Better off going Bust??

I've just seen the Conference North league table. Chester are top, pissing the league 16 points clear with 82 points from 31 games. They are a fair bet to be kicking off next August in the same League as Argyle.

You look at Argyles situation now, and I wonder if we'd have been better off with a clean slate and a chance to start afresh, just as Chester have done....

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Nonsense Brent's saved us, or haven't you noticed.

Was thinking earlier actually. Who has/done the most damage to club. The magnificent 7 or Brent and his foot solders ?

Dane. wrote:

Was thinking earlier actually. Who has/done the most damage to club. The magnificent 7 or Brent and his foot solders ?

You were thinking earlier!

think the administrator for allowing the club to run for 9 months with no one (except ?) getting paid...............

Sorry Dane but do you think these boys are the billy goat gruff. Long time registered , but was just watching.Hope you stay up for the boys of atd #real fans rather than the superman edit fans

Greenjock wrote:

Dane. wrote:

Was thinking earlier actually. Who has/done the most damage to club. The magnificent 7 or Brent and his foot solders ?

You were thinking earlier!

First Dane had a thought, then Newell had an idea!

The idea seems interesting,but there are more flaws than there are positives of such an idea.

Better off?

The Trust was founded initially to form a new Argyle if that was to happen. Chris Webb was Trust leader then and so he would have been de facto Club Chairman and Argyle would have been forced to drop down the divisions until we found one that would allow us to enter because the BS wouldn't have had us. God alone knows how far down that could have been. And at that level the only income would be that generated by fans and sponsors. It could be the case that Argyle would have been unsustainable and would have disappeared altogether.

So probably not.

Our biggest problem is that we have not emerged from administration debt free and that we have probably added to those debts. We must still be at £5m in debt (and maybe it's far worse than that). On top of which an implausibly ambitious budget was set for this season. This equates to the first 2000 (or maybe more) paying fans for every home game for scheduled payments and is well over 12 months gross income.

This in turn has led to a weak squad being recruited which in turn has left us on the verge of relegation to the BS. And if we end up there look at the debts v gross income in terms of 24 months (or maybe more) because crowds will plummet, prices will have to fall and there is next to no FL or TV income. To all intents and purposes the only thing keeping Argyle from administration, and expulsion from the BS, will be Brent's largesse.

All of which stems from Brent's refusal to pay off the outstanding debts from the Stapleton/Todd/Admin era with which the club exited administration at the outset. Which is the fundamental flaw in the process of leaving administration but then again it wasn't him that ran up those debts so why should he?

No matter how it shakes down relegation seriously endangers the existence of Argyle in any shape or form unless we drop enough levels to groundshare with Plymouth Parkway, Elburton Villa, Saltash or some other suitably local club charitable enough to let us squat in their stadium.

Where's my drum gone?

All the more reason the Trust should stand up and be counted. According to Damon, Brent effectively told them to 'do one' with their questions.

They should pull their members out of the pasb, relay their concerns to the wider fanbase and point out that a strong, independent fans trust could well be needed sooner rather than later. This will have the desired effect of Brent caving in, or if he refuses to answer their questions appropriately, should kickstart a massive recruitment drive for the trust................ outside the stadium if necessary.

What must not happen at all costs, is the leadership of the burgeoning trust being in the hands of the devious, self promoting dimwits who have collectively helped create the mess the club is in and who have tried their best to kill the trust in favour of the 'controllable' pasb.

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Better off?

The Trust was founded initially to form a new Argyle if that was to happen. Chris Webb was Trust leader then and so he would have been de facto Club Chairman and Argyle would have been forced to drop down the divisions until we found one that would allow us to enter because the BS wouldn't have had us. God alone knows how far down that could have been. And at that level the only income would be that generated by fans and sponsors. It could be the case that Argyle would have been unsustainable and would have disappeared altogether.

So probably not.

Our biggest problem is that we have not emerged from administration debt free and that we have probably added to those debts. We must still be at £5m in debt (and maybe it's far worse than that). On top of which an implausibly ambitious budget was set for this season. This equates to the first 2000 (or maybe more) paying fans for every home game for scheduled payments and is well over 12 months gross income.

This in turn has led to a weak squad being recruited which in turn has left us on the verge of relegation to the BS. And if we end up there look at the debts v gross income in terms of 24 months (or maybe more) because crowds will plummet, prices will have to fall and there is next to no FL or TV income. To all intents and purposes the only thing keeping Argyle from administration, and expulsion from the BS, will be Brent's largesse.

