James Brent on Spotlight Tonight

Don't think it will. The club will trundle along in lower league mediocrity for a while. The gates will drop to 4k and the flag wavers will blame apathetic janners, when the real culprit will be staring them in the face every morning, in the mirror.

Good interveiw, with realistic targets, finishing the grandstand and if were still in the league next season putting up a promotion challenge.

He's a realist, which i like, he's not promising the earth or coming out with crappy five year plans, just saying what realisticly is capable of achieving within a sustainable budget.

I dont want an owner who says he's ploughing millions into the club, but leaves the club liable for the debts, i want an owner who is going to run the club within its means, the way any business should be run. If that means L1/L2 football then so be it, at least i'll have a club to support.

Be very grateful

At least I'll still have my Argo ................. ffs !

Tringreen wrote:

Be very grateful

At least I'll still have my Argo ................. ffs !

You are very criticle of people tring, but what exactly are you looking for in an owner, you quite happily slag off Brent and co, so share with everyone what you want from an owner at the club.

And for someone that rarely reads my posts you seem to respond alot!

125+1 wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

Be very grateful

At least I'll still have my Argo ................. ffs !

You are very criticle of people tring, but what exactly are you looking for in an owner, you quite happily slag off Brent and co, so share with everyone what you want from an owner at the club.

And for someone that rarely reads my posts you seem to respond alot!

Sorry dear boy but I've had enough of you today.

Tringreen wrote:

125+1 wrote:

Tringreen wrote:

Be very grateful

At least I'll still have my Argo ................. ffs !

You are very criticle of people tring, but what exactly are you looking for in an owner, you quite happily slag off Brent and co, so share with everyone what you want from an owner at the club.

And for someone that rarely reads my posts you seem to respond alot!

Sorry dear boy but I've had enough of you today.

Exactly easier to critisize than give an answer, sums you up completly

125+1 wrote:

If that means L1/L2 football then so be it, at least i'll have a club to support.

As long as you've got Argo to support at a crap level that's all right then. So you would happily deny those fans who aren't small time thinkers seeing the club playing at a proper level i.e. Championship level minimum just as long as your beloved brent stays at Argyle. It's the same as under *****wallet - some fans ended up supporting the chairman more than the club.

...Freathy, what is your realistic alternative and how do you think we should move it forward.

...Tring, taking a leaf out of the Presidents book and not answering questions

shonbo wrote:

...Freathy, what is your realistic alternative and how do you think we should move it forward.

...Tring, taking a leaf out of the Presidents book and not answering questions

You wont get a realistic answer because freathy thinks a sugar daddy is out there waiting.

He and tring just critisize but ask them a question what they see as a realistic option other then brent, and all you get is aviva this aviva that.

Freathy wrote:

125+1 wrote:

If that means L1/L2 football then so be it, at least i'll have a club to support.

As long as you've got Argo to support at a crap level that's all right then. So you would happily deny those fans who aren't small time thinkers seeing the club playing at a proper level i.e. Championship level minimum just as long as your beloved brent stays at Argyle. It's the same as under *****wallet - some fans ended up supporting the chairman more than the club.

Beloved Brent!!!, you talk some shite sometimes, how many years out of Argyle's history have we been in the top two of the football pyramid. That say something in itself.

Denying those fans that think bigger - what a load of tripe, its easy to sit behind a keyboard, banging on we should be here and we should be there, but it takes time and money to progress up the leagues, your not prepared to give the current owner time and you havent got the money to do it yourself, so if you know a sugar daddy who wan ts a football club, surely you should have passed them onto the administrator.

It seems some people dont learn from lessons of old.

Brent makes it quite clear his ambitions to get the club into the championship, and also making it quite clear that when he does if the clubs wants to progress into the prem league he probably isnt the right owner.

He's telling the truth and being realistic freathy, you seem very removed from reality.

125+1 wrote:

Beloved Brent!!!, you talk some shite sometimes, how many years out of Argyle's history have we been in the top two of the football pyramid. That say something in itself.

Denying those fans that think bigger - what a load of tripe, its easy to sit behind a keyboard, banging on we should be here and we should be there, but it takes time and money to progress up the leagues, your not prepared to give the current owner time and you havent got the money to do it yourself, so if you know a sugar daddy who wan ts a football club, surely you should have passed them onto the administrator.

It seems some people dont learn from lessons of old.

Brent makes it quite clear his ambitions to get the club into the championship, and also making it quite clear that when he does if the clubs wants to progress into the prem league he probably isnt the right owner.

He's telling the truth and being realistic freathy, you seem very removed from reality.

