Starting again!

To all those who are fed up with it all and want to start again!

Do it, do it now... Because the situation isn't going to really change for you, is it?

Some on this website will have a lot in common with those on the farm!

If that is what you really want, co-op Pasoti and the trust, and form another club, or do what you must do, but...

Nail your colours to the mast and do it!

Stop the bloody moaning!

Rickler wrote:

To all those who are fed up with it all and want to start again!

Do it, do it now... Because the situation isn't going to really change for you, is it?

Some on this website will have a lot in common with those on the farm!

If that is what you really want, co-op Pasoti and the trust, and form another club, or do what you must do, but...

Nail your colours to the mast and do it!

Stop the bloody moaning!

From what I can see, there aren't many on the farm wanting this . Neither have I heard any such noises coming from the Trust.
If I have missed these movements, please advise accordingly.

I would be happy to see another club formed and the present one dissolved under its present condition, but I'm buggered if I can be bothered to start one up.

If that makes me a moaner then so be it, but to be frank the "stop the moaning" comment comes over as sooooo "your not a prapppppppper fan". My opinion is different to yours, get used to it.

Even 'the divided' are divided.

Jeeez, it would be boring if we all thought the same, or worse still, be denied the right to say our piece.

On this issue, what the hell can I do , apart from try to convince others and more importantly those in postions of power/ influence, eg trust leaders ?

That's why I keep posting links and appealing to those who can do something. I don't particularly relish the thought of a newly formed club being in the wilderness and more than likely infested by small minded janners. But this present state of affairs is to me, worse than that unpalatable outcome.

Does anyone feel inspired to support the club as things stand ?

Nobody wants to see the end of the club but unless you're in cloud cuckoo land the club has already ended.

The club has a new name.
The club has new owners.
The club no longer has its home.
The club has been purchased by property developers.


It's called asset stripping and once something has been asset stripped it no longer exist. Now by some miracle such as Cardiff Trading Standards pulling off a little justice along with a large slice of luck, or by a private detective digging more dirt then I can imagine, we may at massive odds against, prevent it from happening, but by all standards PAFC as we know it will soon no longer exist.

If you were selling your house what more proof do you need to show that you're no longer the owner!!

GOB wrote:

Nobody wants to see the end of the club but unless you're in cloud cuckoo land the club has already ended.

The club has a new name.
The club has new owners.
The club no longer has its home.
The club has been purchased by property developers.

The club has a new name...
It does? What is it?

The club has new owners...
Not yet it doesn't. And when it does, that owner is likely to be Risdale. Well I for one would rather have the Riddler in charge than anyone who has been on the board the last ten years.

The club no longer has a home...
Yes it does, it has the same home as its had for decades. And it's only the last decade it actually owned the home, and even that is an illusion, because to all intents the bank owned it.

The club has been purchased by property developers.
The club has been under the control of property developers for years -Stapleton and crew were property developers, they just messed it up so very badly that nothing ever got done.


Mark my words...

If the club somehow manage to start winning, all the 'moral outrage' will dissipate so fast you will doubt it was there to begin with.

Honestly... Do you think the likes of Smiffy and Newell and the others shouting loudest on the farm are going to stop going if Heaney takes over?

Pigs will fly first.

Rickler wrote:

GOB wrote:

Nobody wants to see the end of the club but unless you're in cloud cuckoo land the club has already ended.

The club has a new name.
The club has new owners.
The club no longer has its home.
The club has been purchased by property developers.

The club has a new name...
It does? What is it?

The club has new owners...
Not yet it doesn't. And when it does, that owner is likely to be Risdale. Well I for one would rather have the Riddler in charge than anyone who has been on the board the last ten years.

The club no longer has a home...
Yes it does, it has the same home as its had for decades. And it's only the last decade it actually owned the home, and even that is an illusion, because to all intents the bank owned it.

The club has been purchased by property developers.
The club has been under the control of property developers for years -Stapleton and crew were property developers, they just messed it up so very badly that nothing ever got done.


Mark my words...

If the club somehow manage to start winning, all the 'moral outrage' will dissipate so fast you will doubt it was there to begin with.

Honestly... Do you think the likes of Smiffy and Newell and the others shouting loudest on the farm are going to stop going if Heaney takes over?

Pigs will fly first.

