Politics are ruining our club.

Are they really 'ruining our club'? What is our club?

Our club to me is the badge, the history, Home Park, the green shirts, the 11 men on the pitch representing Plymouth Argyle Football Club. Everything else pales into insignificance.

When people look on SkySportsNews at the league table do you think they have any idea what goes on on the internet and these so called 'politics'? No. Actually do you think 95% Argyle fans knows what really goes on? No. Do you think they care? No.

When I, and many others travel 400 miles on a Tuesday night to watch Argyle away, do you really think they give a flying one who is sat in the directors box? Do they give a shit what a member of the PASB said on the internet this week? Do they care who has stood for the Trust elections this week.. No. Because they all love Plymouth Argyle Football Club and to them (and me) the only true representatives of the club are the 11 men that step over that white line on a Saturday.

So with respect, no. Politics are not ruining the club. There is nothing more I look forward to than attending Home Park on a Saturday or the buzz of an away game. No amount of internet squabbles, threats, jokes, arguments etc will ever take that away and nor should it.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with debating your club on the internet, questioning it's hierarchy etc. But when it directly stops you supporting the club you have supported since you were young - It's probably time you pulled the plug and re-discovered why you fell in love with PAFC many years ago.

A "real fan".
Good luck to you if can ignore all that shit. We were all asked to sign up to the trust to save our club, what now? Leave the suits to run it for us or keep up the scrutiny? Which vehicle do you use to scrutinize the club? Can we afford to give anybody a free rein to direct the club, not all these power crazy muppets surely?

what pilgrim pete said,,,thats what it is for 95% of us,,,,no one gives a feck iggy,

Saluting that Pete, spot on. I'm in the 95%.

It does nonetheless still irritate just how important the other 5% feel the politics are.

pilgrim_pete wrote:

Are they really 'ruining our club'? What is our club?

Our club to me is the badge, the history, Home Park, the green shirts, the 11 men on the pitch representing Plymouth Argyle Football Club. Everything else pales into insignificance.

When people look on SkySportsNews at the league table do you think they have any idea what goes on on the internet and these so called 'politics'? No. Actually do you think 95% Argyle fans knows what really goes on? No. Do you think they care? No.

When I, and many others travel 400 miles on a Tuesday night to watch Argyle away, do you really think they give a flying one who is sat in the directors box? Do they give a shit what a member of the PASB said on the internet this week? Do they care who has stood for the Trust elections this week.. No. Because they all love Plymouth Argyle Football Club and to them (and me) the only true representatives of the club are the 11 men that step over that white line on a Saturday.

So with respect, no. Politics are not ruining the club. There is nothing more I look forward to than attending Home Park on a Saturday or the buzz of an away game. No amount of internet squabbles, threats, jokes, arguments etc will ever take that away and nor should it.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with debating your club on the internet, questioning it's hierarchy etc. But when it directly stops you supporting the club you have supported since you were young - It's probably time you pulled the plug and re-discovered why you fell in love with PAFC many years ago.

If you are happy to just support and accept eternal mediocrity, that's fine for you. I find it all very Aviva but hey, each to their own.

Some of us knew the 21st century footballing reality of what was coming next if Stapes and co. got greedy and refused to seek investment in the playing side ,when the stock of our staff was high under Holloway. Even I didn't think it would end up as bad as it did but now, the self same superfans who trusted in Stapes are now advising Brent and running parts of the show, like a charity case.
It's not going to get better anytime soon and a great many former paying customers are finding better things to do than physically and financially support England's most under achieving city club, being led by a disinterested banker, turned property developer and his dimwitted but ambitious local tribesmen.

so say the 5%

tcm wrote:

so say the 5%

There are a lot of idiotic football people

pilgrim_pete wrote:

When people look on SkySportsNews at the league table do you think they have any idea what goes on on the internet and these so called 'politics'? No. Actually do you think 95% Argyle fans knows what really goes on? No. Do you think they care? No.

I think you'd find that if the 95% you speak of really did know what really goes on, the percentage that would care would be significantly higher than your 5%.

For some, ignorance really is bliss.

so say the 5%

Can't say the micro politics are all that interesting but surely anyone who genuinely cares about Argyle would be interested in the macro political aspect? To say that you don't care about the overall picture apart from what happens on the pitch is tantamount to saying that fans of Brighton,Southampton,Norwich,Doncaster etc were over reaching their status by launching campaigns against the damaging ownerships which once threatened to tear those clubs asunder.Utterly nonsensical,complacent and irresponsible,empty headed ostrich thinking at its worst.

just like going to the football myself,,,out of interest greenskinn what is your doing to change things ?