I think you'll find we've been in the second tier at least as long as we've been in the bottom two, if not longer. And if brent isn't the man to take us to the top flight then he must immediately start looking to sell the club.

And you don't know there isn't a proper investor out there who would invest in Argyle if the club was marketed properly anymore than I know there is.

How many clubs these days haven't got a sugar daddy? Most, if not all, are running at a loss and rely on outside money to keep them going.

Brent's not a football fan and was, by his own admission a less than enthusiastic bidder for the club- he was/is interested in the property aspect.

His talk of "sustainability" and "living within our means" is setting out his agenda for the club (he's not going to throw money at it) and as such is condemning Argyle to struggle along in the lowere leagues while he's in control.


At least the Heaney/BIL bid was upfront in saying they had no interest in the football side of things and would have dumped it to anyone interested.


If Brent's not going to put his had in his pocket (as club owners have done for generations) perhaps it would be better if he stood aside for someone who wants to truly support the club.

But they would have to take on the debt burden that wasn't cleared when the club came out of Administration.

Calling people Avivas because they don't sing the tune of the disaffected is insulting. There are plenty of people out there who are not sucking up to Brent but should be allowed to be grateful for his intervention when somebody was needed. It is the easiest thing in the world to expect somebody else to put their money into a football club when not having any of ones own. From what I can gather on here a number of people want somebody to provide them with their Saturday entertainment who won't be bothered to go themselves until they do. If there was somebody out there who was looking to chuck some money at Argyle then they kept pretty quiet about it.

I don't see anyone actually wanting Argyle to be languishing in the lower reaches. Everyone without exception wants them back up the leagues to where most seem to think we belong. As I see it that is what Brent also wants as he has said it often enough. If he doesn't have the dosh to put us there right away that seems to be not good enough so he should of course sell up immediately. To whom exactly? I would rather have an Argyle in league one or two than have nothing. It does not mean I want them to be there and not higher. There is nothing wrong with that and it does not lack ambition in the slightest. I don't have the money to make it happen so all I can do for my part is to pay up and attend with a hope it will happen as a result of me and some thousands of others doing the same. Football isn't like other entertainment despite it being likened to it. A film you go and see once generally or even twice if you thought it was really good. Football support is more than that and you know you are not going to be royally entertained week on week every time. It gets into you and that's why most supporters keep going back and may I add stick with it.

Sensiblegreeny wrote:

Calling people Avivas because they don't sing the tune of the disaffected is insulting. There are plenty of people out there who are not sucking up to Brent but should be allowed to be grateful for his intervention when somebody was needed. It is the easiest thing in the world to expect somebody else to put their money into a football club when not having any of ones own. From what I can gather on here a number of people want somebody to provide them with their Saturday entertainment who won't be bothered to go themselves until they do. If there was somebody out there who was looking to chuck some money at Argyle then they kept pretty quiet about it.

I don't see anyone actually wanting Argyle to be languishing in the lower reaches. Everyone without exception wants them back up the leagues to where most seem to think we belong. As I see it that is what Brent also wants as he has said it often enough. If he doesn't have the dosh to put us there right away that seems to be not good enough so he should of course sell up immediately. To whom exactly? I would rather have an Argyle in league one or two than have nothing. It does not mean I want them to be there and not higher. There is nothing wrong with that and it does not lack ambition in the slightest. I don't have the money to make it happen so all I can do for my part is to pay up and attend with a hope it will happen as a result of me and some thousands of others doing the same. Football isn't like other entertainment despite it being likened to it. A film you go and see once generally or even twice if you thought it was really good. Football support is more than that and you know you are not going to be royally entertained week on week every time. It gets into you and that's why most supporters keep going back and may I add stick with it.

SG, can I ask where your definition of being a football fan came from, is that a personal view? - My personal definition of a football fan is someone that enjoys watching football and enjoys watching their club win.

I would also be interested if anyone can provide the name of any FL club that survives on gate income alone?

It's not the only exclusive definition but it is how I personally feel. You are right that very few clubs are sustained on gate receipts. The vast majority run at a loss each season and if the encumbent in the chair is happy and has the money to sustain that then fair enough. Stop wanting to or having the cash then the club is potentially in trouble which is what we are seeing time and again in the football league. Most people believe one or more clubs will go to the wall eventually. I don't want to see Argyle being one of them and Argyle is my Saturday fix. Of course I want to see great football even more than good. Of course I want to see a winning side who is either being promoted or vying for it. But, I am also a realist who knows this is not always going to be the case and Argyle is fixed in my blood now which makes it for me different from other entertainment media.