I don't disagree about the outrage dissipating if Argyle should be successful this year,in fact i'd be prepared to eat a large slice of humble pie myself and chant "we are going up" with the rest of them.I must say though,that the elation would still be tinged with a certain dread feeling about what the long term would hold.We shall see,i suppose.Not sure about the Riddler being better than anyone over the last decade-Peter Jones and Nic Warren spring to mind as a pair of pretty good directors who could take the club no further due to being in a boardroom minority.My main doubt about Ridsdale's qualification to sort Argyle out is that, although Cardiff are an oft quoted example of his previous achievement,in fact it was Sam Hamman who provided the investment and impetus to get them going from a similar situation,Ridders came much later,when they had reached the CCC.I do agree that Ridders would have been ideal when Ollie was in charge-he certainly wouldn't have been afraid to truly "go for it",maybe our situation would have been so different if that had been the case.One thing is for sure-it looks like we're stuck with whatever comes our way,i just hope and pray that our pessimism is not justified and Argyle can be a club to be proud of once more.

Stop moaning ? .... not a chance in hell.

I've nailed my colours to the mast ... absolutely zero support for any club run by Ridsdale or this particular Heaney and previous owners' consortium. Other alternatives would of course be judged on the colours they shove up their mast. I don't have a problem with Brent's words, I would view him with far less suspicion. However, if any owners, including Brent, try inappropriate development, I won't support be able to support that club .... ever... that's a sad one, but there are other things more important.

A new 'trust led' club or whatever just cannot get off the ground at this moment ... there is no 'FC United' constituency in Plymouth while 'Argyle' still exists that's just a fact of football life here.

I'm glad Stapleton and co messed up their property aspirations, I don't want inappropriate development in a park. Small scale bolt ons to the stadium including an hotel would not be a problem for me personally, but little else. The truth is Stapleton didn't really muck it up ... it's just that allowable development figures just don't add up.... never have. that's why they're trying the blackmail route. I think they'll fail on the really profitable bits that would make the plans affordable ........ good .... build it all somewhere els ... there are plenty of other sites in the city crying out for it.

Yep, the club in whatever form it takes still does have a home, and always will have a home in the park .... as long as the club itself wishes to stay there

Will Napoleon stop going ? ..... absolutely not... I wouldn't follow him through a light shower ... he blows with the wind. It's his life and he doesn't have that sort of moral or busines compass.... he calls himself middle of the road ... that'll be 'Anybodys' then.

Will the moral outrage disappear if the club starts winning ? ... I can only speak for myself ..... absolutely not.

Rickler wrote:

GOB wrote:

Nobody wants to see the end of the club but unless you're in cloud cuckoo land the club has already ended.

The club has a new name.
The club has new owners.
The club no longer has its home.
The club has been purchased by property developers.

The club has a new name...
It does? What is it?

The club has new owners...
Not yet it doesn't. And when it does, that owner is likely to be Risdale. Well I for one would rather have the Riddler in charge than anyone who has been on the board the last ten years.

The club no longer has a home...
Yes it does, it has the same home as its had for decades. And it's only the last decade it actually owned the home, and even that is an illusion, because to all intents the bank owned it.

The club has been purchased by property developers.
The club has been under the control of property developers for years -Stapleton and crew were property developers, they just messed it up so very badly that nothing ever got done.


Mark my words...

If the club somehow manage to start winning, all the 'moral outrage' will dissipate so fast you will doubt it was there to begin with.

Honestly... Do you think the likes of Smiffy and Newell and the others shouting loudest on the farm are going to stop going if Heaney takes over?

Pigs will fly first.

New name - Plymouth Argyle Football Club (125) Limited

As I said, the club no longer has a home, it's owned by a property development company and prior to it's purchase it was owned by PCC. If you can't work out the difference between a property development company and a local authority then well.....

As far as I'm concerned, if Smiffy & Newell wish to hold the same view point then I won't be opposing that view point just for the hell of it and, I'll happily stand beside them to help put that point over. To change a view point just because someone else that you don't get on with shares that view point is just plain stupid and illogical and would stink of prejudice.

If you wish to support Heaney and Ridsdale then fine, but don't expect me to share your view as staff remain unpaid, players sold off etc. and, just for the hell of it!

I will be moaning forever and a day while the club is in the hands that it is. Pigs will fly before I stop that!

GOB wrote:

New name - Plymouth Argyle Football Club (125) Limited

And before that it was Plymouth Argyle football company, not Club, nobody seemed to throw a hissy fit when that was changed. It's probably been changed many times for legal reasons - who really cares about that?

As I said, the club no longer has a home, it's owned by a property development company and prior to it's purchase it was owned by PCC. If you can't work out the difference between a property development company and a local authority then well.....

You can say it doesn't have a home till the cows come home. But it does! And no... I can't work out what the 'real practical' difference is, so why don't you tell me? If the difference is the 'developer' might actually develop the 'South Stand' and get rid of the portacabins and actually do the place up a bit, then I am all for it. Currently our main stand and attached buildings are a disgrace. Bring on the developement I say!