The "95%" give whoever's in charge, a free hand. Todd was the last one so charged.
And who actually speaks for the fans of Argyle ? Most fans just say "COYG" or "FOYG" .. that's how football is.
When it was patently up for grabs, IJN made a lunge for the flag and wrapped his arguments and attitude under it. A sad day in my opinion.

As for Pursey's toe ... I don't remember that particular poster being that empathetic about Seip's toe, far from it.... but then that's politics for you.

tcm wrote:

just like going to the football myself,,,out of interest greenskinn what is your doing to change things ?

If you really thought that, Mike, you wouldn't post such things on here.

trust you to ruin my argument kneckt,,,,,,, ,,,,,but that aside its allright havin those apinions but do something about it if you feel like that,,,

Tringreen wrote:

pilgrim_pete wrote:

Are they really 'ruining our club'? What is our club?

Our club to me is the badge, the history, Home Park, the green shirts, the 11 men on the pitch representing Plymouth Argyle Football Club. Everything else pales into insignificance.

When people look on SkySportsNews at the league table do you think they have any idea what goes on on the internet and these so called 'politics'? No. Actually do you think 95% Argyle fans knows what really goes on? No. Do you think they care? No.

When I, and many others travel 400 miles on a Tuesday night to watch Argyle away, do you really think they give a flying one who is sat in the directors box? Do they give a shit what a member of the PASB said on the internet this week? Do they care who has stood for the Trust elections this week.. No. Because they all love Plymouth Argyle Football Club and to them (and me) the only true representatives of the club are the 11 men that step over that white line on a Saturday.

So with respect, no. Politics are not ruining the club. There is nothing more I look forward to than attending Home Park on a Saturday or the buzz of an away game. No amount of internet squabbles, threats, jokes, arguments etc will ever take that away and nor should it.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with debating your club on the internet, questioning it's hierarchy etc. But when it directly stops you supporting the club you have supported since you were young - It's probably time you pulled the plug and re-discovered why you fell in love with PAFC many years ago.

If you are happy to just support and accept eternal mediocrity, that's fine for you. I find it all very Aviva but hey, each to their own.

Some of us knew the 21st century footballing reality of what was coming next if Stapes and co. got greedy and refused to seek investment in the playing side ,when the stock of our staff was high under Holloway. Even I didn't think it would end up as bad as it did but now, the self same superfans who trusted in Stapes are now advising Brent and running parts of the show, like a charity case.
It's not going to get better anytime soon and a great many former paying customers are finding better things to do than physically and financially support England's most under achieving city club, being led by a disinterested banker, turned property developer and his dimwitted but ambitious local tribesmen.

For what its worth, I agree that board decisions are of relevance and of interest to the fans. Views on boards of directors are something I have and I think it's healthy to have. It's the micro political analysis, bitching and little interpersonal power plays that like PP, I personally can't stand take no interest in. Well, I lie there, I sometimes take an interest. But only the way I'd watch Big Brother or X Factor- car crash TV and certainly something I'd never get involved with. In response to PenzancePirate's post, as far as club policy goes I'm certainly not in any percentage of indifference. But if, as I think Sean meant, the 5% is people who don't care about fan bickering, I'm certainly in that.

As for the traveling round the country 400 miles on a cold wet Tuesday night thing- I don't see why it isn't possible to combine that with critical views of the board or management. There's a distinction between being there to support the team and the club no matter what and supporting the regime. And that's not me lecturing anyone on how to support their club, just that there's a difference between relentless support (which I'm delighted to do) and blind faith in management without grounds (which I'd never say). Each to their own as you say Tring, if I were to pour scorn on the thousands who've turned their back on Argyle over the past few years then well, there'd be an awful lot of scorn ending up getting poured. Each to their own goes all ways.

tcm wrote:

just like going to the football myself,,,out of interest greenskinn what is your doing to change things ?

I suppose you could say that putting forward cogent and logical arguments to at least try to get some spark into people who don't seem inclined to think about anything at all is a start.OK,you go to football to basically get pissed on the train,get further pissed at the match and generally not care about whether Argyle win or lose,fail to make progress or regress further etc-you're only there for the beer and a good laff -fair enough.Some of us [especially,as in my case,if you come from a family steeped into Argyle history dating back to 1920] care a bit more about the club and believe that keeping a very watchful eye on events which are taking place at the top of the club is rather a good thing,which i'd have thought was a salutary lesson to be learned from the past and especially the last 5 years.Personally i was in favour of a major demo against Stapleton and the board in 2007 upon the sale of a goodly few of our best players and shouted my disapproval in the game against Hull after the sale of Norris in Jan 2008.Problem was,i was on my own and got some very funny looks from people around me who obviously didn't share my views-it's very difficult to shift entrenched opinions and attitudes-i'd certainly have joined in any demo against that board and subsequent ones.But future expressions of dissent don't look very likely do they,with 95% of fans apparently just being there for the beer and a laff-can't understand why you don't go and watch Totnes Town or whoever-almost certainly they've got a bar and it would be a lot cheaper.

