Play Off Finals

Anybody watch Luton and Coventry? To be honest I wasn't particularly impressed by either side. Luton were very quick, physical and used the long ball to 2 big forwards, but didn't really create that much. Coventry were terrible first half, improved the second when they went to two up front, but again they weren't particularly dangerous.

Missed extra time and pens as the chinese takeaway needed to be picked up

Difficult to predict anything on the basis of one game, but I didn't see anything in either side that worried me for next season.

PlymptonPilgrim wrote:

Anybody watch Luton and Coventry? To be honest I wasn't particularly impressed by either side. Luton were very quick, physical and used the long ball to 2 big forwards, but didn't really create that much. Coventry were terrible first half, improved the second when they went to two up front, but again they weren't particularly dangerous.

Missed extra time and pens as the chinese takeaway needed to be picked up

Difficult to predict anything on the basis of one game, but I didn't see anything in either side that worried me for next season.

I agree, I expected a lot more from both teams, maybe it’s Wembley nerves.
Today’s game lacking some quality but lots of effort, Sarcevic having a good game, looks to have slimmed down a bit

Cant wait for the prem team fans to start moaning about the access route to lutons away end you just know its coming especially from liverpool fans. happy for luton to reach the premership im sure they will upset the odds on occasions next season.

Not play offs but Everton yet again managed to avoid the drop-Leeds,Leicester and Saints it will be. Wanted Everton to go down, not because of any dislike of them but never been to Goodison and next season will probably be the last chance. Such is life.

Greenskin wrote:

Not play offs but Everton yet again managed to avoid the drop-Leeds,Leicester and Saints it will be. Wanted Everton to go down, not because of any dislike of them but never been to Goodison and next season will probably be the last chance. Such is life.

i would have preferred Everton to go down over Leicester in truth but never mind, their luck will run out soon such a basket case of a club is Everton. I am looking forward to an away trip to Southampton and possibly Leeds pending on when it is.

may aswell invest in reopening the airport at Plymouth and buy a plane with all these long trips up north next season.

Angry wrote:

Greenskin wrote:

Not play offs but Everton yet again managed to avoid the drop-Leeds,Leicester and Saints it will be. Wanted Everton to go down, not because of any dislike of them but never been to Goodison and next season will probably be the last chance. Such is life.

i would have preferred Everton to go down over Leicester in truth but never mind, their luck will run out soon such a basket case of a club is Everton.  I am looking forward to an away trip to Southampton and possibly Leeds pending on when it is.

may aswell invest in reopening the airport at Plymouth and buy a plane with all these long trips up north next season.

We can’t sort out a project getting rid of a 100 chopped up trees let alone mobilise the airport!

I’ve been a bit underwhelmed with these finals so far hope tomorrow’s is worth watching

Graiser wrote:

Angry wrote:

Greenskin wrote:

Not play offs but Everton yet again managed to avoid the drop-Leeds,Leicester and Saints it will be. Wanted Everton to go down, not because of any dislike of them but never been to Goodison and next season will probably be the last chance. Such is life.

i would have preferred Everton to go down over Leicester in truth but never mind, their luck will run out soon such a basket case of a club is Everton.  I am looking forward to an away trip to Southampton and possibly Leeds pending on when it is.

may aswell invest in reopening the airport at Plymouth and buy a plane with all these long trips up north next season.

We can’t sort out a project getting rid of a 100 chopped up trees let alone mobilise the airport!

those pesky tree lovers and nestling pigeons are holding up their removal oh and tudor evans being incompetant as ever so they will still be there come next year.

Argyle have won a cup final at Wembley!

Represented by Bickliegh Down School, well done lads

Graiser wrote:

Argyle have won a cup final at Wembley!

Represented by Bickliegh Down School, well done lads

at least the fans there had somethig to cheer at least. Another extra time final pending, Barnsley been down to 10 men most of the 2nd half and still wednesday cant break them down.

Wednesday are up with literally the last kick off the game in extra time..,.

seeing as it was between us and them all season till ipswich hit form to make it a 3 way dance it seems fitting they join us back in the championship. The media will be very happy as they dont seem to like mentioning we won the league when they want to talk about wednesday and ipswich.

The table doesn’t lie, hard luck to Barnsley though that must have been a real gutter

Graiser wrote:

The table doesn’t lie,

Actually, it does...

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Proof we were 'lucky'.

Rickler wrote:

Graiser wrote:

The table doesn’t lie,

Actually, it does...

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Proof we were 'lucky'.

stats mats they matter not where it matters reality

Rickler wrote:

Graiser wrote:

The table doesn’t lie,

Actually, it does...

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Proof we were 'lucky'.

The one statistic that really counts is the points.

Argyle 101pts
Ipswich 98 pts
Wednesday 96 Pts

Quote stats as much as you like but it’s points on the board that count or did we not win the L1 ?

Graiser wrote:

Rickler wrote:

Graiser wrote:

The table doesn’t lie,

Actually, it does...

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Proof we were 'lucky'.

The one statistic that really counts is the points.

Argyle 101pts
Ipswich 98 pts
Wednesday 96 Pts

Quote stats as much as you like but it’s points on the board that count or did we not win the L1 ?

been top for the majority of the season aswell respect on our name is lacking.

