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Last night's crowd, almost 3000 below the break even point we are led to believe) was the lowest for a league match since we lost 2-0 at home to Barnet last season in a game I don't remember at all. The atmosphere was completely dead last night and even the faithful 5000 that were there seemed resigned to defeat and I know that I had no expectation of much better. It reminded me of the game against Dagenham & Redbridge when hardly anybody went and which ultimately saw the end of the New World. The club is in a genuine crisis. Is there anybody that could disagree with that?

nope!

Your support is holding up pretty well considering how carp performances have been, bit surprised a few on 'the Farm' are expecting the Gills to bring a few down to bolster numbers, can't see it myself, they do travel a bit and will beat the 33 Brewers but a 500 mile round trip will not be inviting to many.

Nobody travels in numbers at this level.

I refuse to believe the break even figure is 8k. It is just so patently absurd.

I think the 8000 figure has been claimed to be a slight over exaggeration- the actual figure is ONLY 7500!

Even so, any fan with even the least of Argyle knowledge would not have come up with a figure above 6,000, even Stapes would have got that one right!

The whole thing is just ludicrous bullshit.

It would have been sensible to budget for last seasons average crowd less 10% to be on the safe side. Attendances are a limited way of looking at it. It's to do with how much not how many so whatever the income last year less 10% would have been good strategy.

But we have muriels, big flags,tribute, pasties, dave banana........................

What more do you Avivas want ! ?

I know it's a radical idea and it might not meet with an enthusiastic reception but lets win a few games.

James Brent was quoted earlier this week as saying the average crowds at the moment were just below what they had budgeted for. The average gate for the season so far is around 6300.

Chris Webb speaking to John Lloyd on twitter said something along the lines of the crowds being 2k below what the club had expected.

Chris Webb ‏@Chris_Webb1
@John_Lloyd I think that's any workplace, John. People are not stupid. 2k below forecasted crowds over course of yr = issue. I reiterate

So that's where the 8k figure has come from. Which would actually be 8300 according to the club president. Any backtracking now I haven't seen but I have heard the figure is nearer 7500. So why would the club president say this? He more than anyone would know that there was not much chance of achieving an average of over 8k, especially with the shit being served up right now.

Oh and he's also tweeted this in relation to the planned strike by Royal Mail workers over job cuts/ heavier workloads.

Chris Webb ‏@Chris_Webb1
@BristolCWU banners / posters ordered. Will reply to voicemail tomorrow mate - quite right

So I take it that along with the unveiling of the new mural, Chris will be arranging banners/posters etc for the proposed job cuts at Argyle? What's that? No he won't?

Funny that.

#fuckingturncoathypocrite

I don't think (as yet) there is really evidence of attendances falling off this season. The thing with the low attendance vs Burton is that it was a mid-week game on a day when there was CL football on the telly, and against a team that bought hardly any away support (33 hardy Burtonians apparently).

Of course our poor performances and results may be contributing, but I think a better indicator will be the Saturday home attendances, which are less likely to vary because of the factors above.

Our last 5 Saturday Home attendances have been (most recent last):
6037,6080,6269,6271,6261
so there is no sign of a downturn there.

Our only midweek league home match was against the Gas (att 6303) which is a bit hard to compare against because it's a local derby of sorts.

If Saturday's attendance is below 6000 then there might be a problem, but just saying that a midweek match against Burton has the lowest league attendance of the season isn't really news - I think anyone looking into it would have predicted that anyway.

Still 2k below what was expected according to the club president.

I don't think Saturday's crowd will hit 6,000. After dorchester and burton even ST holders are finding better things to do! Everyone knows we'll be played completely off the park and a substantial defeat is very likely.

Are you sure that el pres isn't just softening up the masses for the redundancies? If it was known that the crowds were at the level expected there would be a poorer argument for re structuring.

Iggy wrote:

Are you sure that el pres isn't just softening up the masses for the redundancies? If it was known that the crowds were at the level expected there would be a poorer argument for re structuring.

Nail on head!

Grumpy wrote:

I know it's a radical idea and it might not meet with an enthusiastic reception but lets win a few games.

Bloody revolutionary!

To suggest Chris Webb has been involved i any Machiavellian scheme to soften up the masses for the redundancies is plain silly. He may be lots of things but that goes too far. I'm disappointed that he has had nothing to say about the redundancies, their timing or the ridiculous optimism of the claimed break-even figure.