SG, I would suggest that if the club is forced to survive on gate income alone, as per Brent's plan, then going to the wall will be exactly what will happen and you will not have a FL club to support. I base that on the fact that there isn't a single club in the FL that is self financed on football alone and this is the major concern of most that are posting on this thread.

Was it Morecombe who posted a profit for last season of £38k? I didn't say that clubs survive solely on gate receipts. There are all other commercial aspects to consider also. The wage cap in this league is based on 55% of club turnover rather than simply gate money. I'm not here to defend Brent and am neither a fan of or a detractor of the man. I cannot however see where he has lied or mislead up to now. The supporters of Argyle always knew there was developement being part of any deal we would get. He is talking about the grandstand and facilities incoporated which would generate funds for the football club. He therefore knows it isn't just gate receipts. I keep seeing questions like "how much money did he shell out for Argyle". What business is that of anyone else? We are not entitled to know and anyone who thinks we are is deluded. Where are all these other mega buck people who are ready to fund our rise up the leagues? I've not heard of any so far.

Whether we like it or not, Brent is who we have. He seems to have the club at heart even if he isn't going to bung his fortune at it. Well I and loads of others aren't going to bung a fortune at it either so it isn't exactly something I can criticise him for. Just because he has money does not mean he has to spend it all or risk it all on you and me to keep us happy on a Saturday. People keep talking about football clubs overstretching themselves and spending money they don't have and this being a dangerous thing which will bite their ass one day. Then in turn expect their own club to do exactly that. Where is the commonsense in that is all I would ask?

Sensiblegreeny wrote:

........I keep seeing questions like "how much money did he shell out for Argyle". What business is that of anyone else? We are not entitled to know and anyone who thinks we are is deluded. Where are all these other mega buck people who are ready to fund our rise up the leagues? I've not heard of any so far.
..........

SG, I agree with most of what you have to say except for this. You give a good reason why being a football fan is different. I'd say that owning a football club is different from owning anything else. The fans ought to be told what Brent is spending (and, maybe, in future, earning) on the club. After all, it was he who has stated several times that his policy was to run the club with open-ness & integrity.

Yes you're right SG, it is still very early days but I don't think Brent has done himself any favours by announcing such a plan without the detail that should have gone with it, it was always going to raise an eyebrow or two.

I am not as accepting as you SG, I have seen little to make me believe that Brent has the club at heart other then the odd picture with him wearing a scarf.

We are understandably, a cynical bunch. We question and we comment as any fan that really cares should and I believe that if enough of us ask questions and publicise our views it may just sway those that have the powers and may even help to prevent the issues that we have experienced over the past few years.

BTW we made nearly a million £ profit a few years ago so I'm wrong, it can be done, unfortunately what followed that remarkable profit will be placed in the darkest days of our history. If only questions were asked at the time, who knows, we maybe a Premier club today instead of fighting this torturous relegation battle to stay in the FL.

Didn't sections of the crowd start chants of "where's the money gone" only to be slammed and ridiculed on pbay as being ungrateful and then a list of excuses came out as to where the money went.

We were royally shafted back when Ollie's team was ripped apart and unless something drastic happens we've been shafted again.

Brent was a reluctant buyer from day one, yet if the club had been marketed properly and this there is no alternative crap had been ignored we may well be in a better position. No league club has gone out of business in years, somebody always comes in and buys them.

The club should have been marketed properly from the off. Instead we had Heaney chased out of the club, Buttivant (sp?) chased away and were left with James "gentleman, i'll only bid as a last resort" Brent. How many other unknown bidders were put off by the dogs being unleashed that we don't know about?

125+1 wrote:

shonbo wrote:

...Freathy, what is your realistic alternative and how do you think we should move it forward.

...Tring, taking a leaf out of the Presidents book and not answering questions

You wont get a realistic answer because freathy thinks a sugar daddy is out there waiting.

He and tring just critisize but ask them a question what they see as a realistic option other then brent, and all you get is aviva this aviva that.

I think the question has been answered on my behalf. I'm fed up [along with Greenskin still, on the farm] repeating myself. I get called a one trick pony and banned !

In brief, Stapleton and co got greedy. Wouldn't seek out a football interested buyer when it was obvious that the board was outclassed financially in running a 2nd tier club with no history and no resultant fanbase. Norwich, Ipswich and Southampton all have 20 k solid fanbases, even in the lower leagues for one reason only, they've all had extended top flight football. Our gates were at least on a par with theirs prior to their lift off in the 60's/70's.
I remember well, both Stapes and Newell blaming apathetic janners
When we were first promoted or shortly after, was the time to look for a football interested buyer with an eye for potential. They claimed to be fans but they got greedy and wouldn't even listen to offers of help[ the consortium] until it was far too late. Even then they brought in greedy toads more interested in property, like themselves.
As has been pointed out, Guilfoyle admitted the club hadn't been marketed because the Heaney carve up was already in place.

