Sack Reid.....now!!!!!

If Peter Ridsdale is serious about making his mark as the new Chairman and if we are under new ownership and a fresh start he can start by sacking Peter Reid, i don't care about all the other obvious stuff, with players like Walton,Soukouna,Feeney and Larrieu we should at least be competing in this division...at the moment we are not even achieving that.
Nice bloke he may be but manager he is not.I have just got back from Afghanistan and had to sit through that 90 minutes of pure guff..at half time i had a double whiskey and that did not help, at the end i wanted to bloody shoot myself. Everything i have read about us being pure crap was right and today has proved it.

I know it's not 'fashionable' to have a go at Peter Reid because of all the off field shit which has made this club a complete basket case but I agree - he has to go. Last season with SWP, Connor Clifford, Craig Noone, Reda Johnson, Joe Mason etc there was no way we should have ben relegated - even with the points deduction. And it wasn't just the results - the team 'performances' were without excepetion shocking beyond belief. The bloke is far more clueless than sturrock the clueless (obviously in his 2nd stint) ever was.

Not sure I agree. The results have been terrible, sure. At the same time they're entirely predictable with the hand we've dealt him. For an eg, Posty on PASOTI moaning about how we only played 1 striker up front today...do you think that may be possibly because we've only got 1 striker?

Freathy wrote:

I know it's not 'fashionable' to have a go at Peter Reid because of all the off field shit which has made this club a complete basket case but I agree - he has to go. Last season with SWP, Connor Clifford, Craig Noone, Reda Johnson, Joe Mason etc there was no way we should have ben relegated - even with the points deduction. And it wasn't just the results - the team 'performances' were without excepetion shocking beyond belief. The bloke is far more clueless than sturrock the clueless (obviously in his 2nd stint) ever was.

A rather simplistic summary of events.Argyle's problems started last season when Noone,BWP,Johnson were sold and the club were unable to sign players on loan after going into admin-thats why Clifford went to Notts County after returning to Chelsea.As a matter of fact,when Reid was able to call on the above players,Argyle were in twelfth position and far closer to the play offs than the relegation spots-contrary to your assertion above,there were some good performances last season,doubles over Sheffield Wednesday,Rovers,Swindon,MK Dons and the home win against Exeter come to mind-an away win at Southampton wasn't too shabby,either.Argyle would have avoided relegation if those players could have been retained last season,but without them and the inability to sign replacements,not a cat in hells chance.I don't know if you've been to any games this season,but the lack of quality,experience and self belief in many of the players signed in the summer is all too self evident-we are scraping the bottom of the barrel.I see Dickinson scored again for Southend today,looks like his "injuries" have cleared up.I'm not a "Reid must stay whatever happens" man-if he was allowed to sign some players who were up to a mans league and results still didn't pick up,then definitely sack him,but i honestly don't think that any manager could affect the squad currently in situ,not that any manager in his right mind would come here ATM.

Now I've calmed down a bit after yet another shocking and humiliating 'performance' of course I fully accept that this season Peter Reid is in an impossible position. He's now having to work with players Torpoint FC and Millbrook FC wouldn't touch. But it still remains that last season there were too many shit 'perfomances' from a team with too many good L1 standard players.

Freathy wrote:

Now I've calmed down a bit after yet another shocking and humiliating 'performance' of course I fully accept that this season Peter Reid is in an impossible position. He's now having to work with players Torpoint FC and Millbrook FC wouldn't touch. But it still remains that last season there were too many shit 'perfomances' from a team with too many good L1 standard players.

There were some bad performances,i agree.But just as a final word,i will say that there were also bad perfomances in the early seasons of managers like Waiters and Smith,who had the backing and resources to be able to turn things around and build their own teams as they saw fit.As i said earlier,if Reid had been given similar boons and results had remained poor,sure,give him the push,get rid.But i honestly don't see that it's possible to judge the man-it's not a question of if he's a nice bloke or whatever,i think he's taken over a club that has been systematically asset stripped and no other manager could have done much better under the circumstances.

Mock Cuncher wrote:

Not sure I agree. The results have been terrible, sure. At the same time they're entirely predictable with the hand we've dealt him. For an eg, Posty on PASOTI moaning about how we only played 1 striker up front today...do you think that may be possibly because we've only got 1 striker?

Quite. No-one could string that motley bunch of rejects and kids into anything resembling a decent football team. How would a change of manager help?.