He seems to have backed himself into a corner at the club. Any suggestion of criticism of the club by him will be jumped on. It would certainly be jumped on by "the masses" but it runs the risk of being jumped on by the club. His position as President would be at risk. We have read elsewhere of claims that people have been sidelined for such criticism. There is no reason the The President wouldn't be in the same position. I guess he has choices to make.

knecht wrote:

To suggest Chris Webb has been involved i any Machiavellian scheme to soften up the masses for the redundancies is plain silly. He may be lots of things but that goes too far. I'm disappointed that he has had nothing to say about the redundancies, their timing or the ridiculous optimism of the claimed break-even figure.

He seems to have backed himself into a corner at the club. Any suggestion of criticism of the club by him will be jumped on. It would certainly be jumped on by "the masses" but it runs the risk of being jumped on by the club. His position as President would be at risk. We have read elsewhere of claims that people have been sidelined for such criticism. There is no reason the The President wouldn't be in the same position. I guess he has choices to make.

Really? It is easy to drip feed little snippets via tw@tter, why quote the 8000 figure? Maybe he is being used by someone at the club, I would be interested to find out where the 8 k figure came from? 8 k is a playoff side crowd figure, did the powers that be really think we would be chasing the playoffs? Did they miss the pre-season?
I am not enamoured with the way that Brent is conducting himself this season, he has Been Sussed for just being in it for the development and has now lowered the drawbridge. He could easily make some pro active decisions on the management of the club and get people back on side, instead we get silence and the axe being wielded at home park. You would have thought that the champion of the staff and controller of the dogs of war would be more vocal about redundancies, but being the source of the 2k short of break even figure makes me suspicious.

Without trawling back, I'm not 100% sure .... but wasn't that 8,000 figure later corrected to 7,500? Not that it makes much difference, it's almost as ridiculous a figure. I actually think anything over 5,000 would be good in the position we're in. Wait until the next wet, cold, windy Saturday in mid-winter and we may even get 4,000 odd!

Businesses run by millionaires make such decisions all the time. It's that sort of hard-nosed approach that enables them to shed staff just before Xmas. It may make the club more "efficient" but there is a cost. I'm not a religious man but one of the attacks on the attitude that a free market is the best way to run an economy was made by the Bishop of Liverpool. He said that approach suggests that market forces should be allowed to operate without any recognition of morality or integrity (very similar to some of Mr Brent's promises when he took over the club). I guess that's my feeling about how businesses are run. I have always questioned the morality of a massively rich owner failing to properly fund our club. But that's how society is run. My disappointment is that our union rep, socialist President has not/is not able to express a view on this. I don't believe (and belief is what it comes down to) that he has intentionally spun a line.

I will be interested how many staff will be shed, whether they will be part-time as well as full-time, whether they will be voluntary and how much money will be saved. The PASB should be on this like a shot.

Given the past circumstances I think that to conclude that Webb's words are not designed to soften the blow would be at the very least, naive.

Naive, I most certainly am. I'd agree with that. (I wouldn't be in the personal shit I am at present if that wasn't true!).

Doesn't make me wrong, though.

Strangely, the claim that 8,000 or 7,500 was the break-even figure hasn't softened the blow. All it's done is to make the club and the people who run it (and that's not CW) look incompetent.

improve the football, have a manager who can get results and put a squad together and lastly be a football club not the ussr's verison of one with murals and postboxes and then and only then

7,000 may go to home park more oftern.

It's not Machiavelli we're talking here, it's more Grimthorpe. This latest bit of half truths surrounding redundancies sounds like something straight out of some tight mill owner up North, rather than some many layered meditteranean lilt .... simple, bad news for the workers sounds better when the owner's cowboy logic is explained (excused) by the local 'workers' representative' than it is delivered by the works manager... and that's where Webby is useful. Union leaders have been doing it for hundreds of years. This is the sort of thing he's in situ for. It's as English as Le roast boeuf.

I'm puzzled by the timing of all this. How can the redundancy story have got such coverage on Spotlight and The Herald without an actual statement from the club. Was the information given to the media before or after the staff meeting. And was it given or leaked.

Many things surprise me about my club, but the lack of acknowledgement by the club is truly astounding.

Dingle wrote:

I'm puzzled by the timing of all this. How can the redundancy story have got such coverage on Spotlight and The Herald without an actual statement from the club. Was the information given to the media before or after the staff meeting. And was it given or leaked.

Many things surprise me about my club, but the lack of acknowledgement by the club is truly astounding.

Sounds like Pasoti doesn't it ?

'Nothing to see here.Subject closed.' Farm Politburo.