All of which stems from Brent's refusal to pay off the outstanding debts from the Stapleton/Todd/Admin era with which the club exited administration at the outset. Which is the fundamental flaw in the process of leaving administration but then again it wasn't him that ran up those debts so why should he?

No matter how it shakes down relegation seriously endangers the existence of Argyle in any shape or form unless we drop enough levels to groundshare with Plymouth Parkway, Elburton Villa, Saltash or some other suitably local club charitable enough to let us squat in their stadium.

Where's my drum gone?

Exactly this.

The current board dont appear to have saved us but only prolonged the agony. Instead of a quick death they have just left argyle to bleed to death in the gutter. In my opinion relegation to BSP is as bad closing down and starting again.

Brent is about to fail massivly. He knows nothing about the game and is getting advice from people who know even less. if argyle get out of this mess and are still in the football league this summer, some big changes in directors box and board room need to take place for any progress to be made.

Also some kind of investment in the team needs to take place.

Dane. wrote:

Sir Francis Drake wrote:

Better off?

The Trust was founded initially to form a new Argyle if that was to happen. Chris Webb was Trust leader then and so he would have been de facto Club Chairman and Argyle would have been forced to drop down the divisions until we found one that would allow us to enter because the BS wouldn't have had us. God alone knows how far down that could have been. And at that level the only income would be that generated by fans and sponsors. It could be the case that Argyle would have been unsustainable and would have disappeared altogether.

So probably not.

Our biggest problem is that we have not emerged from administration debt free and that we have probably added to those debts. We must still be at £5m in debt (and maybe it's far worse than that). On top of which an implausibly ambitious budget was set for this season. This equates to the first 2000 (or maybe more) paying fans for every home game for scheduled payments and is well over 12 months gross income.

This in turn has led to a weak squad being recruited which in turn has left us on the verge of relegation to the BS. And if we end up there look at the debts v gross income in terms of 24 months (or maybe more) because crowds will plummet, prices will have to fall and there is next to no FL or TV income. To all intents and purposes the only thing keeping Argyle from administration, and expulsion from the BS, will be Brent's largesse.

All of which stems from Brent's refusal to pay off the outstanding debts from the Stapleton/Todd/Admin era with which the club exited administration at the outset. Which is the fundamental flaw in the process of leaving administration but then again it wasn't him that ran up those debts so why should he?

No matter how it shakes down relegation seriously endangers the existence of Argyle in any shape or form unless we drop enough levels to groundshare with Plymouth Parkway, Elburton Villa, Saltash or some other suitably local club charitable enough to let us squat in their stadium.

Where's my drum gone?

Exactly this.

The current board dont appear to have saved us but only prolonged the agony. Instead of a quick death they have just left argyle to bleed to death in the gutter. In my opinion relegation to BSP is as bad closing down and starting again.

Brent is about to fail massivly. He knows nothing about the game and is getting advice from people who know even less. if argyle get out of this mess and are still in the football league this summer, some big changes in directors box and board room need to take place for any progress to be made.

Also some kind of investment in the team needs to take place.

Bloody hell Dane. Is that really you ?

?

Dane. wrote:

Exactly this.

Ummmmmmm ?

I think you might need to re read this post and the OP Mr. Wabbit. Mr Ducky appears to be rejecting the premise that the club would have been better off going bust albeit that much of his reasoning is flawed.

This falls neatly into the world of pure conjecture as there is no control to enable the path not taken to be viewed, though imho there was a head of steam building just prior to Brent realising that he was staring into the face of the gift horse and managed to get Webby to feck you over big time with the help of Centurion Porkus Tw@us.

Had that momentum been built on there is no telling what might have been achieved to the benefit of the club and the fan base rather than the Super fans and their property developing best bud. It was only when things were at their absolute darkest that people started appearing from nowhere to help at ECFC, I remain convinced that had we not drawn Manure we should still have found a way to cover the CVA and battle on.

Lord Tisdale wrote:

Dane. wrote:

Exactly this.

Ummmmmmm ?

I think you might need to re read this post and the OP Mr. Wabbit. Mr Ducky appears to be rejecting the premise that the club would have been better off going bust albeit that much of his reasoning is flawed.

This falls neatly into the world of pure conjecture as there is no control to enable the path not taken to be viewed, though imho there was a head of steam building just prior to Brent realising that he was staring into the face of the gift horse and managed to get Webby to feck you over big time with the help of Centurion Porkus Tw@us.

Had that momentum been built on there is no telling what might have been achieved to the benefit of the club and the fan base rather than the Super fans and their property developing best bud. It was only when things were at their absolute darkest that people started appearing from nowhere to help at ECFC, I remain convinced that had we not drawn Manure we should still have found a way to cover the CVA and battle on.

