Isolated Plymouth

akagreengull wrote:

Angry wrote:

VillageGreen wrote:

zyph wrote:

Railway can be washed away to the outside world.

City of a quarter of a million have to depend on Exeter or Newquay for air flight.

Motorways...you must be joking.....not allowed.

How has Plymouth ever attracted employment...that's why so many moved to London.

Ok if you want to sail to Spain.

You are not wrong there.

A new name for Plymouth would be "the place that time forgot", apt considering. The city is so far behind the other major UK cities, it is embarrassing.

Plymouth has a lot to offer and if it had a council that really wanted to put the city well and truly on the world map, they could unlock so much.

Still, there is always 2020 ?.

Exeter is miles ahead of where Plymouth should be.

You mean Exeter is getting an IKEA?

that is number 4 in the list yes lol

but in truth, there city centre is a mix of brand shops and independents and not full of empty spaces, student flats or coffee shops.

not to mention 4 train stations, a motorway, a airport and a council that wants exeter to succeed while also having a university and college too.

I think you'll find Exeter has more than it's fair share of city centre shopping problems. Some of the new precinct shops have had big problems, and has anyone pootled down Fore St past the the Turks Head toward the river lately?. Nothing like it used to be, with most of the best local retail outlets long gone. And even the tragic fire in cathedral square.

beesrus wrote:

I think you'll find Exeter has more than it's fair share of city centre shopping problems. Some of the new precinct shops have had big problems, and has anyone pootled down Fore St past the the Turks Head toward the river lately?. Nothing like it used to be, with most of the best local retail outlets long gone. And even the tragic fire in cathedral square.

And yet still head and shoulders better performing than plymouth's.

If people hadn't started leaving Plymouth in 1620....would there be no USA still ?

People didn't leave Plymouth, they were just passing through and tarried a while. Don't know what all the fuss is about. Even the Mayflower steps are fake.

beesrus wrote:

People didn't leave Plymouth, they were just passing through and tarried a while. Don't know what all the fuss is about. Even the Mayflower steps are fake.

if only the americans knew the truth as to what happend to the original ones lol.

I told a couple who asked me to take their photo by the steps a year back who hailed from norwalk Ohio when they were all giddy about seeing the steps their ancestors walked on that if they wanted to do that then the missus needs to go into that pub and use the toilet. THey didnt believe me till a passer by backed me up. Horrified was the look on their faces.

beesrus wrote:

I think you'll find Exeter has more than it's fair share of city centre shopping problems. Some of the new precinct shops have had big problems, and has anyone pootled down Fore St past the the Turks Head toward the river lately?. Nothing like it used to be, with most of the best local retail outlets long gone. And even the tragic fire in cathedral square.

.

The Turks Head is actually halfway up the High Street and you couldn't be more wrong about Fore Street, admittedly there are a number of crap pubs down that way but there are also a a large number of independent retail outlets still going strong.

Turks Head has been shut for years (used to work there), Now its some noncey coffee and foody place.

Fore St has the sex shop still,but i think the brothel is long gone, flats now .

Spent a pleasant evening in Exeter last night despite the rain, had a good meal at Carluccios which is the only chain would recommend and certainly handy in London. Then visited the excellent Fat Pig off Fore st and then Tabac bar at Central station which is handily situated above the station platform.
Yes Fore st is still a bastion of independence away from Princesshay, the great draw for me is the Cavern for independent music as is the Phoenix.
For the size of the city Plimuff is a cultural desert musically, unless paying mega bucks in the shithole Pavillions watching mainstream acts is your thing. Shame really because back in the day Plymouth was ahead of the game, the only bastions left are the Underground and Junction for independent acts.

Plymouth the city's place in the world is totally irrelevant to Argyle's standing and our ability to attract players. Pay a competitive wage...do your homework on a player (no Dads with newborn babies from up north - Mum will want her family unit around her) ... and prove the club has a vision and an ambition and they will come.

The only way to prove the shit location theory would be to match Fleetwoods wage offer. Until then, I will excuse myself for doubting Errington's bollocks...

akagreengull wrote:

For the size of the city Plimuff is a cultural desert

You won't get any arguments from me there AKA. I travel to Totnes on a very frequent basis to get some decent input/entertainment, and yes, the Phoenix is a cracking art centre. What ever happened to that new art centre Brent was going to build along with his grand plans for the civic centre ? What a joke he is. all mouth, eyes on the bottom line.
Mind you, knowing football folk as I do, I can't see the cultural offerings of a city having any influence whatsoever over a footballer's decision of where to live and propagate. Their needs are simple, a protein shop and a bit of tail to chase.