The added motivation of actually being paid might help, the added motivation of seeing their acting chairman NOT take his £20,000 pcm thus engendering some form of "we're in this together" might help, some fekkin' investment in players might help, some end to the constant dicking about with deadlines and payments from the proposed buyer might help.

It continually amazes me how much of a sh1t people give about football with everything else going on anyway. I mean, what does losing a few football matches actually matter when we're destined to become a perennial cash cow for a property developer and a serial football slut?.

X Isle wrote:

Mock Cuncher wrote:

Not sure I agree. The results have been terrible, sure. At the same time they're entirely predictable with the hand we've dealt him. For an eg, Posty on PASOTI moaning about how we only played 1 striker up front today...do you think that may be possibly because we've only got 1 striker?

Quite. No-one could string that motley bunch of rejects and kids into anything resembling a decent football team. How would a change of manager help?.

The added motivation of actually being paid might help, the added motivation of seeing their acting chairman NOT take his £20,000 pcm thus engendering some form of "we're in this together" might help, some fekkin' investment in players might help, some end to the constant dicking about with deadlines and payments from the proposed buyer might help.

It continually amazes me how much of a sh1t people give about football with everything else going on anyway. I mean, what does losing a few football matches actually matter when we're destined to become a perennial cash cow for a property developer and a serial football slut?.

Your last sentence doesn't appear to mean a thing to the 'real fans'. Aviva chose wisely.

What I don't understand is why Mariner was jumped on so quickly whereas Saint Peter remains untouched ... it really must be down to the gas bill.
He was in charge of team affairs for most of last season's relegation, and this season is plumbing new depths.
I was appalled with last season's performances from the players we had, and thankfully have not had to witness the new brand of football this season.

I hear the plan is to get teenagers to play tippy tappy across the back four in L2, well, that should be a rip roaring success... obviously following the Sturrock model.
Like the previous two seasons, it'll all be over by Christmas, maybe sooner, maybe after 12 games.
You don't win anything with kids .... IF they're crap.

Sack Reid and replace him with Sir Alf, Mourinho, Wenger, Paisley or Shankly, does anyone really think it would make a difference?

Last season we started slowly, were beginning to look a bit better when we sold Noone, BWP, and Clifford left. We then went on a slump but finished the season really strongly and had a good team spirit even though the squad by that point was pretty terrible. This season it has thus far gone exactly as predicted. Terribly.

I am not Reid's biggest fan, but I sincerely hope criticism of him doesn't distract fans from targetting the people really responsible for this shit. Given we can't afford to sack him anyway I think the argument is completely moot.

Mock Cuncher wrote:

Last season we started slowly, were beginning to look a bit better when we sold Noone, BWP, and Clifford left. We then went on a slump but finished the season really strongly and had a good team spirit even though the squad by that point was pretty terrible. This season it has thus far gone exactly as predicted. Terribly.

I am not Reid's biggest fan, but I sincerely hope criticism of him doesn't distract fans from targetting the people really responsible for this shit. Given we can't afford to sack him anyway I think the argument is completely moot.

I am a fan, after the dour and depressing words of Sturrock, it's nice to have a more glass full type. The gas bill just illustrates how he feels about the club and area.

Ditto Fletcher.

We must be worth something after all.

I believe the love ins with Reid and, yes, Fletcher, are nothing more than Pasoti mindsets that don't really exist out in the real world.
The likes of Wotton and Mariner had far more reason to have Argyle in their heart yet were cast aside as easily as a wink ..... and why ?? ... because it was fashionable to diss them... no more, no less.

Yes, it's a blessed relief to hear someone like Reid after the depressing Sturrock, but he is just a journeyman manager happy to have another chance to do what he likes to do, as is Fletcher.... and both are contracted on good money. But to read undying love for the cause into their time here is frankly the dream of sinking men looking for a bit of dry land.
In pure football terms, I personally believe it is Fletcher's consistent inability to protect his back four that has gone a long way to our club's frightful demise since he was discarded by Warnock and bought by Sturrock. By all accounts he dominated the changing room under Mariner and ran the show.. There does have to be footballing reasons why we have rotted so quickly ... it isn't all down to the hopeless politics and money..... perhaps his middle name is Jonah.

penzancepirate wrote:

I believe the love ins with Reid and, yes, Fletcher, are nothing more than Pasoti mindsets that don't really exist out in the real world.
The likes of Wotton and Mariner had far more reason to have Argyle in their heart yet were cast aside as easily as a wink ..... and why ?? ... because it was fashionable to diss them... no more, no less.