Well done Owls! Only right and proper that Sheff Wed are promoted. Anything else would have been a travesty after finishing on 96 points.

Graiser wrote:

Rickler wrote:

Graiser wrote:

The table doesn’t lie,

Actually, it does...

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Proof we were 'lucky'.

The one statistic that really counts is the points.

Argyle 101pts
Ipswich 98 pts
Wednesday 96 Pts

Quote stats as much as you like but it’s points on the board that count or did we not win the L1 ?

You are absolutely right. It is points on the board that count and we did win L1.

However... Looking beyond the obvious. We were 'lucky'. XG proves that fact. ..and it is statisticaly a fact.

Most people don't realize how much 'luck' plays in football.

The Expected goals philosohy by James Tippett is an excellent book on the subject. Essential reading really, for the the modern day football fan. Unless you want to remain a dinosaur?

Rickler wrote:

Graiser wrote:

Rickler wrote:

Graiser wrote:

The table doesn’t lie,

Actually, it does...

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Proof we were 'lucky'.

The one statistic that really counts is the points.

Argyle 101pts
Ipswich 98 pts
Wednesday 96 Pts

Quote stats as much as you like but it’s points on the board that count or did we not win the L1 ?

You are absolutely right.  It is points on the board that count and we did win L1.  

However...  Looking beyond the obvious.  We were 'lucky'.  XG proves that fact.  ..and it is statisticaly a fact.  

Most people don't realize how much 'luck' plays in football.

The Expected goals philosohy by James Tippett is an excellent book on the subject.  Essential reading really, for the the modern day football fan.  Unless you want to remain a  dinosaur?

I think I prefer to remain a dinosaur and rely on Schumacher and his team to use stats to sign players (which so far they’ve been pretty good at) and to utilise those players to play the beautiful and successful football they’ve played this season to become champions

Graiser wrote:

I think I prefer to remain a dinosaur and rely on Schumacher and his team to use stats to sign players (which so far they’ve been pretty good at) and to utilise those players to play the beautiful and successful football they’ve played this season to become champions

But XG is one of the major stats being used to sign those players and play that champion football.

...and talking of signings. The day is coming fast when sometimes the poaching/signing of a clubs data anylyst, will be a bigger coup and bring greater reward, than the signing of one of their good players.

PS. Sorry. I wasn't meaning you are a dinosaur. But a lot of fans are.

So how do statistics/data work when it comes to measuring the impact of a strong collective spirit or a players character, both on the field and in the dressing room, in influencing the culture of a team? For instance are the motivational qualities of a Dan Scarr, Wotton or Bradley measurable in any way? There was nothing lucky about the number of times that Argyle showed the bloody mindedness to pull results out of the fire in the games at Shrewsbury, Morecambe, Ipswich etc-that was a tribute to the ability of the team to keep going and overcome adversity and the only possible measurement of that ability in the final analysis is the number of points gained from those situations.For me,stats and data can only ever be part of the overall picture-not saying that they aren't important but certainly not the be all and end all.

Greenskin wrote:

So how do statistics/data work when it comes to measuring the impact of a strong collective spirit or a players character, both on the field and in the dressing room, in influencing the culture of a team? For instance are the motivational qualities of a Dan Scarr, Wotton or Bradley measurable in any way? There was nothing lucky about the number of times that Argyle showed the bloody mindedness to pull results out of the fire in the games at Shrewsbury, Morecambe, Ipswich etc-that was a tribute to the ability of the team to keep going and overcome adversity and the only possible measurement of that ability in the final analysis is the number of points gained from those situations.For me,stats and data can only ever be part of the overall picture-not saying that they aren't important but certainly not the be all and end all.

The short answer, is that you combine the two.

Using data should never simply replace the due diligence we do on any potential signing, in terms of their character etc.

But there are two teams that have used this philosophy way more than the other 90. Brentford and Brighton. If ever there was an example of a system that we should attempt to copy - albeit to a lesser extent, then there it is.

Czarcasm wrote:

Greenskin wrote:

So how do statistics/data work when it comes to measuring the impact of a strong collective spirit or a players character, both on the field and in the dressing room, in influencing the culture of a team? For instance are the motivational qualities of a Dan Scarr, Wotton or Bradley measurable in any way? There was nothing lucky about the number of times that Argyle showed the bloody mindedness to pull results out of the fire in the games at Shrewsbury, Morecambe, Ipswich etc-that was a tribute to the ability of the team to keep going and overcome adversity and the only possible measurement of that ability in the final analysis is the number of points gained from those situations.For me,stats and data can only ever be part of the overall picture-not saying that they aren't important but certainly not the be all and end all.

The short answer, is that you combine the two.

Using data should never simply replace the due diligence we do on any potential signing, in terms of their character etc.

But there are two teams that have used this philosophy way more than the other 90. Brentford and Brighton. If ever there was an example of a system that we should attempt to copy - albeit to a lesser extent, then there it is.

Couldnt agree with you more. the two must be used together for the greater good.

Good to see Schuey providing the punditry on ITV's EFL highlights of yesterday's final.