Yep Potnes is a welcome relief from corporate Plymouth, nice and near for me , frequently go over get some organic ingredients, enjoy the alternatism of the town, have a stroll down the river, look at some art, have a few bizarre conversations with oddballs in the Bayhorse or the Barrel House yes a nice thing to do.
Getting back to the core issue despite all the issues of geography, family situations - if a player is looking at regular football, decent facilities and a couple of grand more a month they will either stay or move to a club that can provide that.
Agree most players probably don't give a toss about the culture/history of a city/town because of their reasonably short career span, certainly in the lower leagues - pay a decent wage and they will come/stay.
I think that criteria will be tested in any ensuing enticing of Bradley away from the theatre of schemes.
Cheers Beesrus.
BRENT OUT

Damon.Lenszner wrote:

Plymouth the city's place in the world is totally irrelevant to Argyle's standing and our ability to attract players. Pay a competitive wage...do your homework on a player (no Dads with newborn babies from up north - Mum will want her family unit around her) ... and prove the club has a vision and an ambition and they will come.

Naturally however brent doesnt like to spend his cash so players will only ever be offered low ball contracts and injury prone players will snap up any deal we offer cause no one is stupid enough to sign them.

akagreengull wrote:

Spent a pleasant evening in Exeter last night despite the rain, had a good meal at Carluccios which is the only chain would recommend and certainly handy in London. Then visited the excellent Fat Pig off Fore st and then Tabac bar at Central station which is handily situated above the station platform.
Yes Fore st is still a bastion of independence away from Princesshay, the great draw for me is the Cavern for independent music as is the Phoenix.
For the size of the city Plimuff is a cultural desert musically, unless paying mega bucks in the shithole Pavillions watching mainstream acts is your thing. Shame really because back in the day Plymouth was ahead of the game, the only bastions left are the Underground and Junction for independent acts.

don't forget the hub in bath street for decent bands, until its compulsory purchased and knocked down for the 'swanky' boulevard

I have recently been to a few different shopping centres and imo there is not much between them as they are all covered in chains. The main difference would be in appearance, especially with Drakes Circus Mall being the best that Plymouth could come up with, even with a blank canvas.

akagreengull wrote:

Yep Potnes is a welcome relief from corporate Plymouth, nice and near for me , frequently go over get some organic ingredients, enjoy the alternatism of the town, have a stroll down the river, look at some art, have a few bizarre conversations with oddballs in the Bayhorse or the Barrel House yes a nice thing to do.

I was up at the Bay horse last night AKA with a few aforementioned oddballs   for the pub's now annual wassail organised by the landlady. You'd have liked it being a cider buff.
Out we went, up the hill with candlelight to the local community orchard, dark and muddy, a bit of ahem traditional wassail singing, bang a few trees with a stick, steep the trees in cider and blessed them, plenty of mirth, followed by a noisy banging of drums and various items back down to the pub. Excellent mulled cider and the landlady's own apple cake with more organised apple themed group folk singing. I can recommend the Ashridge  pink cider too the next time you're in there. Yet another fine evening in the Bay Horse.
Disappointed with the rail thing. despite all their propaganda of 3.4% price rise, the Devon evening ranger ticket has now been increased 20% !! May well take the bus in future.

Mock Cuncher wrote:

The only way to prove the shit location theory would be to match Fleetwoods wage offer. Until then, I will excuse myself for doubting Errington's bollocks...

What was Fleetwood’s wage offer ?

beesrus wrote:

akagreengull wrote:

Yep Potnes is a welcome relief from corporate Plymouth, nice and near for me , frequently go over get some organic ingredients, enjoy the alternatism of the town, have a stroll down the river, look at some art, have a few bizarre conversations with oddballs in the Bayhorse or the Barrel House yes a nice thing to do.

I was up at the Bay horse last night AKA with a few aforementioned oddballs   for the pub's now annual wassail organised by the landlady. You'd have liked it being a cider buff.
Out we went, up the hill with candlelight to the local community orchard, dark and muddy, a bit of ahem traditional wassail singing, bang a few trees with a stick, steep the trees in cider and blessed them, plenty of mirth, followed by a noisy banging of drums and various items back down to the pub. Excellent mulled cider and the landlady's own apple cake with more organised apple themed group folk singing. I can recommend the Ashridge  pink cider too the next time you're in there. Yet another fine evening in the Bay Horse.
Disappointed with the rail thing. despite all their propaganda of 3.4% price rise, the Devon evening ranger ticket has now been increased 20% !! May well take the bus in future.

Sounds a great night , I do enjoy a good wassail - missed that one, but then had a couple in the cider bar last night. Yes a bit of a shock on the Ranger front, all those years of travelling for £3.30 and I was hit with £3.95 on Tues, feckin privatised rail rip off shit, we need to renationalise the network.
By the way there is a very good folk night at the cider bar second Weds of each month, forgot last night and was leaving just as they came in with their instruments.
Drink up thee zider, drink up thee zider..............