Yes, it's a blessed relief to hear someone like Reid after the depressing Sturrock, but he is just a journeyman manager happy to have another chance to do what he likes to do, as is Fletcher.... and both are contracted on good money. But to read undying love for the cause into their time here is frankly the dream of sinking men looking for a bit of dry land.
In pure football terms, I personally believe it is Fletcher's consistent inability to protect his back four that has gone a long way to our club's frightful demise since he was discarded by Warnock and bought by Sturrock. By all accounts he dominated the changing room under Mariner and ran the show.. There does have to be footballing reasons why we have rotted so quickly ... it isn't all down to the hopeless politics and money..... perhaps his middle name is Jonah.

There certainly are football reasons why we've declined so quickly.Namely Barnes,BWP,Noone,Johnson,Mason,Bolasie and Zubar.

For me Mariner copped it because a) he had some money and chose to waste it on utter dross like Johnson D and Kenny fekkin Cooper b) there were players in his squad who could be moulded into something that would have worked (see the previous posters list) and c) he continually bemoaned everyone but his team or himself, he'd blame the pitch, the referee anything but his own failings.

In Reids case a) he's had no money whatsoever b) the squad has been decimated so he really doesn't have any quality to mould at all but c) despite vhaving every excuse possible to hide behind, he never does.

I thought Mariner was dreadful, I can't mount a cohesive arguement to say Reid is any better, he just seems a nicer human being and that's good enough when whoever was in charge would face having to grasp the shittiest of shitty sticks with both hands.

And perhaps there we have it ... the 'personable thing' that seems to carry so much weight these days down on the Farm. Perhaps Saint Peter qualifies for the hard working gent club, along with Ridsdale, "Damon" and his fragrant wife.

In football terms, I just don't get the love in, it's been a naive shambles. However, I am not one who would call for his head, we are in no position to hire another coaching team, and we're going down with or without him, Ridsdale has seen to that.

I'm just wondering out loud WHY the love affair, and more than that, WHY Reid would want to carry on down here in this capacity with all that has gone on. For much of his tenure, he's been up the line 'scouting' and 'networking' for all the good it's done us. He didn't move his family down .. that's no way to run a football club.
It may well be no more palatable a question than that asked of Ridsdale ... WHY ?
It ain't for the love of "Argyle", that's for sure, nor our beaches.
I can't remember what Saint Peter's connection was now with that Bryan Robson documentary, maybe that has a part to play ? The pro game is such a village.

penzancepirate wrote:

And perhaps there we have it ... the 'personable thing' that seems to carry so much weight these days down on the Farm. Perhaps Saint Peter qualifies for the hard working gent club, along with Ridsdale, "Damon" and his fragrant wife.

In football terms, I just don't get the love in, it's been a naive shambles. However, I am not one who would call for his head, we are in no position to hire another coaching team, and we're going down with or without him, Ridsdale has seen to that.

I'm just wondering out loud WHY the love affair, and more than that, WHY Reid would want to carry on down here in this capacity with all that has gone on. For much of his tenure, he's been up the line 'scouting' and 'networking' for all the good it's done us. He didn't move his family down .. that's no way to run a football club.
It may well be no more palatable a question than that asked of Ridsdale ... WHY ?
It ain't for the love of "Argyle", that's for sure, nor our beaches.
I can't remember what Saint Peter's connection was now with that Bryan Robson documentary, maybe that has a part to play ? The pro game is such a village.

I thought Reid had bought a house at Ugborough? It's not a love in for me,PP,just an acknowledgement that the man has had,by a very considerable distance,the hardest job of any Argyle manager in my time as a supporter and that it's impossible to judge him one way or the other.It may be that, even if he had been given a level playing field,he wouldn't have been the man for the job,who knows. Frankly i was surprised at his appointment,as surprised as i was at the appointment of Mariner-i was always highly suspicious that both owed more to their world cup playing pedigree than their potentialities as Argyle managers.That said,it was right that both should be judged fairly-i didn't think Mariner did that badly,although as Smiffy said,some of his signings, made at considerable cost,didn't exactly set the world on fire.

