these potential white elephants.

What about the hordes of Avivas going for the mini ground and murial tours ? Haven't Nandos heard about this income stream ?

If the facility was as great as some like to make out, surely all of these businesses would be falling over themselves to sign up for a good spot in St James Back Passage.

But like you say, on a grey, damp, windy day, a window seat looking out onto the dingy alley and the back of the grandstand (with Nool falling down the stairs stuffed full of prawns) is hardly going to have them beating down Brent's door.

Yep that's how I see it Frank. I think Brent is banking on it being a 'drive-to' destination.

People aint gonna pay to park in his NCP car park when they can go to the cinema and park at Vue for free. I can picture the janner road-rage being off the scale when you've got people vying for the very few free spaces at the Life Centre (which probably won't be free for much longer...)

Why is it only obvious to us ?

The AFT WG plans could have not only given the football club a touch of class and ambition but also an ice rink stadium with enough seating for big events, ice shows, Nat/European ice hockey/basketball, would have made HHP an attractive proposition for major companies with vision.

I now have serious doubts the plans will get off the ground through lack of outside interest.

Tringreen wrote:

Why is it only obvious to us ?

The AFT WG plans could have not only given the football club a touch of class and ambition but also an ice rink stadium with enough seating for big events, ice shows, Nat/European ice hockey/basketball, would have made HHP an attractive proposition for major companies with vision.

I now have serious doubts the plans will get off the ground through lack of outside interest.

Yep, there is still that little glimmer of hope.

Tringreen wrote:

Why is it only obvious to us ?
The AFT WG plans could have not only given the football club a touch of class and ambition but also an ice rink stadium with enough seating for big events, ice shows, Nat/European ice hockey/basketball, would have made HHP an attractive proposition for major companies with vision.

I now have serious doubts the plans will get off the ground through lack of outside interest.

thats obvious surely, no one on heres going to gain from HHP thats why !

The Armada Centre has a fantastic location in the centre of town. It has a car park and supermarket. It is within walking distance of the train station and the Hoe. And it has always been a load of bollocks. Just because you build something new and shiny doesn't mean it is going to be a success.

This issue is too important for it to be ignored. I hoping beyond hope that PASB are asking the question.

Brent's business plan is based on 10 of thousands of people visiting HHP each week.

Dougie wrote:

This issue is too important for it to be ignored.  I hoping beyond hope that PASB are asking the question.

Brent's business plan is based on 10 of thousands of people visiting HHP each week.

As has been posted elsewhere, most the PASB cannot be bothered to turn up to their own meetings so what hope is there they will ask any relevant questions?

Business in Plymouth is the same as Argyle, either it is successful like Farleys, Paper Converting or Brymon and gets taken over and moved elsewhere or it flops.

I went to Vue on Friday evening to see Prisoners, well acclaimed new release thriller with top cast, yet it was barely quarter full. By 10.30 the whole complex was like a ghost town. I can't believe that this is the 6th busiest Vue cinema around. Just where are the punters for another complex in the city.

and in the years to come people will say we destroyed a football club and part of a green belt for a row of empty shops and a nandos.

Dougie wrote:

This issue is too important for it to be ignored.  I hoping beyond hope that PASB are asking the question.

Brent's business plan is based on 10 of thousands of people visiting HHP each week.

I have heard from a confidential source that we can expect up to 195,000 fans to use the new grandstand facilities even when we have an away match, we're going to be rich!  

Iggy wrote:

Dougie wrote:

This issue is too important for it to be ignored.  I hoping beyond hope that PASB are asking the question.

Brent's business plan is based on 10 of thousands of people visiting HHP each week.

I have heard from a confidential source that we can expect up to 195,000 fans to use the new grandstand facilities even when we have an away match, Brent is going to be rich!  

Sorry i edited the above text to be more truthful  

I can understand how the hotel as student accommodation 'may' just about tick over, but as a legitimate hotel? No way, who on earth would want to spend time in a hotel in a park miles from the hub of the town? Even company reps would aim for something more central where Plymouth is already stacked out with hotels, it doesn't make any sense to me.

When all this crap was announced I couldn't see it working but I thought that Brent, being the ultra professional that he is, must have done his research regarding demand, location etc. and I assumed that he knew what he was doing. Since then I have seen so many fekups from Brent that I am starting to believe that the bloke is an idiot or, he's knocking out double bluffs after double bluffs for some reason to confuse the shyte out of everyone. 

The cinema isn't that bad an idea, but in Central Park, miles from the town center with its customers having to muck in with thousands of football fans on its busiest day and in a City where every cinema outside of the City centre has closed? 

I have also spoken briefly to knowledgeable acquaintances about Brents Civic Centre ambitions and their words were "no way, it just isn't financially viable to convert the building".

Something really doesn't smell right regarding James Brent.


That thunder was fekin loud!

GOB wrote:

I can understand how the hotel as student accommodation 'may' just about tick over, but as a legitimate hotel? No way, who on earth would want to spend time in a hotel in a park miles from the hub of the town? Even company reps would aim for something more central where Plymouth is already stacked out with hotels, it doesn't make any sense to me.

When all this crap was announced I couldn't see it working but I thought that Brent, being the ultra professional that he is, must have done his research regarding demand, location etc. and I assumed that he knew what he was doing. Since then I have seen so many fekups from Brent that I am starting to believe that the bloke is an idiot or, he's knocking out double bluffs after double bluffs for some reason to confuse the shyte out of everyone. 

The cinema isn't that bad an idea, but in Central Park, miles from the town center with its customers having to muck in with thousands of football fans on its busiest day and in a City where every cinema outside of the City centre has closed? 