How very true and several of us were saying much the same at the time.

Tringreen wrote:

All the more reason the Trust should stand up and be counted. According to Damon, Brent effectively told them to 'do one' with their questions.

They should pull their members out of the pasb, relay their concerns to the wider fanbase and point out that a strong, independent fans trust could well be needed sooner rather than later. This will have the desired effect of Brent caving in, or if he refuses to answer their questions appropriately, should kickstart a massive recruitment drive for the trust................ outside the stadium if necessary.

What must not happen at all costs, is the leadership of the burgeoning trust being in the hands of the devious, self promoting dimwits who have collectively helped create the mess the club is in and who have tried their best to kill the trust in favour of the 'controllable' pasb.

Trin - it is time to stand up and be counted. The PASB is meeting the Board with PJ in the Chair before the game on Saturday. My gloves will be off!!!

Tringreen wrote:

Lord Tisdale wrote:

Dane. wrote:

Exactly this.

Ummmmmmm ?

I think you might need to re read this post and the OP Mr. Wabbit. Mr Ducky appears to be rejecting the premise that the club would have been better off going bust albeit that much of his reasoning is flawed.

This falls neatly into the world of pure conjecture as there is no control to enable the path not taken to be viewed, though imho there was a head of steam building just prior to Brent realising that he was staring into the face of the gift horse and managed to get Webby to feck you over big time with the help of Centurion Porkus Tw@us.

Had that momentum been built on there is no telling what might have been achieved to the benefit of the club and the fan base rather than the Super fans and their property developing best bud. It was only when things were at their absolute darkest that people started appearing from nowhere to help at ECFC, I remain convinced that had we not drawn Manure we should still have found a way to cover the CVA and battle on.

How very true and several of us were saying much the same at the time.

Lord T is right (he often is). I think what has come out of the sorrow affair is that we (City fans) see your Club being "shite on" by some of your own fans and despite our inborn animosity we know that just isn't right. At a time when we should be lording it over you and all Argyle message boards our anger and contempt is aimed purely at the lowlife scum who have sold you out. Hardly surprising those same lowlife (Webb excluded) infested our own message boards during our dark days and remained to slur many individually as we later found our feet again. The slurs went way beyond banter and is similar (although not as bad, admittedly) as the slurs and dirty tricks aimed at yourself, Greenjock, Rickler, GOB, Frank Bullit, Yea man, Andy Symons, Mouldy, Cobi Budge, Thai Green and Punchie, to name only 11.

Damon.Lenszner wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

All the more reason the Trust should stand up and be counted. According to Damon, Brent effectively told them to 'do one' with their questions.

They should pull their members out of the pasb, relay their concerns to the wider fanbase and point out that a strong, independent fans trust could well be needed sooner rather than later. This will have the desired effect of Brent caving in, or if he refuses to answer their questions appropriately, should kickstart a massive recruitment drive for the trust................ outside the stadium if necessary.

What must not happen at all costs, is the leadership of the burgeoning trust being in the hands of the devious, self promoting dimwits who have collectively helped create the mess the club is in and who have tried their best to kill the trust in favour of the 'controllable' pasb.

Trin - it is time to stand up and be counted. The PASB is meeting the Board with PJ in the Chair before the game on Saturday. My gloves will be off!!!

Good for you Damon.............. but I reckon Brentyboy will duck this one. Sounds like the organ grinder is sending his monkey to take the flak.

I sincerely hope the trust members of the pasb will disengage when transparency is clearly not on the agenda and the trust will go it alone. Even I'd join and do what I can.
As Tis is saying on here elsewhere, we must have a growing, determined, honestly and passionately led trust in place, or the future is bleak beyond belief.

Damon.Lenszner wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

All the more reason the Trust should stand up and be counted. According to Damon, Brent effectively told them to 'do one' with their questions.

They should pull their members out of the pasb, relay their concerns to the wider fanbase and point out that a strong, independent fans trust could well be needed sooner rather than later. This will have the desired effect of Brent caving in, or if he refuses to answer their questions appropriately, should kickstart a massive recruitment drive for the trust................ outside the stadium if necessary.

What must not happen at all costs, is the leadership of the burgeoning trust being in the hands of the devious, self promoting dimwits who have collectively helped create the mess the club is in and who have tried their best to kill the trust in favour of the 'controllable' pasb.

Trin - it is time to stand up and be counted. The PASB is meeting the Board with PJ in the Chair before the game on Saturday. My gloves will be off!!!

Pass on a message from me please Damon. Tell Jones he's a laughing stock and Hooper he's a devious little shit.

Thanks