It's a good question as to why Reid is still here,maybe the answer partly lies in asking another question-why did he leave a well paid,secure job as a premiership coach at Stoke in the first place? From what i can recall,he was heavily influenced in his decision by two previous Argyle managers in Pulis and Saxton,who convinced him that Argyle was a good club to manage-possibly he still believes that to be he case,although i must confess my own patience would have been stretched beyond breaking point.Then again,lets face it,if Reid leaves Argyle,where else could he go as a number one,rather than a coach or assistant? At his age and with his recent record [judged purely on results,which is the main criteria that other clubs would look at],its very unlikely that there would be a queue of clubs after his services-maybe he has realised this and has decided to ride out the storm and hope for the best,however unlikely a healthy outcome seems at the moment.

I can’t knock Reid for the playing side of things, if you’re given crap tools to do a job then you’re going to get a crap job, but I have that same doubt about why Reid is still here.

I don’t have a scrap of evidence but I can’t help but wonder if Reid is somehow involved with the morally bankrupt offerings at Home Park.

Would he really pay the bills knowing that Ridsdale is milking, allegedly, 20k a month out of the club and while the administrator is milking even more? Something just doesn’t smell right to me, why is he still here?

Maybe Reid is hanging on because he knows that if he leaves he will never work again as a manager in England. His reputation is already tarnished and we would be the final nail in his coffin. If he sticks with us and maybe takes us up a division or two his reputation will be restored.

But Reid could probably get any job in the lowest division, why choose to stay with the worst financed club in the FL, it still doesn't add up.

Reid is probably on a decent wage here which he wouldn't get elsewhere at this link of the footballing food chain. He must believe that he'll get that money or at least a decent proportion eventually. As soon as he settles with Heaney he'll be off if he doesn't feel that he's given the resources to actually achieve anything or raise his stock again. In the meantime he'll carry on praising Argyle's supporters whilst muddling around unsuccessfully with his squad of utterly limp rejects.

As an independent man employed to manage the football on the pitch, Reid should have been fighting Ridsdale's decisions tooth and nail, like many GOOD mangers do, they fight their corner. But no, he has meekly turned belly up and allowed Ridsdale to decimate the playing squad far more than neccessary, and all to allow the pre-pack to have the best shot at the gig and not have to stump up any money. It did not have to be that way if he and others had stood up to Ridsdale.
If I have a problem with Ridsdale and his plan, I must surely, and do, find it difficult not to have a problem with Reid's part in it. I can't quite put my finger on it, but somewhere in the land of the Saints, Pete has been far too aquiescent.

The likes of Holloway or Warnock would have been off way before now in disgust or temper. I just wonder what makes Saint Peter's mind tick in all this. It seems a bit of good cop, bad cop, but perhaps his morality is not that different to Ridsdale's when push comes to shove, despite the Farm accolades.
Every conductor needs a man on the ground, and in a going concern, these money games need the shop floor handlers to keep everyone on board.

I have a deal of sympathy for Reid's predicament but we have to remember he was appointed by lifelong fan and self confessed football expert, Toddy. Nuff said I think.

Very true Charlie. What I also remember is Gardner saying the strangest thing about Reid's surprise appointment.... just a few weeks before Ridsdale's holiday. He said that it was up to the club AND Peter Reid to see if they suited eachother.... very strange.
Now I think it's pretty certain that Gardner/Stapleton etc knew the dire straits the club was in, and almost certainly already saw admin as the only course of action should the World Cup go East.

It's not beyond the realms of possibility at all that the appointments of Reid and Ridsdale were connected.
And let's not forget Peter Reid was (is ?) one of the advisors to the Football Fund exposed by Channel 4's recent documentary on how to buy a football club and get around the League rules... it's not as if he doesn't know what can go on.

Frank Bullitt wrote:

Maybe Reid is hanging on because he knows that if he leaves he will never work again as a manager in England. His reputation is already tarnished and we would be the final nail in his coffin. If he sticks with us and maybe takes us up a division or two his reputation will be restored.

That's the side i'd come down on. Desperation mixed with a little old fashioned integrity.

I agree with GOB, it does seem strange he'd pay the bills knowing his boss, whose responsibility it is to pay the bills, was taking £20k pcm. However I just can't see him being part of the bidding process when Ridsdale seemingly spends the whole game, loud as you like, slagging him off.