I have also spoken briefly to knowledgeable acquaintances about Brents Civic Centre ambitions and their words were "no way, it just isn't financially viable to convert the building".

Something really doesn't smell right regarding James Brent.


That thunder was fekin loud!

God is obviously unhappy with what you're saying. The next thing will be that your account will be hacked.

knecht wrote:

GOB wrote:

I can understand how the hotel as student accommodation 'may' just about tick over, but as a legitimate hotel? No way, who on earth would want to spend time in a hotel in a park miles from the hub of the town? Even company reps would aim for something more central where Plymouth is already stacked out with hotels, it doesn't make any sense to me.

When all this crap was announced I couldn't see it working but I thought that Brent, being the ultra professional that he is, must have done his research regarding demand, location etc. and I assumed that he knew what he was doing. Since then I have seen so many fekups from Brent that I am starting to believe that the bloke is an idiot or, he's knocking out double bluffs after double bluffs for some reason to confuse the shyte out of everyone. 

The cinema isn't that bad an idea, but in Central Park, miles from the town center with its customers having to muck in with thousands of football fans on its busiest day and in a City where every cinema outside of the City centre has closed? 

I have also spoken briefly to knowledgeable acquaintances about Brents Civic Centre ambitions and their words were "no way, it just isn't financially viable to convert the building".

Something really doesn't smell right regarding James Brent.


That thunder was fekin loud!

God is obviously unhappy with what you're saying. The next thing will be that your account will be hacked.

The only thing they will find are emails regarding my soiled underwear fetish   

Wembley is a bit of a ghost town when there's no events on, but it comes alive during matches and concerts. The businesses that are there know this and rely on trade during busy times to succeed. This could be a problem for Mr Brent as I'm not sure there will be enough other stuff to attract punters but maybe I'm wrong? There's enough houses around there so maybe those people will venture out as well as others from all over the city? Seems risky to me but I'm by no means an expert in these matters.

So basically the money is nowhere near to being in place because the take up for all the retail units has been non existent. Did anyone seriously expect Brent to pay for the stand himself? 

No wonder Postey has been so quiet?

Hugh Watt wrote:

So basically the money is nowhere near to being in place because the take up for all the retail units has been non existent. Did anyone seriously expect Brent to pay for the stand himself? 

No wonder Postey has been so quiet?

Mind you with the communication we get from the club there could be a multitude of reasons why it's not going ahead, it's great to feed the rumour mill though. 

GOB wrote:

I can understand how the hotel as student accommodation 'may' just about tick over

I know we all keep assuming that, but I don't think it would work as student accommodation - it's simply too far away from both the city centre campus and Marjohns. I'm sure I read somewhere that most students prefer to live within a very small radius, and definitely walking distance. That makes a lot of sense: it means they can go home to study or whatever in between lectures without the time and cost involved in using buses. That's why some areas around Mutley and Greenbank (and North Road West, I think) have so much student accommodation, while Demport - only about a mile and a half away - has none. And because of that concentration, everybody wants to be where it's at: a friend of mine's a mature student, now in her second year, and she feels she loses out on quite a lot of stuff - not so much parties and that, but evening events, groups and so on - because she lives so far away ... in Budo.

The studio school (shh - is this still meant to be a secret?) will be for 14-19 year olds, so just like City College there won't really be any need for accommodation.

Re Gob's other excellent points about the hotel, a lot of us made those points to the Planning Committee. Not that they took any notice, of course.

The whole thing is ridiculous as was pointed out by some during the planning process. It could also be used to back up the claims of so called brown envelopes, especially when everything is kept behind closed doors.
The cinema MAY be used for the first couple of months but I just don't see it past that.
The hotel will be competing with others that are in much better locations.
The main thing for me tho, which doesn't appear to be anywhere near the radars of our council, is that we are in an economic crisis which is going to be around for a few years yet. This added to lower wages and a higher cost of living means people do not have as much spare cash to use these facilities. The Vue cinema is rarely full and there has already been a number of hotels and eateries closing through lack of custom which makes the planning even more ridiculous.
The Civic Centre is full of asbestos and will cost plenty to turn into the all singing, all dancing 5* hotel.
The City College had plans to knock down and rebuild a bigger campus about 3 or 4 years ago but it didn't happen through lack of funds and again the building is full of asbestos. So this is probably the reason why they are behind the school.

I can see the hotel opening and after a while being closed and then changed into luxury appartments (like the Grand?) with the road being access to private parking.

mcfry wrote:

The whole thing is ridiculous as was pointed out by some during the planning process. It could also be used to back up the claims of so called brown envelopes, especially when everything is kept behind closed doors.
The cinema MAY be used for the first couple of months but I just don't see it past that.
The hotel will be competing with others that are in much better locations.
The main thing for me tho, which doesn't appear to be anywhere near the radars of our council, is that we are in an economic crisis which is going to be around for a few years yet. This added to lower wages and a higher cost of living means people do not have as much spare cash to use these facilities. The Vue cinema is rarely full and there has already been a number of hotels and eateries closing through lack of custom which makes the planning even more ridiculous.
The Civic Centre is full of asbestos and will cost plenty to turn into the all singing, all dancing 5* hotel.
The City College had plans to knock down and rebuild a bigger campus about 3 or 4 years ago but it didn't happen through lack of funds and again the building is full of asbestos. So this is probably the reason why they are behind the school.

Almost everything that we have argued against this half baked development development looks set to materialise a short while after it all opens.
Those who were privy to its passing deserve to be publicly renounced.