This club of ours will return to the second tier one day and Brent is on record as saying that then will be the time to pass on the baton. Gates will once again be in the mid to high teens and once the city sees real financial investment they will turn out in their thousands, as they would have done last time. Jeeeeez ! even I'd go !
It was hell, turning up to stare at planes with the Avivas, when it was obvious what was coming next. Even I didn't think it would be this bad though.
It remains to be seen whether Brent will be true to his word or whether he will be long gone.
Transparency, transparency, transparency........................... the only way to inspire the people.
Thought control and pretend inclusivity doesn't work with normal people but then Brent probably thinks he's dealing with passionate morons like their self promoting 'leaders' ?

Peter Jones had the club sussed back in 2007, when he and I used to fight the same corner on the farm. He wasn't listened to either.Came in for a lot of stick if I remember correctly.

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Just listening on the radio re the tragic death of the Times reporter in Syria and the the last tribute to her was, ' Free press is the enemy of tyranny everywhere'.

I really dont understand some supporters constant acceptance of mediocrity or worse, utter crap. Are Man Utd or Arsenal supporters happy just to have a club to support?, of course they're not, they demand success and rightly so, as do Pompey, Leeds, Wolves, Bolton and many others (take a look at their attendances when they aren't doing so well outside of the top flight).

Whilst we'll never be a Man Utd or Arsenal, we're certainly no Accrington Stanley or Stevenage (currently 6th, yes sixth, in League 1), no disrespect intended towards those 2 clubs but they're minnows in comparison to PAFC. There's absolutely no reason we shouldn't be demanding 2nd tier football at a minimum. If Brenty isn't prepared to finance a return then we really dont need him, we might as well have our democratically elected Trust run the club.

I fully expect to survive this season and expect nothing less than a promotion challenge next season, whether that be automatic or play-offs, aiming for the top 7 shouldn't be beyond us. I dont expect to see another season of struggle with an inexperienced manager and mostly inexperienced backroom staff still cutting their teeth. Please dont bore me with salary caps, the same rules and work-arounds apply to all in this league.

I agree with you, Cox, except for your comment about us never being a Man U or Arsenal. Why not? A far more important question is whether we would want to be. My answer is that my interest in the prima donna glitz, tantrums, double-speak, money-driven, cynical, thuggish, unprincipled world that is currently premiership football is precisely nil. I'd both be pleased and disappointed to see Argyle take its place amongst all that.

The points of interest in that interviews seem to be...

Very little, if any, money has been spent on the club.

Financing the club will be via commercial activities following the building of the new grandstand. - Who pays for the building of the stand? - Will loans provide the financing? - Will the Trust be liable for 20% of a loan should the club default? etc.

Brent views the breaking of the wage cap as cheating. - No rules are broken by offering a large signing on deal James, therefore it would not be cheating.

A good job of selling the standard of football and stadiums in the Conference from someone that confesses to knowing little about football.


Very few answers to a great many questions.

Agree with Coxside Green. The obstacles faced this season have been well documented and Fletcher is defended left right and centre because of the poor start to the season and the fact that he has not had long with the squad. WHEN we stay up this year, I would expect team strengthening to take place straight away with a view to gaining promotion next season.

If we see one or two squad players brought in on loan or an exodus of our better players replaced with cheaper but lesser players, then it will be clear that Mr Brent doesn't care what division Argyle are in. There is no reason whatsoever why we shouldn't be challenging next season, which in turn would see a big rise in attendances. If 6,000 are happy to turn up week in week out to see us struggling, then I reckon 10,000 would turn up week in week out if we were promotion contenders.

This is what I hope Brent realises, not being a football fan, that there are people grateful to have a team to support every week, however piss poor that team is, but there are many more who might have something better to chuck £30-£40 every week, and if this makes them glory hunters or plastics or whatever, then so be it.

It would only take a decent start to the season for many stayaways to get their scarves on again and turning up regularly. A bit of investment in players and facilities should pay for itself in no time. What would be fatal is if the "We're only 2 players short of a decent team" brigade still have Brent's ear, leaving us back at square one. Hopefully someone will be honest with him and explain that Robbie Williams, Luke Daley and Durrell Berry aren't going to be good enough when our current loan signings have gone back.