As far as I'm concerned, if Smiffy & Newell wish to hold the same view point then I won't be opposing that view point just for the hell of it and, I'll happily stand beside them to help put that point over. To change a view point just because someone else that you don't get on with shares that view point is just plain stupid and illogical and would stink of prejudice.
I didn't ask you to change your views. I asked whether you thought others who are threatening not to support 'Argyle' any longer if certain changes happen, will keep that promise? Do you? What will you do?


If you wish to support Heaney and Ridsdale then fine, but don't expect me to share your view as staff remain unpaid, players sold off etc. and, just for the hell of it!

I will be moaning forever and a day while the club is in the hands that it is. Pigs will fly before I stop that!

If there isn't enough money to go around then something is going to suffer. At the moment that would appear to be the paying of the staffs back wages. Although it is part of the agreed deal. I would ask, what moral obligation does whoever takes over have to paying the back wages of the staff? Surely that guilt should fall on the previous directors?

And the moaning... Moan all you like. It never did anyone any good. Action is what is needed.

You asked about the name change and you got the answer, now you want your cake and to eat it. If it didn't matter to you then what's your issue? - Obviously it matters to others so if you don't mind I'll continue to moan.

As for the obligations, you're having a larf? - Apart from MP's asking questions in Parliament, private detectives employed to investigate and councillors commenting on the shambles, maybe you have a point!

As I said Ricks, if your happy to support this lot then good luck to you and if you're daft enough to buy a season ticket then again, bloody good luck to you!

Why do you want action if you're happy with "our" lot?

GOB wrote:

You asked about the name change and you got the answer, now you want your cake and to eat it. If it didn't matter to you then what's your issue? - Obviously it matters to others so if you don't mind I'll continue to moan.

I think from my answer it was clear I don't have a issue. I just don't understand why some do, over what is really just a formal legality that plays no part in the day to day running of the club. As it happens.. I think going from 'club' to 'company' was far worse

As for the obligations, you're having a larf? - Apart from MP's asking questions in Parliament, private detectives employed to investigate and councillors commenting on the shambles, maybe you have a point!

Not having a laugh, and I don't really think you answered the question. MP's asking questions and Coucillers commenting, is really quite a farce at this late stage. Where were they when it all started? They are just grandstanding for votes in the most cynical fashion. They could have been at the forefront of this crisis from the beginning, but chose as they have done for years, to stay well clear until cornered.

As I said Ricks, if your happy to support this lot then good luck to you and if you're daft enough to buy a season ticket then again, bloody good luck to you!

Why do you want action if you're happy with "our" lot?

I am not 'happy' to support this lot. But as of here and now, it looks like the only option apart from 'not going', which I am not prepared to do. As for 'action'. I think its too late. I was just noting that Action was needed to effect change as moaning rarely achieved the goal.

I don't believe it is too late. This whole saga might rumble on for two years with two or three changes of ownership ... just look at Ridsdale's Barnsley fiasco.

Some are not prepared to boycott ... that is for them, but in the end, only one thing will drive the 'bad guys' away .... lack of fans turning up at the gate ... despite what they say, they need the football club operating at a certain level to collect enough rent to pay their way. Even Brent has mentioned his new concern over how many fans might be dumping the club while this all goes on.
When mass 'action' is sat upon by the likes of pasoti and the Trust , then people have to resort to their own answer. The best 'action' is always closest to home ... it is not always a big slash outside the off stump

Who ever the preferred bidders are. They either have no money or no interest in Argyle, probally both. Untill the take over is complete and I know who the owners are and their intentions I shall not set foot inside Home Park.

Just to clarify a few points...

I said I prefer Risdale over any other director we have had in the last ten years, as I thought that Peter Jones was beyond that limit ( I admit to the sin of forgetting about Nic, who folklore/testimony would have, saved us last time!)

And on reflection... "moaning" was a poor choice of words. As Gob correctly points out. Everyone has the right to moan about something.

So.. I think "hysteria" might be better, or "posturing". I can't quite put my finger on the right one.

An honest... "I don't like the situation so I won't support it" (refusing to watch Argyle play) I can understand and appreciate. It's been practiced by a few on this site and I salute them for sticking to their principles.

However... I think, those who 'demonstrate' by going to away games and POTD only, are totally copping out!

Agree totally with your last sentence Nige. Also agree that Ridsdale should/could have been brought in by the wallet years ago when our stock was high but we were outclassed in the boardroom. He probably would have found a way to find the necessary investment to support the heroics of the likes of Pulis & Holloway and truly ignite the potential fanbase.
Not at all convinced about his motives/ remit at this point in time.