I shall be attempting to get to the Cider bar on Saturday afnoon, probs via Teignmouth.

PatDunne wrote:

akagreengull wrote:

Spent a pleasant evening in Exeter last night despite the rain, had a good meal at Carluccios which is the only chain would recommend and certainly handy in London. Then visited the excellent Fat Pig off Fore st and then Tabac bar at Central station which is handily situated above the station platform.
Yes Fore st is still a bastion of independence away from Princesshay, the great draw for me is the Cavern for independent music as is the Phoenix.
For the size of the city Plimuff is a cultural desert musically, unless paying mega bucks in the shithole Pavillions watching mainstream acts is your thing. Shame really because back in the day Plymouth was ahead of the game, the only bastions left are the Underground and Junction for independent acts.

don't forget the hub in bath street for decent bands, until its compulsory purchased and knocked down for the 'swanky' boulevard

Forgot the Hub, still haven't got there, although a few people have said it's a good venue, like you say best use it before 'modern Plymouth swallows it up'.

akagreengull wrote:

Angry wrote:

VillageGreen wrote:

zyph wrote:

Railway can be washed away to the outside world.

City of a quarter of a million have to depend on Exeter or Newquay for air flight.

Motorways...you must be joking.....not allowed.

How has Plymouth ever attracted employment...that's why so many moved to London.

Ok if you want to sail to Spain.

You are not wrong there.

A new name for Plymouth would be "the place that time forgot", apt considering. The city is so far behind the other major UK cities, it is embarrassing.

Plymouth has a lot to offer and if it had a council that really wanted to put the city well and truly on the world map, they could unlock so much.

Still, there is always 2020 ?.

Exeter is miles ahead of where Plymouth should be.

You mean Exeter is getting an IKEA?

Plymouth can get a bus station built unlike Exeter.

Agree the proposed Exeter bus station development plans are an absolute disgrace, although the Plymouth Bretonside replacement looks rather inadequate to me, but I don't use it maybe it works fine.
Again another example of land grabbing developers moving in to build more corporate crapshacks. All the people of Exeter wanted was an updated bus station which of course was much needed.

akagreengull wrote:

Agree the proposed Exeter bus station development plans are an absolute disgrace, although the Plymouth Bretonside replacement looks rather inadequate to me, but I don't use it maybe it works fine.
Again another example of land grabbing developers moving in to build more corporate crapshacks. All the people of Exeter wanted was an updated bus station which of course was much needed.

Crapshack is a great word.

beesrus wrote:

Same old nonsense and discussion. Isolation has nothing to do with Diagouraga whatsoever.

Green Bay in Wisconsin is just about as isolated as it gets too, with a population half that of Plymouth. Hasn't done the Packers any harm, being one of the most successful NFL teams in history.
And guess what, they're the only team and club that's "non profit" and publicly owned. There's no deceitful squire there snaffling all the excess cake and dispensing his fake wisdom. It's what's called a community club.

While I would obviously endorse your support for fan-ownership the Green Bay Packers aren't really a fair analogy.

They are one of only 30-odd NFL teams in a country of 350m and as such are insulated from relegation and guaranteed a fair shot at the best players on a rotating basis in a system where a salary cap prevents the biggest clubs in the league from hoarding talent.

Consequently having an NFL team is a licence to print money - the NFL TV contract on its own is £15 billion or so, which IIRC is three times more valuable than the Premier League contract we all marveled at when it was revealed. Unsurprisingly all the NFL franchises are among the very richest sports organisations on the planet - despite the small size of Green Bay its NFL team is listed by Forbes in the top 20 richest sports clubs in the world. (As an aside, these figures are one of the reasons why I'm convinced elite football will eventually make a concerted attempt to emulate the closed shop, abolish relegation and end the terror of a dodgy refereeing decision costing a top club the riches of Croesus).

In the very different world of Association football and the even more different world of English football, where a very large number of professional clubs exist even in small hamlets, factors like geographical isolation really do matter. It's self-evidently not the only factor otherwise clubs wouldn't exist here at all, but it is a very significant handicap to clubs in the far South-West.

It's not solely an issue of absolute geographical distance, but to repeat what I said in the other thread, the deterrent of being perceived to be on the periphery of your industry in a "hick" location with relatively few potential alternative employers nearby. The perception of the town or city itself does influence players to a degree. IIRC The Secret Footballer claimed that at Premier League level Sunderland/the North-East was an area many players would refuse to entertain unless they could get stupid money.