Just as a final point-if it became clear that James Brent or any future owner was not going to be a force for good,would you give a shit either way? Because your posts certainly don't indicate that you would.

GreenSam wrote:

But if, as I think Sean meant, the 5% is people who don't care about fan bickering, I'm certainly in that.

Whether you care about it or not is up to you, Sam. But Jock's family being threatened, and various people getting abusive phone calls and threatening emails, and my being taken off the programme are not 'bickering'.

Peggy wrote:

GreenSam wrote:

But if, as I think Sean meant, the 5% is people who don't care about fan bickering, I'm certainly in that.

Whether you care about it or not is up to you, Sam. But Jock's family being threatened, and various people getting abusive phone calls and threatening emails, and my being taken off the programme are not 'bickering'.

Of course bickering is a huge understatement when it comes to this conflict-fair enough and I can't argue with that. The Doctor summed it up well on Pasoti with "semi public war".

Yes he did - because a lot of people are getting hurt by the actions of a few, and the club's bound to get hurt by it eventually.

And if someone like The Doctor, who is an intelligent, moderate poster who likes to see life in straightforward terms is beginning to question what is going on, then you can bet your sweet bippy that others are too.

Like the Roman Empire pasoti is decaying and will soon fall. Come back in a while and ATD will follow. Such is life.

dont be so silly green skinn,you cant change your team,,,,thats my day out thats what i like doing your stuck with me all the if and buts?,,what if staps said this what if brent said that,,,,,,dont fecking care,,,its just me and 6000 at the mo,,might b me and 10 000 next season,again dont fecking care,,,,people might be havin internet wars again dont fecking care,,,,,,dont care who shagged who dont care who slagged off who,,,,,,,,,its fooball,,crack on ,,enjoy,,,if its not doing it for you i dont realy care,,,,,,,iam in it for comrade

tcm wrote:

dont be so silly green skinn,you cant change your team,,,,thats my day out thats what i like doing your stuck with me all the if and buts?,,what if staps said this what if brent said that,,,,,,dont fecking care,,,its just me and 6000 at the mo,,might b me and 10 000 next season,again dont fecking care,,,,people might be havin internet wars again dont fecking care,,,,,,dont care who shagged who dont care who slagged off who,,,,,,,,,its fooball,,crack on ,,enjoy,,,if its not doing it for you i dont realy care,,,,,,,iam in it for comrade

FFS,can't someone put this twink out of his addle headed misery?

Of course direction and policy matter, I'm not going to give anyone a free hand by turning a blind eye. The original question however was is the politics ruining our club, the answer is no because as Pete said 'club' is badge, team, green shirts and representing Plymouth. Does politics ruin that?, no.

When I go to Argyle games I go to uphold those things, not to celebrate a supporters representative board or the strategic direction of the development plans.

Tring. I've not seen them win for over four years now, I've seen some absolute sh*t, it's poor, it's predictable and it's soul destroying sometimes. But I keep going because when I do finally see them win it'll be as sweet a feeling as a certain Trigger header in front of Demport against QPR.

Politics is piffle, it's necessary piffle, it needs to be monitored and kept on top of but it mustn't bog us down. The bit that matters is 11 men in green with a mayflower on their shirts representing Plymouth, James Brent will never score a goal for Argyle, neither will Chris or the PASB.

To suggest focus on football means a blind eye to everything else is massively over simplifying what what we're saying Tring. Basic values and ideals will always trump the day to day piffle and posturing of those who believe they have 'power' at or around the club.

I said so last year and it'll remain the same forever, under tyrants, if pushed, we can take our ball, our badge, our shirts, our City's representation and start again without them. They don't 'own the club', we do.

I know you've only been back a short while, but what time does your last bus leave, Smiffo ?

X Isle wrote:

I said so last year and it'll remain the same forever, under tyrants, if pushed, we can take our ball, our badge, our shirts, our City's representation and start again without them. They don't 'own the club', we do.

Complete rubbish.
"They" do own the club. No matter what you think you can take, (and you are delusional if you think you can take the badge), and use to start again... It will never ever be Plymouth Argyle. Which is why the fight is so important to begin with.