Rickler wrote:

However... I think, those who 'demonstrate' by going to away games and POTD only, are totally copping out!

Ahh now I get it Ricks. You're having a go at Napoleon and his stance. Feel free

'Demonstrating' in such a way is rather lightweight I agree, and as such is as sure to fail as a fad diet.
But then deep down personal sacrifice has always been just too much for some people. Mind you, another couple of months of no back pay and a slow dawning of the standard of football these people are prepared to fund will soon sharpen their 'resolve'.
I still think many fans haven't got a real handle on what's being proposed here yet. And I can't blame them when you have the TV news saying it's all a done deal and everything will be fine.... it's not, nowhere near it.

I'm just confused as hell over it.

I hardly attended a match last season and yes, it was my own mini protest but the main reason was that I couldn't bare the thought of putting cash into the pockets of the "Bastards".

I think that the dealings over the past months have been a window into the future of how the club will be run, that's frightening! But Ricks is also right, if the club produces a string of results the crowds will return but I really don't think that's the agenda of the owners and I'll take some convincing otherwise. Until then I'll be taking the same agenda as Pete and I won't be stepping inside HP.

I attended all home games last seson POTD until Ridsdale showed up.... and I'm proud to say half of those games were freebies from those Surf people. So, that's when my boycott started and have only seen two games since then due to unavoidable family insistence. However, they won't be going next season either, my argument has finally won the day, so for once all the family are united.

Perhaps we should run a 'boycottfest', free balaclava and 'Nein Danke' sticker on entry

After all I have said about not setting foot in Home Park under this bunch. My Grand Daughter (10) has just joined the Argyle Centre of Excellence and wants me to take her up there and buy a new kit when they come out. I cannot refuse her.

Best invest in pork wing shares then Rickler because I won't be setting foot in Home Park.

Only chance now is if it all falls apart and A.N.Other sets up a rescue package.

Regards the setting up of AFC Argyle (hate that name) it wouldn't stand a chance, far too many are presently casting aside their morals in a procession of rose petals at the feet of Ridsdale. It's all very well saying we should 'put up or shut up' but 'putting up' now would be a fools errand. If it'll happen at all it'll be because........

a) Argyle has actually gone bust and there isn't an empty vessel for the lemmings to hang their scarves on. Or,

b) the majority have given AFC Heaney/Ridsdale a fair crack (don't think they deserve it but vive la difference) and can't stomach it any longer (i'm thinking a Truro merger or a Bill Archer style ground sell-off, that sort of thing), basically Argyle has become so unrepresentative that there emerges a broader collective will to restart.

Welcome to the madhouse.

X Isle wrote:

Best invest in pork wing shares then Rickler because I won't be setting foot in Home Park.

Only chance now is if it all falls apart and A.N.Other sets up a rescue package.

Regards the setting up of AFC Argyle (hate that name) it wouldn't stand a chance, far too many are presently casting aside their morals in a procession of rose petals at the feet of Ridsdale. It's all very well saying we should 'put up or shut up' but 'putting up' now would be a fools errand. If it'll happen at all it'll be because........

a) Argyle has actually gone bust and there isn't an empty vessel for the lemmings to hang their scarves on. Or,

b) the majority have given AFC Heaney/Ridsdale a fair crack (don't think they deserve it but vive la difference) and can't stomach it any longer (i'm thinking a Truro merger or a Bill Archer style ground sell-off, that sort of thing), basically Argyle has become so unrepresentative that there emerges a broader collective will to restart.

Sadly, I believe you are correct. A few more months/years of bucket rattling, fanfests,cricket matches and holier than thou posturing await.

No other city club would put up with this. Our 'leaders' appear to revel in it.

Madhouse?, i've been watching for a week or two and there seems much more sense spoken over 'ere.

If this is a madhouse then throw me a window, i've got some lickin' to do

Actually i'm not sure how much bucket rattling I could manage Tring, football is losing me, not just Argyle. It's a hollow experience, has been for a couple of years, culminating in my final flip to the dark side in 2009 post Watford. I can do holier than thou 'til the cows come home, as you all know, but far from having the APPETITE to start again with some sort of religious zeal?.........."meh!".

I forsee watching the home gates gradually rise and accepting it's passed me by, they're all selling out, time to move on. Grandaddy Smiffy did it when the admission rose to 10 shillings, maybe this is my ten shillings moment.

X Isle wrote:

Madhouse?, i've been watching for a week or two and there seems much more sense spoken over 'ere.

If this is a madhouse then throw me a window, i've got some lickin' to do

These one liner clowns on the farm offering unwavering support cannot be for real ?

Your 'plant' theory is looking ever more obvious, just like the pro Stapleton gang not so long ago.